Technical 999 limits
- Thread starter KHALooD
- Start date
Currently reading:
Technical 999 limits
Are you taking the........?
As far as I know the 1242 high boost cento brigade are just knocking on the 100bhp door.
smaller engine, bigger car.. 150bhp no chance.
smaller engine, bigger car.. 150bhp no chance.
Peterg
Member
The last place you want to be with 150bhp on tap is in a cheap tin box with next to no safety features.
Pete
Pete
if you have £3000+ you can get it to 130bhp. without turbos.
FACT.
if your interested message me.
FACT.
if your interested message me.
Peterg said:
I'm just waiting for a response now from Dunc and Fro$ty who are both running over 150bhp in their Uno turbos with next to no safety features
Peterg
Member
I have dealt with enough road traffic incidents to make this statement where speed was involved with dire consequences for small mini size vehicles.
Of course it a measured risk you take to speed but I would feel a lot more secure with air bags all around side impact bars in my doors, safety belt pretensioners, the list goes on.
I am sure Matt will tell you about the safety features he installed when he drives at speed.
My comment was made tounge in cheek not as a jibe as this is a friendly forum unlike others where I have seen all out war on some guy who stated he tinted his windows.
Pete
Of course it a measured risk you take to speed but I would feel a lot more secure with air bags all around side impact bars in my doors, safety belt pretensioners, the list goes on.
I am sure Matt will tell you about the safety features he installed when he drives at speed.
My comment was made tounge in cheek not as a jibe as this is a friendly forum unlike others where I have seen all out war on some guy who stated he tinted his windows.
Pete
What do you want to achieve? we can get in excess of 150bhp out of the 999 engine normally aspirated, but you won't be able to afford it. This would be an outright race engine with a characteristcs of a highly tuned 2-stroke engine. Other than for race usage it would be absolutely useless. Other than that it would not live very long with the sort of driving one does on the road because it would be far to fragile.
Realistically you could do this sort of power only with forced induction, but then you are better of getting a 1368cc engine with forced induction, which is much less stressed at the power output you requested.
Realistically you could do this sort of power only with forced induction, but then you are better of getting a 1368cc engine with forced induction, which is much less stressed at the power output you requested.
SuperUno
Member
OK, couple of answers to this one.
a) 100bhp per litre can take some doing so to get 100bhp out of any engine (standard takes some doing) so 150bhp is going to be very hard and expensive.
b) As for saefty features, if i hadn't had the roll cage fitted then i doubt i would be typing away now. I managed to walk away from a 70mph crash, but the car had a roll-cage which bent and i had competitoion seats and harnesses. Without any of these i doubt i would have walked away from the crash.
c) Hi-jacking this thread a bit, you can check out pics of my first stage rally can be seen at http://www.mandh-photography.co.uk/events/Spring2006/spring-stages-52.htm
a) 100bhp per litre can take some doing so to get 100bhp out of any engine (standard takes some doing) so 150bhp is going to be very hard and expensive.
b) As for saefty features, if i hadn't had the roll cage fitted then i doubt i would be typing away now. I managed to walk away from a 70mph crash, but the car had a roll-cage which bent and i had competitoion seats and harnesses. Without any of these i doubt i would have walked away from the crash.
c) Hi-jacking this thread a bit, you can check out pics of my first stage rally can be seen at http://www.mandh-photography.co.uk/events/Spring2006/spring-stages-52.htm
1986Uno45S said:I'm just waiting for a response now from Dunc and Fro$ty who are both running over 150bhp in their Uno turbos with next to no safety features
No safety features?? it does come with seatbelts as standard you know!!!!!
hehe Well all i can say is 150bhp+ in a car as light as an uno is VERY scarey BUT if your a thrill seeker such as myself or damn right crazy like Dunc
then even this aint enough sometimes lol Obviously with such power under the bonnet it boils down to one thing you have to be a responsible driver, roads are there for other road users and should NEVER be used as a race track. Irresponsible and wreckless driving is what kills people. Save it for the pod like me and Dunc
As for this thread well i'd say gettin 150bhp out of a 999cc engine is a task which will be very expensive mate. Better off putting a different engine in altogether such as a Tipo 1.6 if you cant find an uno turbo lump mate.
F R O $ T Y
Last edited:
LuiPoland
New member
- Joined
- Jul 31, 2005
- Messages
- 41
- Points
- 6
it depends what does "999" mean for you.
It is only FIRE engine block with 999cc capacity (with custom : crankshaft, pistons, whole head)
or FIRE block with stock crankshaft, rods and pistons (stock dimensions)
What head do you want to use, modified stock , modyfied stock 16v head or full custom head ?
What fuel do you want to use??
It is only FIRE engine block with 999cc capacity (with custom : crankshaft, pistons, whole head)
or FIRE block with stock crankshaft, rods and pistons (stock dimensions)
What head do you want to use, modified stock , modyfied stock 16v head or full custom head ?
