Technical 1.4 8 valve project Seicento

[soozukisteve]

Once I had the idea in my head,I had to get it swapped asap!!!

I have chopped metal out of the mounting but to honest the pic is at the wrong angle and the alternator pulley/inner wing clearance actually looks tight,but far enough.I havent had any issues yet.

I am using all standard stuff.Everything efi wise is seicento unless I have had no choice but to use gp stuff.
It does feel like a fueling problem but my boss is a wizz at all things efi so I will probably spend this week trying to sort it(I am hoping the students will be off again due to the bad weather-but its starting to clear up a bit here).
I may well have to have a remap but im going to do everything in my power to get around it so that it remains a cost effective and (relatively) easy transplant

Also forgot to mention that I had to extend the cam sensor plug to fit as the sensor is on the opposite side of the cam cover.

.....and please excuse the mucky prints all over the cam cover and pair of tights over the induction pipe!!!

 

[arc]

the cam sensor could be causing the issue, they're sheiled cables and if they're anything like the crank sensor - they get very upset when disturbed!

I need trim a bit more off my mount, but the bloody thing is stuck in the car - and i've done as much as i can with the space i've got to swing the angle grinder in that kinda gap!

 

[purf]

Awesome work!

If it works without a remap - im doing this too

Best of luck getting it running well

Jez

 

[oldskoolmk1unoturbo]

However on road test, i came across a few issues.
At approx 1/3-1/2 throttle at any revs it appears to pull as hard as the 1.1!!
Any more throttle at almost any revs and it feels like its really holding back.I also periodically (when driving or idling) get the efi light coming on or flashing at which time I lose one of the fuel trim live readings on my diagnostic machine!When running normally(no efi light) the fuel trim readings fluctuate massively at idle or driving!
I get the p0300 code (apparently multiple engine misfire!) which I then clear and it stays off for a while.
I couldnt test it all properly as I was on my own while testing so will try to get to the bottom of it all next week when I can rope my boss into coming on a drive with me!
There is still a possibility I may have made a schoolboy error when connecting the loom back up or have a sensor problem.Wherever possibly I have used the sensors from my 1.1 so will have to look into that.

me and a couple of mates fitted a P75 engine into my missus MPI seicento and it does exactly what you have discribed, dont know why it does it

hope you find out why and please post it on the forum when you know how to fix it

 

[fingers99]

I need trim a bit more off my mount, but the bloody thing is stuck in the car - and i've done as much as i can with the space i've got to swing the angle grinder in that kinda gap!

See if you can borrow a die grinder -- you might find you can get the stone in. A dremel-a-like is a possibility, but will take ages!

 

[soozukisteve]

the cam sensor could be causing the issue, they're sheiled cables and if they're anything like the crank sensor - they get very upset when disturbed!

I was cautious with the wiring.I have made sure its not too close to the HT stuff but will try and get it shifted as far as possible away.
Every sensor apart from the cam sensor is from the sei and it ran like a dream with no issues on the 1.1.
Like I said,Im not gonna rule out an obvious schoolboy error yet but wont be able to have a good look until later in the week as the bloody weather has improved and all the students are back in.Grrrrr!!!

 

[J333EVO]

Nice project, fuel pump is fine, it can run upto 5bar as tested by us, the SPi pump will only run to 2.5bar.

Should provide a lot of low down torque with the long stroke 1368cc engine compared to the old unit, should make for a swift effortless car.

 

[soozukisteve]

Nice project, fuel pump is fine, it can run upto 5bar as tested by us, the SPi pump will only run to 2.5bar.

So I imagine it will deal with my engine (capacity wise) fine which is good news.

Should provide a lot of low down torque with the long stroke 1368cc engine compared to the old unit, should make for a swift effortless car.

That was my plan really.Everyone argues about hp figures but in reality (and I intend to use my sei on a daily basis) we use full throttle at high rpm so little on the road(in % terms).If I can crack the running issue I really think it could prove to be a very worthwhile conversion with great bhp/torque per £.
I may look at other options to increase hp in the future but Im sure it will keep me amused for the time being!

 

[soozukisteve]

Not much of an update really as my boss forgot about having a look at it for me!
Had a few things to sort though.Cured a coolant leak(from the o ring on the front metal pipe),got a new flexi exhaust pipe as the old one was blowing slightly, but still not got to the root cause of the running issue.

