General BMW 330D v FIAT BRAVO MJET 150

[STILO NEWBIE]

Be that 200bhp at the flywheel or the 175bhp it puts down on the road?

Brake / net / crankshaft horsepower (power delivered directly to and measured at the engine's crankshaft)
minus frictional losses in the transmission (bearings, gears, oil drag, windage, etc.), equals
Shaft horsepower (power delivered to and measured at the output shaft of the transmission, when present in the system)
minus frictional losses in the universal joint/s, differential, wheel bearings, tyre and chain, (if present), equals
Effective, True (thp) or commonly referred to as wheel horsepower (whp)

The whole variants of Brake-Shaft-Effective horsepower being directly proportional to the number of pints consumed, the chest development of the female audience and inversely related to the age of the driver..under 25 = 100 power increase. This equation naturally takes no account of the 'Max Power' sticker glued to the back window.

Go for it Aerton...

200BHP was the Bravo and 175BHP was the Stilo.....

 

[Rustbucket]

200BHP was the Bravo and 175BHP was the Stilo.....

Your rip snorting fire eating BMW M3 killing monster with 200Hp at the flywheel is putting about 175Hp down on the road? Usual to lose 10-15% of shaft HP through the transmission..and up to 25% for a 4x4 with complex gearing..

 

[bravo jtdM150]

I dont personally gives a dog ******** about the techinical stuff regarding BHP. A fact is that The M-Jet is used in alfas and vauxhalls and Saabs and when there mapped there quick from what ive seen on you tube they hit 0-60 ranging from 6.5secs-7secs. Remember its a four cylinder not six with another 1100cc's and plus fiat doesnt have a power compatible auto box unlike BMW's,etc.

200bhp from a 2.4JTD isnt bad for 5 cylinders, my friends Golf V5 is a 2.3 and only has 170bhp, im surprised the basic 330d SE only offers 227bhp with six cylinders... but they made up for it when they brought out the 335d ( all be it having two turbos ) with 286bhp and a massive 430 ft lbs.

For the money and it being a solid proven diesel unit the mjet is a great tunable engine ( if a standard 2.4 has 200bhp im sure they can add 100bhp more by adding tuning the software, another turbo or cylinder or both, however fiat can only make a very fast car if they can bring out a nice auto box, theres no doubt the italians have the technology but then theres the question of how much will this fast fiat cost and who would buy it.. when alfa -fiats older brother, are bringing out small-medium sized 240bhp cars like the mito and guiletta and 159.

 

[Punto_Pete]

u say the golf v5 2.3 only has 170bhp, but its a naturally aspirated petrol engine, not diesel.

people are forgetting about torque, after all thats what gives a car its acceleration, not bhp. remember diesels are all about torque, not power, as they don't rev.

 

[bravo jtdM150]

u say the golf v5 2.3 only has 170bhp, but its a naturally aspirated petrol engine, not diesel.

people are forgetting about torque, after all thats what gives a car its acceleration, not bhp. remember diesels are all about torque, not power, as they don't rev.

im just making a point about the 330d only having 227bhp and a 2.4jtd having 200 with 1 less cylinder, ok its not a correct comparison but you know what i mean.

A bravo/punto hgt gets to 60 the same as the 2.3 v5, so im just saying the italians have the technology to compete in this field along with other marques.
Your right about the torque in a diesel but having more bhp does help as i found out with my mapped bravo.

 

[lyubohar]

people are forgetting about torque, after all thats what gives a car its acceleration, not bhp. remember diesels are all about torque, not power, as they don't rev.

That's actually half of the story, you then need to multiply torque to revs, as torque is basically how power the engine produces for a single rotation.

 

[bravo jtdM150]

And its also amazing how a turbine makes a 1.4/1.9 bravo go... same as a 2.3 V5 golf ( and yes i know its a naturally aspirated engine )

 

[STILO NEWBIE]

Your rip snorting fire eating BMW M3 killing monster with 200Hp at the flywheel is putting about 175Hp down on the road? Usual to lose 10-15% of shaft HP through the transmission..and up to 25% for a 4x4 with complex gearing..

huh?? Am I missing something here?
It is TWO cars I talking about there:
Car A: remapped Stilo jtd (175bhp)
Car B: BRAVO 200BHP..........
I was comparing the Bravo 200bhp (at fly wheel) vs standard 330d (227bhp at fly wheel) So where is the M3 and "power at driving wheel" come into play????

 

[bravo jtdM150]

huh?? Am I missing something here?
It is TWO cars I talking about there:
Car A: remapped Stilo jtd (175bhp)
Car B: BRAVO 200BHP..........
I was comparing the Bravo 200bhp (at fly wheel) vs standard 330d (227bhp at fly wheel) So where is the M3 and "power at driving wheel" come into play????

:shrug:

 

[Punto_Pete]

That's actually half of the story, you then need to multiply torque to revs, as torque is basically how power the engine produces for a single rotation.

its not half the story... power is the by-product, or result, of torque at a given engine speed, rpm.

BHP = Torque (ft/lbs) x rpm/5252.

 

[Punto_Pete]

Your right about the torque in a diesel but having more bhp does help as i found out with my mapped bravo.

your remap will have given a very healthly increase in torque, hence the much improved acceleration

 

[bravo jtdM150]

Yes it did and in return my BHP went up aswell to make the engine work better. So yes torque is the main but the BHP increase makes the engine more efficent.

