Technical 1108cc Sisley anyone

[Most Easterly Pandas]

Well assuming we eventually get dads roofless Selecta back, I'll have a spare 1108cc injection engine sitting about.

I've been thinking about putting it into the Sisley (my daily one, not the mints none running, if that makes sense).

I know it will involve wiring looms and ECU etc, but atleast there will be no immbolisers crap involved .

Now then, gearbox should take 1108cc lump shouldn't it?

And one for Selecta techi's (Petel) - I'll be looking at moving most of the wiring loom over from the Selecta, inc wiring for gearbox etc. Although the gearbox wiring etc will not be needed I want to keep wiring loom relativly compleate incase in years to come I want to use it again in another Selecta etc (keeping my options open).

Now am I correct in assuming engine should work fine connected to a manual gearbox, and that electrics will work ok if engine ECU is installed and connected but gearbox ECU isn't?

How would I have to go about installing starter motor as on the Selecta's it's through the gearbox. Think I'd just be able to mount one at the back of engine like the manuals have and link to flywheel

One last question. I'd be planning on fitting without CAT, and installing Lambda into exhaust which should work fine as it's pre-CAT. How will MOT and emmissions be based? Will it pass as it's an 1988 car or will I need to install CAT to say within the 92> emission regs?

It's all far off at the mo, but is an idea I'm coming up with

Jon.

 

[CLXCraig]

Well assuming we eventually get dads roofless Selecta back, I'll have a spare 1108cc injection engine sitting about.

I've been thinking about putting it into the Sisley (my daily one, not the mints none running, if that makes sense).

I know it will involve wiring looms and ECU etc, but atleast there will be no immbolisers crap involved .

Now then, gearbox should take 1108cc lump shouldn't it?

And one for Selecta techi's (Petel) - I'll be looking at moving most of the wiring loom over from the Selecta, inc wiring for gearbox etc. Although the gearbox wiring etc will not be needed I want to keep wiring loom relativly compleate incase in years to come I want to use it again in another Selecta etc (keeping my options open).

Now am I correct in assuming engine should work fine connected to a manual gearbox, and that electrics will work ok if engine ECU is installed and connected but gearbox ECU isn't?

How would I have to go about installing starter motor as on the Selecta's it's through the gearbox. Think I'd just be able to mount one at the back of engine like the manuals have and link to flywheel

One last question. I'd be planning on fitting without CAT, and installing Lambda into exhaust which should work fine as it's pre-CAT. How will MOT and emmissions be based? Will it pass as it's an 1988 car or will I need to install CAT to say within the 92> emission regs?

It's all far off at the mo, but is an idea I'm coming up with

Jon.

Can't help with the ECU/Loom part, but with emmisions, if it's injected i think you will need a CAT. the reason cars were injected was for emmisions reduction and had the cat for it too. doesn't matter how old th3e rest of the car is, but if it's got injected engine i'd expect you'd need a CAT

Sounds like it could be good fun though

 

[Bougainvillea Rosso]

Can't help with the ECU/Loom part, but with emmisions, if it's injected i think you will need a CAT. the reason cars were injected was for emmisions reduction and had the cat for it too. doesn't matter how old th3e rest of the car is, but if it's got injected engine i'd expect you'd need a CAT

Sounds like it could be good fun though

Sylvia has the 1108 engine I believe? (not the 4x4 box though, of course).

 

[CLXCraig]

Sylvia has the 1108 engine I believe? (not the 4x4 box though, of course).

Splutter does, think Sylvia is still on her original 999. It might be easier to find a scrap cinq and take engine from that and use panda ECU. fuel pump might need changing if it isn't electric

 

[Most Easterly Pandas]

Splutter does, think Sylvia is still on her original 999. It might be easier to find a scrap cinq and take engine from that and use panda ECU. fuel pump might need changing if it isn't electric

Oh yes, forgot to add that to list on here. Will probably put and inline one in.

Why will using a cinq engine be easier

 

[panda-sport]

You will not need to fit the cat as the MOT emissions are based on the age of the car not the engine.

You would be best to swop the fuel tanks over rather than fit an inline pump if possible to avoid fuel starvation on low tank (and cheeper as you 'have' the tank). You will also have to uprate/replace the fuel line and add wiring for the pump.