What fuel do you want to use??
smokeme
Established member
-Stock block should be good for over 200bhp
-crank...i'm not sure since i never broke one ...yet
-rods...i've had them snap anywhere between 170-200bhp, mostly rpm related
-pistons...they are very fragile, seem to shatter around 100hp in NA form...i did manage a 162bhp dyno pass once but got a hole in one piston anyway
-head...stock 999cc head will make 150bhp and 7000rpm, mine did bursts to 8500rpm a few times but i don't recomend it. Best option is a 16V head, the next best is a 1108/1242 SPI head or the better punto 75 head if you'll be making custom manifolds anyway
I think oldschool should have some comments on these but these are the limits i found from experience, his could be higher or lower
I do point out that a streetable 999cc engine in NA form will not be making anywhere near 150bhp, it should be hard getting a 100bhp version streetable...read low end torque, you'll need to rev it very high to achieve 150bhp in NA form not to mention the cost in building an engine that'll support that and last more then a season
As you SHOULD know the higher the rpm the lower the torque, in most cases a streetable engine should not have a redline much higher then 7000rpm (with the exception of rotaries and some hondas) so lets take 7k.
so as the formula goes:
HP=150bhp
RPM=7000
Torque=x
Torque=HP*5250/RPM
x=150*5250/7000
x=787500/7000
x=112.5lbft
consider the stock engine has about 55lbft of torque and you'll see just how much work it actually takes to achieve that goal.
If you think you can do it then go for it
-crank...i'm not sure since i never broke one ...yet
-rods...i've had them snap anywhere between 170-200bhp, mostly rpm related
-pistons...they are very fragile, seem to shatter around 100hp in NA form...i did manage a 162bhp dyno pass once but got a hole in one piston anyway
-head...stock 999cc head will make 150bhp and 7000rpm, mine did bursts to 8500rpm a few times but i don't recomend it. Best option is a 16V head, the next best is a 1108/1242 SPI head or the better punto 75 head if you'll be making custom manifolds anyway
I think oldschool should have some comments on these but these are the limits i found from experience, his could be higher or lower
I do point out that a streetable 999cc engine in NA form will not be making anywhere near 150bhp, it should be hard getting a 100bhp version streetable...read low end torque, you'll need to rev it very high to achieve 150bhp in NA form not to mention the cost in building an engine that'll support that and last more then a season
As you SHOULD know the higher the rpm the lower the torque, in most cases a streetable engine should not have a redline much higher then 7000rpm (with the exception of rotaries and some hondas) so lets take 7k.
so as the formula goes:
HP=150bhp
RPM=7000
Torque=x
Torque=HP*5250/RPM
x=150*5250/7000
x=787500/7000
x=112.5lbft
consider the stock engine has about 55lbft of torque and you'll see just how much work it actually takes to achieve that goal.
If you think you can do it then go for it
i said i wanted to know it's limits, i didn't say that i want to reach the 150hp
but all that talking made me think, i'll go for the 16v head soon, till i find a new engine.
another thing, can i fit 4 carbs :slayer: ?? i think they'll make lot of difference. any one did it
but all that talking made me think, i'll go for the 16v head soon, till i find a new engine.
another thing, can i fit 4 carbs :slayer: ?? i think they'll make lot of difference. any one did it
smokeme
Established member
KHALooD said:i said i wanted to know it's limits, i didn't say that i want to reach the 150hp
but all that talking made me think, i'll go for the 16v head soon, till i find a new engine.
another thing, can i fit 4 carbs :slayer: ?? i think they'll make lot of difference. any one did it
I think team pandamonium had 4 carbs fitted at one point and i remember reading somewhere that they actually lost performance because of that setup...not sure if it's true or not.
smokeme said:
Smokeme I wouldn't have to add anything to your post before this one, because you have summed it up.
The Pandamonium had initially Mikuni bike carbs on it, which where a pig to set up. UAD tried a lot to get them sorted but where unable to. When we got it we decided to change over to two Weber 36 downdraughts, which worked much better.
smokeme
Established member
Oldschool said:
I said that because i'm aware you have a broader experience with fire engines then i do, believe it or not i haven't touched one in 8 months
I think i made one large mistake and moved to a 2L 16VT:bang:
Most ITB or multicarb setups are very hard to setup and balance and most of the time are not worth the extra time and money spent.
smokeme said:I said that because i'm aware you have a broader experience with fire engines then i do, believe it or not i haven't touched one in 8 months
I think i made one large mistake and moved to a 2L 16VT:bang:
Most ITB or multicarb setups are very hard to setup and balance and most of the time are not worth the extra time and money spent.
Did you develop an allergy?
smokeme
Established member
Oldschool said:Did you develop an allergy?
Actually i'm still researching on how i should push the 200bhp barrier on the 8V, even though i've moved to the 1242cc engine it's not an easy task getting over 200bhp/1000cc which is my goal for this project.
The thema on the other hand has been 90% finished, someone made me an offer on the engine and i sold it...now i want to make it better then the old one, so i need to break the 600bhp the other could make
go on say it...i'm worse then an idiot