I have been doing what I can and have observed the following:

When Idling the revs drop slightly every 5-10 seconds.Watching the obd live readings shows that the lowering in revs coincides with a drop in the short term fuel trim!
When driving on a steady throttle the s.t. fuel trim also fluctuates massively (eg -30% to +80%) and you can feel a mild hesitation when it drops.Every so often(under no particular driving condition) the s.t. fuel trim reads 00.00 and the engine code light starts flashing.

I have tried disconnecting sensors and even tried swapping the plugs on my two lambda sensors looking for any improvement but got nowhere!

I havent checked fuel pressure yet but was considering artificially increasing the fuel pressure and seeing if that helps settle the s.t.fuel trim a bit.
Is it even possible to adjust the regulator on the mpi in a similar fashion to the spi.

Any other suggestions are welcome as it looks like its gonna be tuesday before my boss can look at it!:bang:

 

[ycming]

sorry for some silly question,

This is using the sei 1.1 MPi loom and ecu ???

IF so, how did you plug the cam sensor in ?? (i believe the sei didn't come with a cam sensor? could be wrong)

Thanks
Ming

 

[Todger182]

Mine did.

Thanks

 

[fingers99]

s(i believe the sei didn't come with a cam sensor? could be wrong)

MPI Sei has cam sensor and knock sensor (and 2 lambdas).

 

[Todger182]

Although my blue MPI sei which was an 02 model didn't have a cam sensor and only 1 02 sensor in the mani cat.

Thanks

 

[fingers99]

Now that is odd. I've heard of early Mk2 Puntos only having 1 lambda, but never encountered it on a Sei. Mine is 02 and has the lot.

 

[cc1]

Although my blue MPI sei which was an 02 model didn't have a cam sensor and only 1 02 sensor in the mani cat.

Thanks

899cc not mpi??????

 

[fingers99]

899cc not mpi??????

I think that by 02 all Seis were 1108 MPI. The 899 probably couldn't make Euro3 without further work which wouldn't make sense on an engine which cost at least as much to assemble.

 

[soozukisteve]

Yes,I am using the standard sei mpi loom and ecu for the moment.

sorry for some silly question,

This is using the sei 1.1 MPi loom and ecu ???

IF so, how did you plug the cam sensor in ?? (i believe the sei didn't come with a cam sensor? could be wrong)

Thanks
Ming

My mpi sei does come with a cam sensor.Its at the top left of the engine just above the top cambelt cover.
The cam sensor on the gp 1.4 is on the opposite side of the engine,near to where the coil packs sit, so I have had to extend the wires to reach.

Mine is a 2001 model and also has the 2 lambda sensors!

 

[Opelkadett C]

Did you have any progression on your project? I hope you will get your engine running smoothly eventually. I am going to pick up my 1.4 8v lump this weekend.

 

[craigb244]

from what ive been told. the mpi sei even tho (some) have a cam sensor. it does not effect the ignition or fuel timing. it is semi sequential but untimed (same and the punto 75)

your fueling will defiantly need tweaking (bumping up the pressure might help) you need to remember the new engine is over 300cc larger. a massive jump for a small engine.
Id say the afr is lean causing a small misfire/slow burn. This would make the lambda see a rich mixture (unburnt fuel) hence the swinging fuel trim. the ecu obviously detects this as a miss-fire after so much

 

[soozukisteve]

Made some progress this week but been so busy I havent had time to post!
Having put the sei on our diagnostic equipment we found a problematic plug lead.It was swapped for a good one but that didnt fix the fluctuating s.t. fuel trim!
I did mention earlier in the thread about schoolboy errors didnt I???Well....
It looks like I had mixed up the plugs for the two lambda sensors!!!:bang::bang:
I only tried this a little earlier so havent had time to sort out the fault codes and ecu light but will do them 2mo.
It defo feels more lively now.My 'seat of the pants dyno' says its probably around 65-70 bhp which doesnt sound a lot, but the boost in midrange torque makes normal road driving much more interesting.
I will get the obd equipment on it 2mo and go for a drive to check the fuel trims but suspect I wont be hitting anywhere near 100% duty cycle on the injectors.
I think the next steps will be to sort the exhaust and inlet as I feel that these are my restrictive weak links.A good remap will also probably liberate a few hp once its breathing more freely.