Technical Asthmatic Panda Val d'Isere !!

[Panda Louis]

Hello All,

We've just rebuilt the motor on our 1991 Val d'Isere. Posted a few times with various issues. It had stood, not running, for long time, years ?, before we bought it. It has only 85k kms from new. Anyway we found light corrosion in bore no.1 and the valves corroded. So, it's had all new rings, two new valves and guides, all valves lapped in, light head skim, valve seats, etc. It had never run well since we've had it, never carburated properly, poor tick over, revs didn't fall properly, but at speed it ran O.K. Since the rebuild, and a new, 2nd hand, carb', it now runs better, revs still don't drop properly, but, but, but, it won't pull and won't rev out !! It drives fine, but won't exceed 4000rpm in top. It takes AGES to get to 110kph, 70mph odd, but won't go any faster. We've just changed the vaccum advance and felt sure that this would be the last piece in the puzzle. Alas, no. Still won't rev out. We're at our wits end! The rebuild was properly done, all new parts, bores glaze busted, valves lapped, all new gaskets and seals, but it dosen't pull as it did before, runs better mind, but no top end and pulls slowly from 80ks upwards. Oh, valves clearances checked and two new shims put in, all O.K too.
Any ideas. I can only think ignition timing or carburation ? But could it be summat like tight valve clearances, they're well in tolerance mind, or summat more fundamental, mechanical ? We're at the point of taking it to a garage, but can't think that they'll find anything that we can't ?

So, we've turned to the Forum again. Any help would be massively appreciated. It's a great little car, VERY good original condition, we got it with only 68k Kms on it, no marks on the body, very clean interior, etc. We've had all the roof, lights and bumper bars re-painted, immaculate and it will get a re-spray at some stage. But we can't find why it won't rev out, aaaagh :bang:

Hoping you can help,

Cheers, Tom. ( Louis is my 18 year son, a very good spanner, motorbikes mainly, who re-built the engine )

 

[andyjw0114]

Could it be something daft like a wrong/misrouted/ catching/ pinched throttle cable...or pedal issue....just thinking what could explain revs not dropping & not revving fully. First thought was timing related but overlooked the revs not dropping which would suggest choke/ carb related? If timing was out there'd be over heating or pinking....sounds like all your work is well thought out & executed so maybe something weird from before you started improvements?

 

[Panda Louis]

Morning, apologies, not been on for a few days. First off, many thanks for the replies. Posted this on both bits of the Forum, Tech and General, just in case. Dragon Man suggested I do this. We got the cam belt one tooth out on another 4x4 Panda a few years ago, following an engine change. As soon as it started, it was clear that summat was wrong. Ran very rough. Everything else was O.K, so we rechecked the belt, moved it a tooth and it was fine. This one is very different. After the re-build, it started "1/4 turn" as they say out here. Instantly. Ran smoothly and revved through. We ran it in carefully but it became clear that it wouldn't rev out, didn't pull strongly, etc. It does rev over 4000, revs right through, in neutral and if you blip the throttle while driving. The Vac Advance works and everything "seems" O.K. Baffling really. It doesn't overheat or pink. I'm erring on carburation, but we've tried different carbs and it runs fine, no misfires, nice and smooth, but it lacks pull, torque, ooomph, power !! Thanks for the replies. Cheers Tom

 

[andyjw0114]

Only other thought, along carburation idea, is a blocked silencer or similar..cat?....have heard that baffles can become detached so silencer looks good on outside but exhaust flow can be impeded...effecting performance but only top end if partly blocked?

 

[Panda Louis]

*Hi All,

Sincere apologies, I never got back to the Forum with what happened with our Val d'Yser. The problem was.... a Spark Plug !! Simple as that, and horribly embarrassing !

At our whits end, previous post, I took the car to an "old boy", great mechanic, up in the Medoc. I went with a mate, a very good DIY mechanic who had had and worked his own 4X4. Dropping off his car, we shot off up the long straight in front of the garage. Up to 110ks, but my mate couldn't put his finger on anything either. When we got back to the garage M. Lozes, the Spanner, said straight off, "I'm reckon it's a plug, I could hear it when you set off. I'll check, but I reckon that's it.

It was ! The thing is, it wasn't running on three cylinders, all four were running. Fine at tickover. Accelerated...."O.K" , but just lacked a bit, to go past 110ks The "fluffing" was inaudible inside the car, ( I'm pretty deaf as well, must be said ) and it ran... O.K.

Just goes to show, never overlook the simple stuff. We had tried everything, timing, carbs and jets, coil and leads, the lot. The plugs were in good nick and only had maybe 6000ks on them, not a lot.

Funny thing is, we had nothing but trouble with plugs last year. Louis is a bike spanner and does a lot on the side. My old Yam' Fazer had two plugs break off at the top of the thread, one on fitting, (and they weren't over tightened, it just sheared off at the merest "nipping" in) the other blew apart, leaving the thread in the head, on a motorway in northern Spain. Limped into a tiny local bike shop to be ripped off by a local spanner. Mind, I was pleased he was there, tipped him all the same and was happy to get on my way !! Bad batch, obvs, and I told M&P Accessories and all ! Then; Suzuki RM 125 motor crosser, childs chinese quad, a lawn mower, all with plug problems. Odd. When I was Louis' age, everything ran on Champion N5's and you never had a problem ! We only use good plugs too, NGK's and the like, not "supermarket" stuff.

The Panda ran perfectly all summer, dead chuffed, until some utter dickhead in a truck backed into it, light front end damage. We will now take the opportunity to get it completely re-sprayed. Try and play our cards right viz the insurance !

Many thanks for your earlier suggestions, I'll deffo spend more time here, as of now. We may be able to help others out at some stage...,

Cheers and Bonne Route
Tom and Louis

 

[andyjw0114]

Glad it's sorted...itll be one of those you won't forget...like me not forgetting the misfire I had years ago when I didn't nip up a plug enoughThanks for the update but a real shame about the accident.