Hello FF'ers. This is my first post on your very useful site. I've been a regular reader for a while and found the info and knowledgable indispensable. I've now joined in the hope someone can answer my current problem before I spend a fortune out with money I simply don't have.

My power steering warning light came on a few months ago with the audible warning and with an engine stop/start it seemed to cure itself. About a week later it came back on and remained on. The steering then also reverted to very heavy manual. I also noticed that when I turned right there was a grinding noise, until the car was back to straight again. This only happens above 10mph, as I later drove it in a circle turning constantly to the right to see if I could hear it better.

I checked for a reservoir thinking the fluids had dropped, but of course, this is an electronic car and doesn't have one. Your forums have suggested it to be an voltage issue and potentially down to a dying battery, which has now been replaced and the fault still remains. I have checked internal fuses, all of which are in tact. I HAVEN'T checked the larger fuses in the engine bay (i.e. the grey & black sealed 50Amp+ ones) or any relays (wouldn't know where to begin).

However, I'm curious about the grinding noise to when turned to the right. Has anyone encountered this? Is it a new rack? Is it a cable?? I couldn't see anything obvious when I took the O/S wheel off, but I'm not a mechanic.

Also, as an added bonus, when the new battery was connected and I first turned it over, not only was the good old PS warning light there but also an engine management one too!! :bang:

As my car's in need of an MOT and I know power steering will fail it, will EM also fail it?? The more worrying thing is that the diagnosis port inside the glove box looks like it's been pushed in too far, so fault finding electronically (as well as clearing faults) may not be that simple...

Your thoughts/experience/advice all greatly apppreciated!

oh, it's a 54 plate, 5 door variety.

hi pughga
welcome to FF :wave:

there are only 2 fuses that provide power to the EPS unit... 1x 70Amp 'Maxi' fuse and 1x 15Amp mini blade fuse

both of the fuses are in the grey fuse box in the engine bay on top of your battery. (the one with the relays in it)

the 70Amp is 'F2' and the 15Amp is 'F24'

there are no replaceable relays in the system according to the wiring diagram it all seems to be controlled by the EPS unit and the body computer. check the fuses mentioned above, if that doesn't draw a solution then you will probably have to hook up the OBD software to take a look. one thing you can try, which i know sometimes works on Mk2 Puntos, is remove 70Amp fuse start the engine and refit the fuse with the engine running. theres no saying that this will work only that it works on Puntos it MIGHT work on the stilo.

As for the OBD2 port being 'pushed in too far'... take another look. they are recessed quite deeply on RHD models due to the assembly being installed 'upside down' compared with the LHD models (which is how fiat designed them). I've personally never heard of a damaged OBD port but theres a first time for everything!

your steering light will fail MOT but the MIL on its own won't (unless it relates to something effecting the emissions). You need to get the fault codes read from the engine ecu and come back with the codes that have been read out. the engine codes should be a 'P####' for instance a P0301 which would be a misfire on cyl 1.

hope this helps a little bit. Oh... before i forget here's the wiring diagram for the EPS if you care

Thanks for the reply and welcome.

I presume this is to do with the engine fault?

Out of interest, what would cause these fuses to blow?

Anyone else came across the grinding noise before?? Is it related to the steering failing?

the above info is for your steering light issue...

im a little stumped as to what the grinding could be.

your engine light could be any one or more of a about 800+ faults need to get your codes read

Cheers for clarifying. If it's not a fuse, could it be a motor? The rack clearly works mechnically, just not electronically. Or is it the case of replacing the rack? Complicated? VERY frustrating no Haynes guide and the elearn isn't mac based (would this info even be on there?). By the way, spent over an hour now trying to get the elearn to work on a mac but it doesn't. :bang:

Would the engine fault have anything to do with the batt being dead for a couple of months and a new one being fitted? It wasn't there before and this is simply more cost for me trying to get it fixed to sell. I have the climate control to fix too!! :bang::bang::bang:

Stilo EPS failure is almost unheard of (unlike Puntos) if its not the fuses then it *COULD* be motor but i wouldn't advise blindly swapping parts over until you have a bit more of an idea about where the failure could be. unfortunately for 'amature home mechanics' the electrical systems on more modern cars are becoming more and more advanced and further beyond the scope of the tools buried in most peoples sheds.

where abouts in the country are you there maybe someone local who can help with code read outs.

the racks as far as im aware are usually not problematic either. are you able to describe a little better about the grinding? is it like a graunch or more of a 'sandy' noise? does it sound like its at the wheels or under your feet? does it happen whilst stationary/whilst driving/in a straight line/cornering?

the engine fault it's kind of hard to say if it is battery related or not. its possible its a fault that has happened due to it being stood rather than a battery related fault, and its probably a really easy fix.

im sorry i cant give you any solid answers, but its really hard to diagnose from my sofa without any codes.

richydraper said:

Stilo EPS failure is almost unheard of (unlike Puntos) if its not the fuses then it *COULD* be motor but i wouldn't advise blindly swapping parts over until you have a bit more of an idea about where the failure could be. unfortunately for 'amature home mechanics' the electrical systems on more modern cars are becoming more and more advanced and further beyond the scope of the tools buried in most peoples sheds.

where abouts in the country are you there maybe someone local who can help with code read outs.

the racks as far as im aware are usually not problematic either. are you able to describe a little better about the grinding? is it like a graunch or more of a 'sandy' noise? does it sound like its at the wheels or under your feet? does it happen whilst stationary/whilst driving/in a straight line/cornering?

the engine fault it's kind of hard to say if it is battery related or not. its possible its a fault that has happened due to it being stood rather than a battery related fault, and its probably a really easy fix.

im sorry i cant give you any solid answers, but its really hard to diagnose from my sofa without any codes.