Doh, you can't swop the tank as its a 4x4!!!!!

The engine will bolt upto the sisley gearbox (once you have put on the sisley flywheel and clutch on) and use the sisley starter and 'tin'. Use your sisleys wiring for the starter.

I think it will be a case of try it and see on the engine/gearbox loom as the selecta wount let you start the engine unless its out of gear, may need to fool the ecu?

I'll be more than happy to pop along and have a look once you have all the parts

 

[Chas Uno]

I don't see why you couldn't just swap in the basic 1108 engine and run it off the existing Sisley carb and gearbox? No need to worry about wiring/ ecu's and all that, unless you particularly want EFI? There was a carb'ed version of the 1108 engine that used virtually the same Weber 32TLF carb with some very minor jet changes so no reason why you couldn't use a 999cc carb.

And as Damon says, emission regulations are done by year of the car not the year of the engine. You could put in a Toyota Prius (Pious) engine and would still only be subjected to 1988 regulations

 

[petel]

Hello Jon.
Off the top of the head, I see no reason why you should not run the 1108 with the Selecta's loom in the Sisley if you so wish.

You would need to consider the question of fuel delivery, re-routing or extention of the loom to the starter motor and the inhibiting section of the auto's gear selector switch ( which, if you were to leave it in circuit with Park or Neutral selected, should not be a problem )

Seems like a lot of work but you might wish to contact Jim in NI as he has done this conversion on Sylvia.

Rgds.

 

[JimMagill]

Sylvia and Splutter both use 1108cc engine with very little alterations. Sylvia's came from a panda selecta and splutters came from a cinq. Everything bolted together like mechano and there were no problems fitting anything except you need a electic fuel pump.

There is an inline electric pump fitted and the carb is re jetted

both of which are a lot less work than re doing wiring looms etc, lol

(and they pass emmissons fine

Jim

 

[Most Easterly Pandas]

You will not need to fit the cat as the MOT emissions are based on the age of the car not the engine.

You would be best to swop the fuel tanks over rather than fit an inline pump if possible to avoid fuel starvation on low tank (and cheeper as you 'have' the tank). You will also have to uprate/replace the fuel line and add wiring for the pump.

Doh, you can't swop the tank as its a 4x4!!!!!

The engine will bolt upto the sisley gearbox (once you have put on the sisley flywheel and clutch on) and use the sisley starter and 'tin'. Use your sisleys wiring for the starter.

I think it will be a case of try it and see on the engine/gearbox loom as the selecta wount let you start the engine unless its out of gear, may need to fool the ecu?

I'll be more than happy to pop along and have a look once you have all the parts

Thanks Damon for the offer Might take you up eventually. Good about not needing the CAT as if I did I might have needed to try and get the 'in manifold' type as the Sisley has all the gear rods under the car.

I don't see why you couldn't just swap in the basic 1108 engine and run it off the existing Sisley carb and gearbox? No need to worry about wiring/ ecu's and all that, unless you particularly want EFI? There was a carb'ed version of the 1108 engine that used virtually the same Weber 32TLF carb with some very minor jet changes so no reason why you couldn't use a 999cc carb.

I prefer Injection .

TBH we've not had the best of luck with carbed Panda's (except the 750L). And I'm into auto electronics so fancy a challenge getting it all wired in and running

Also the engine in the Sisley currently is a bit of a state. Still runs fine, but oil pump on the way out I think, and got a blow on the manifold etc

Hello Jon.
Off the top of the head, I see no reason why you should not run the 1108 with the Selecta's loom in the Sisley if you so wish.

You would need to consider the question of fuel delivery, re-routing or extention of the loom to the starter motor and the inhibiting section of the auto's gear selector switch ( which, if you were to leave it in circuit with Park or Neutral selected, should not be a problem )

Seems like a lot of work but you might wish to contact Jim in NI as he has done this conversion on Sylvia.

Rgds.

Thanks Think the started inhibitor is a relay within the Selecta's fuse box, so sorting it out so that it's not a problem could be easier than origionally though. Will be one of the things I'll have to look at.