 

[fenton_jd]

The only fiat that could keep with a 330d is the 20vt coupe

come on fiat, give us a new beast to play with.

 

[MJet1986]

Ive been up santa pod good few times now which is prob why i got fecked flywheel but ive beaten my mate in his E39 M5 in my bravo a good few times from 0-60 but after that he was creepy off quickly im sure i got video somewhere. Also to who ever said earlier that a remapped E46 330d will beat a E46 M3 is talking utter ****e! And i know this as BMW's are my professions and drive them regarly.. A non remapped bravo wouldnt do too bad against a standard 330d as u got to put into account transmission loses threw it being rwd and the fact its a much bigger heavy car so i have no doubt my bravo would **** all over one.

 

[bravo jtdM150]

Ive been up santa pod good few times now which is prob why i got fecked flywheel but ive beaten my mate in his E39 M5 in my bravo a good few times from 0-60 but after that he was creepy off quickly im sure i got video somewhere. Also to who ever said earlier that a remapped E46 330d will beat a E46 M3 is talking utter ****e! And i know this as BMW's are my professions and drive them regarly.. A non remapped bravo wouldnt do too bad against a standard 330d as u got to put into account transmission loses threw it being rwd and the fact its a much bigger heavy car so i have no doubt my bravo would **** all over one.

im not defending you entirely but i do argree about the 330d v standard 150 been closer than most people think to 60mph and im sure you 200 plus bhp bravo would give the 330d a right run for its money.

The 335d however is in M3 territory( late 5 secs ) but it has a twin turbo.
The older 330d had 190bhp the new one start off at 225bhp, so in theory a 200+ bhp bravo would be in for a shout ( at least to 120mph ).

 

[lyubohar]

its not half the story... power is the by-product, or result, of torque at a given engine speed, rpm.

BHP = Torque (ft/lbs) x rpm/5252.

Emmm, exactly what I tried to point?

So basically by saying "torque is what makes the power in your car" like you did, you only tell half of the story, as you didn't mention rpm. Please, explain the F1 cars power with torque only

 

[TMC Motorsport]

Ive been up santa pod good few times now which is prob why i got fecked flywheel but ive beaten my mate in his E39 M5 in my bravo a good few times from 0-60 but after that he was creepy off quickly im sure i got video somewhere. Also to who ever said earlier that a remapped E46 330d will beat a E46 M3 is talking utter ****e! And i know this as BMW's are my professions and drive them regarly.. A non remapped bravo wouldnt do too bad against a standard 330d as u got to put into account transmission loses threw it being rwd and the fact its a much bigger heavy car so i have no doubt my bravo would **** all over one.

Actually I didn't ever mention that my 330d was E46 or that it would beat the E46 M3 I said its as quick as it in a straight line and yes I've owned both cars, mine is E93 Cab with 231ps and 520nm standard, its chipped to around 285 and 620-630nm (almost 300NM more than the E46 M3) and I have owned 3 E46 M3s in the last 5 years, they are a fantastic car and very quick but this chipped 330d is every bit as fast as it, the E46 M3 has 343PS but nowhere near the torque.

Quote from web for E46 M3:

Performance figures Power 343 bhp / 256 KW @ 7900 rpm Torque 365 Nm / 269 ft lbs @ 4900 rpm

As far as your Bravo pissing all over the 330d well it might on an E46 330d but the E90 shape 330d runs 520NM standard, I'd like to see that race if you can find a new model 330d and Youtube it. In fact the very latest 330d is now 245ps completely new engine.

I think the problem here is your comparing to the E46 330d which only had 204PS and 110NM less torque than the E90 shape which is an entirely different beast.Especially when chipped.

The point here is this is not really a fair comparison, your comparing a 6cyl 3.0 diesel against a 1.9 4 cyl. No one doubts the 1.9 Mjet is a really good engine with great performance and chipped is outstanding, but it should be compared to other cars of similar engine size like Astra VXR or Renault 2.0 DCi, VW Golf 2.0 TDi 170 etc were a comparison is a fair one in that league of 1.9 or 2.0 diesel or petrol engines then I would agree its probably one of the best performing diesels out there.

 

[bravo jtdM150]

the one i had a go with was a 09 plate .. what ever the bhp was i didnt get left totally behind considering i have a 4cyl 1.9.
Here footage of a E90 330d auto and tell me what the 0-60 was..



now a 190bhp (not 205bhp like my one had) bravo mjet manual ( driver dependant )

 

[TMC Motorsport]

the one i had a go with was a 09 plate .. what ever the bhp was i didnt get left totally behind considering i have a 4cyl 1.9.
Here footage of a E90 330d auto and tell me what the 0-60 was..

YouTube- E90 330d von 0 - 100km/h

Looked around the 5 sec mark to me? Sorry just realized it's in kmh 7 ish??

 

[bravo jtdM150]

yep id agree with that... what would be your time for the bravo( not saying 7.3 sec)
Now a standard bravo mjet like mine would be around 2 seconds off
this bravo has 190bhp and is lurking in that territory of the 330d... i know the bmw would fly off after 100mph but im want to keep it 0-60 or even 0-100 with a mapped mjet.

So to people that have said you would stand a chance even with a mapped bravo... well i reckon thats a bit harsh.