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Appreciate the further advice. How about the motor under the actual cowling?

I'm really trying to avoid paying for fault finding ATM, but if I need to change the motor (which seems to be the only elevtoribc part of the APS) would this affect keys etc etc? £40 to plug it in or £40 to repair and replace something and clear the fault. I'm just really strapped, hence the reason for fixing to sell. :^S

Oh the grinding is a grrrrrrunching noise, constant if turning to the right at speeds above 10mph. If straight, reverse or to the left there's no noise.

P.S. I HATE electronics on cars!!!

I'm south west/Bristol way. Sorry, really awkward reading and replying via phone.

if it only happens over 10mph i doubt it would be a rack issue, you would usually expect to hear it when its under greater load i.e. at low speeds or stationary when 'dry' steering.

just out of interest does it change volume if you rev the engine/corner more aggressively whilst its grinding?
the reason i ask is im thinking MAYBE an engine/gearbox mount or suspension issue.

10mph and same volume regardless of load or higher speed. God I hope it's not the gearbox. Happens on any kind of turning to right; i.e. cornering or motorway lane changing. I first noticed it when I was changing gear (i.e. the engine wasn't revving). I just wondered if it's connected...

I've read elsewhere on the net that using the city button can cause APS failure? I WAS using this intermittently (and probably incorrectly) before it went wrong plus I did jump and bump start it a few times during the colder weather last winter.

I'm going up to where it's parked tomorrow (it's been SORNd for two months now in a private car park) to have a play with a few things to see if the fault clears itself, including giving the motor a knock with a screw driver, like a solonoid and pressing the city button when in motion. I'm wary about taking main fuses off during idling as it could cause other issues. There's a brand spanking new battery on it so it can't be low voltage.

It's in need of a service (it's up for an MOT too), so I may take it for an interim to read and clear any of the faults and discover any other potential failures, plus new air and oil won't hurt on emissions...

Got the cowling off and batt reconnected. There's an intermittent electronic crackling coming from the EPS ECU that I've not heard before when the cowling was on. The city button is acknowledged on the dash, but doesn't seem to do anything to alter the EPS. Also, I disconnected the two wires to the EPS ECU and the dash registered a loose connection then a "fail" again upon reconnection.

So, how easy is it to swap the column/ECU and motor part out? I'm watching some on eBay that are way cheaper than fiat or a garage would charge. I can see the nuts holding it in, but does the wheel need to come off (which obviously goes into airbag reset territory - urrrgh!)?

Separate issue: can't get the battery connectors tight on the terminals. The nuts are as tight as they can be, but I can pull the connectors off by hand, so when I get her moving again they'll vibrate off.

Money! money! money!

The electronic "clicking"is happening when the car is resting, I.e. No keys connected. I'm disconnecting the batt again to stop that from draining as I can't do anything more with her today.

Pain. In. The. Arse.

sorry to be the bearer of bad news but 2 months sat without driving is enough to goose a battery... if you have to jump it/bump it/charge it every time you go back then it's passed its best.

i think you're clutching at straws condemning first the motor and now the ECU. it sounds a little desperate to me (no offence intended).

what i would suggest you do is get hold of a KNOWN good battery and i would 95% guarantee the steering issue will disappear. its quite a subtle difference in force when dry steering you have to be moving for it obviously make a difference, the city steering sups a LOT of power from the battery and if its not performing at its best you WILL end up with random faults all over the place. the things that are repeated most on this forum are faults that ultimately end up being a battery related issue.

could the noise when turning possibly be described as a 'drone' (a low frequency humming noise) if so then ill be suggesting it most likely from the rear as the suspension bushes wear in the beam axle the noise sounds like you have a wheel bearing gone but actually its just normal bearing noise transmitted through the car that you dont usually hear with good bushes. did you notice any knocking when you went over speedbumps/potholes?

pughga said:

Separate issue: can't get the battery connectors tight on the terminals. The nuts are as tight as they can be, but I can pull the connectors off by hand, so when I get her moving again they'll vibrate off.

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The battery posts and the clamp on connectors are tapered. Loosen the nuts then tap the the connectors down further on the posts before tightening the nuts.
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So no ideas on the electronic cracklings on the EPAECU? There's nothing elsewhere on the net about it and nothing on the net about workshop repairs, other than this white elephant called elearn.

The ECU looks and smells fine. I didn't volt test anything, but you mentioned no relays are on it.

It's a BRAND NEW battery, bought 5 days ago. Not sure if I mentioned? I jumped/bumped the old one around feb/mar last year a few times only and it worked find throughout the summer until I SORNd it in nov abd of course it died a week after sitting still. I bought the new one for this reason!!

I'm going to bite the bullet and pay out for a service on it. Hopefully clearing/seeing the codes will sort it.

The noise I think is down to a dodgy/corroded brake disc/shoe as when I took it for a spin earlier it was locked on at first and now a horrible grabbing noise as though the pads are rubbing up the wheel (like a tsktsk). Again, the service will pick this up.

Thanks for the batt advice davren.

Davren said:

The battery posts and the clamp on connectors are tapered. Loosen the nuts then tap the the connectors down further on the posts before tightening the nuts.
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Did this, to no avail.