I've got one main advantage when coming to wiring looms. Out of the two donor 750L's I've had I've removed the wiring looms COMPLEATE!!! Could be good, might want/need to donate and chop one up to add/combine to the wiring looms.

Sylvia and Splutter both use 1108cc engine with very little alterations. Sylvia's came from a panda selecta and splutters came from a cinq. Everything bolted together like mechano and there were no problems fitting anything except you need a electic fuel pump.

There is an inline electric pump fitted and the carb is re jetted

both of which are a lot less work than re doing wiring looms etc, lol

(and they pass emmissons fine

Jim

Yours still electronic injection Jim or carbed


How would I go from changing from injection to Carbed

Thanks for all the replys and helpful tip guys Dad's Selecta will live on in one form or another And I'll then have a nice low mileage engined Sisley.

Jon.

 

[panda-sport]

Good about not needing the CAT as if I did I might have needed to try and get the 'in manifold' type as the Sisley has all the gear rods under the car.

I just happen to have a spare in the garage

Yours still electronic injection Jim or carbed


How would I go from changing from injection to Carbed

Jims are carbed, just fit your sisley inlet manifold on the selecta engine and add a electric fuel pump and regulator(and there would be no need to uprate the fuel line).

 

[Most Easterly Pandas]

That a exhaust manifold you got a spare of Damon? I got one off of the last donor 750L, and think that hopfully the one on dad's Selecta is still intact when I remove the rad that's currently wrapped around it.

So the injectors on the SPI FIRE engines are mechanical then (not operated via electronic solinoids).

 

[CLXCraig]

The butterfly is mechanical. not sure about the bit that squirts the fuel. always wondered how they work

 

[Most Easterly Pandas]

The butterfly is mechanical. not sure about the bit that squirts the fuel. always wondered how they work

Butterfly

 

[panda-sport]

That a exhaust manifold you got a spare of Damon? I got one off of the last donor 750L, and think that hopfully the one on dad's Selecta is still intact when I remove the rad that's currently wrapped around it.

I have a exhaust manifold with downpipe cat and standard 1000cc manifolds
The selecta has a slightly larger bore manifold (as fitted to the punto 75!) but the others will fit.

So the injectors on the SPI FIRE engines are mechanical then (not operated via electronic solinoids).

The SPI's only have one electronic injector (as in single point injection) fitted in the throttle body.
The sisley carb will even bolt onto the selecta inlet manifold instead of the throttle body I believe. Once past the carb/throttle body both engines are basicly the same (bar extra bore, better flowing head etc).

 

[firstcar-Y10]

Butterfly

flap inside the throtle body/carb that regulates the airflow. Take the air filter housing off, look down the hole and wiggle the throttle. It's the bit that moves

 

[Most Easterly Pandas]

flap inside the throtle body/carb that regulates the airflow. Take the air filter housing off, look down the hole and wiggle the throttle. It's the bit that moves

Silly me. Yes, know what a butterfly is now. Just never knew its name

 

[Most Easterly Pandas]

The SPI's only have one electronic injector (as in single point injection) fitted in the throttle body.
The sisley carb will even bolt onto the selecta inlet manifold instead of the throttle body I believe. Once past the carb/throttle body both engines are basicly the same (bar extra bore, better flowing head etc).

So the injector is just how the fuel is delivered into the inlet manifold then compaired to carbs?

On MPI's then, and modern cars, there are injectors on each cylinder directly into the cylinder isn't there

 

[panda-sport]

So the injector is just how the fuel is delivered into the inlet manifold then compaired to carbs?

Yes

On MPI's then, and modern cars, there are injectors on each cylinder directly into the cylinder isn't there

No, thats direct injection. MPI (multi point injection) has one (sometimes two in race engines) injector per inlet tract usualy in the inlet manifold, sometimes in the head before the inlet valve.

 

[Chas Uno]

No, thats direct injection. MPI (multi point injection) has one (sometimes two in race engines) injector per inlet tract usualy in the inlet manifold, sometimes in the head before the inlet valve.

Plus injecting fuel into the inlet tract rather than directly into the cylinder itself gives the fuel a chance to mix more effectively with the air needed prior to combustion and also gives a better 'burn'. This also leads to better fuel efficiency and more power