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Old 12-09-2019   #16
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Re: Antifreeze Super Flush - Ensuring 50/50 mix

Quote Originally Posted by nikrox View Post
Is the current clamp gonna be reused?..Id got a flat bladded screwdriver in it and twisted to break it.
I used jubilee clips when I did mine.

I used a 12mm socket on the plastic drain plug...still broke it.
No I'm not planning on reusing them. But Tonge them undone is a major issue. They are so tight and being situated underneath to try prize open the securing tabs is proving a major issue. Any ideas on how to remove the quick connector cz my God it is on tight and you feel it's imposoblento get off. I have a whole replacement unit including hose I want to put on.
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Old 12-09-2019   #17
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Re: Antifreeze Super Flush - Ensuring 50/50 mix

If your replacing the hose why not use a dremel to cut the connector off?..or a hacksaw?...at a push an angle grinder maybe?..

OR if the hose is being replaced use a stanley knife to cut the hose away ,both sides of the clip maybe till it becomes loose enough to turn round so you can access the fastner...
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Last edited by nikrox; 12-09-2019 at 18:47.
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Old 13-09-2019   #18
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Re: Antifreeze Super Flush - Ensuring 50/50 mix

What I did was:
  1. Drain the original fluid
  2. Fill it up with distilled water, and drive around for 15+ mins (heat on max, fan at 0)
  3. Drain the distilled water, and measure how much came out (a 10 liter drain pan helps)
  4. Then deduct the amount from the max capacity (eg. 5,27 liters on the 2008 1.2 L) and add that much pure coolant in
    1. Say, you drained 3,5 liters of distilled water in step 3
    2. 5,27 - 3,5 = 1,77 liters left in the engine
    3. Add the same 1,77 liters of pure coolant in, and you will have close enough to 50/50 mix of distilled water and coolant
  5. Now you will have 1,77 + 1,77 = 3,54 liters of 50/50 in the engine
  6. Then just fill up the rest with a normal 50/50 mix
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Last edited by torniojaws; 13-09-2019 at 13:45.
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Old 4 Weeks Ago   #19
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Re: Antifreeze Super Flush - Ensuring 50/50 mix

I've been pretty busy for the last week, as some may have noticed, so I'm coming late to this thread. Thought I'd pitch in my ha'penny worth just in case some of it's useful. One wee word before we start - antifreeze is very poisonous stuff, DON'T POUR IT DOWN DRAINS. Collect it in a bucket, or whatever, stick it in a container and either dispose of it at your local recycling centre or probably your local garage will take it if you ask nicely.

There's probably more than one way to approach this task. If you don't want to get too "involved" and there seems to be no problems (ie. engine overheating or cool heater output when controls are set to hot) but do want to ensure reasonable protection for the engine by renewing most of the coolant then pulling the bottom hose - or undoing the rad drain plug/tap - and block drain if you have one, will drain most of the coolant on many vehicles. Removing the filler cap facilitates a rapid drain. (the Punto's bottom hose comes out the back of the water pump which is low down on the water jacket so you'll get a good drain) You will inevitably be left with some in the heater matrix and bottom of the engine water jacket but if your skill level/patience can't manage more than this if you replace the hose (new worm drive clip) and close/tighten any drain plugs/taps, then refill with a 50/50 antifreeze/water mix you won't go far wrong.

However if you want to ensure a more or less complete purge then you've got to flush and that's perhaps not as simple as some might imply. Firstly I'd pull the bottom hose (filler cap off). Drain plugs are often brittle or seized so I avoid them and I worry about damaging these "quick connect" type fittings so I like to just pull the hose off the stub. If your hose clamps are the crimped original fitting just destroy them and use worm drive (jubilee being one famous brand) hose clips on reassembly. - As has been mentioned by others. Now to the flushing. You need to flood plenty of water through the system to chase out contamination and deposits which might cause blockages and you need a good rate of flow. Simply sticking the garden hose into the filler on the expansion tank won't do much good on most engines because the hose from the expansion tank to the engine/radiator is quite small bore so you won't get much rate of flow. Ok, you might say, pop the top hose off the rad and stick the garden hose in it. Now there's a problem here because the engine is cold and the thermostat is going to be closed so you can't get any flow into the engine with the thermostat closed. What I like to do is to find where the heater supply pipe joins the engine. It's often on/near the thermostat housing or comes off the cylinder head somewhere as it needs hot water. On our petrol engined Punto and Panda 8 valves it's on the thermostat housing on the "back" (near side - passenger side) of the cylinder head. Take the hose off - a little fiddly but not that bad to do (you'll need another, smaller, hose clip on reassembly). Now stick the garden hose onto the thermostat stub from which you've just removed the heater hose and turn the water on. This connection takes water straight into the engine and is not impeded by the closed thermostat. Let it run, full bore, for a couple of minutes and you'll flush pretty much any rubbish and old coolant out of the engine. Now - turn the tap off, unless you need a shower? plug the hose into the heater hose and turn the water back on again. Water will flow through the heater matrix and back out of the return pipe - which on our engines connects into the metal pipe which runs along the front of the engine - then along the bottom hose and so out to your container. In my experience the heater matrix supply goes in at a low level and leaves to return at a higher level. So when you turn the water supply to the hose off and pull the garden hose out of the heater supply pipe the water will drain out of the heater matrix by gravity. On some cars you may have to manipulate the heater hose run so the water can drain "downhill". On modern cars you don't need to worry about heater control positions as the water flows unimpeded at all times through the matrix. If you think the matrix may be partially blocked pull the return pipe - on ours that's the one that goes into the metal pipe on the front of the engine - and back flush the heater matrix. Now you've flushed everything except the radiator itself. If you have no reason to suspect any flow problems with the radiator you can simply remove the top hose and flush copious quantities through with your hose. However if you suspect any thing is going on which might be impeding the flow you need to take the radiator out, turn it upside down and vigorously back flush it. After putting it all back together again, because you've had the hoses disconnected at all the "low points" there will be very little water left in the system. If you are really fanatical about removing water you can always jack up the side opposite where you've got a hose disconnected, before reassembly, to let it drain but I don't worry about this.

So now you've got everything reassembled and new hose clips tightened. I mix up 50/50 OAT antifreeze/deionised water in a 2 litre "pop" bottle. In fact our Scottish water is very soft and in days gone by I've used straight tap water - as does Jim up in the highlands - without any detrimental effects I'm aware of. Having flushed the whole system out you don't need to worry about mixing incompatible antifreezes (usually silicate - the "traditional" old type vs. Organic Acid Technology, OAT, which is mostly used now a days) I just buy whatever the local factor stocks - which for some time has been Tradetec. Both our Fiats are running with this and it seems just fine. People get very concerned because there might be a small amount of the flushing water left in the system to dilute your new coolant. You have to make a sensible assessment, by examining where the drain points on your system are, but I doubt if there is enough left in most applications to make a measurable difference.

As some of you may have seen when I posted about doing Becky's timing belt, I have a home made - very simple - piece of tubing which fits the expansion tank/filler neck and gives me about a foot or so (at a guess) of extra "head" when filling.

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So with this "device" installed I open the bleed screws on radiator and heater top hose and merrily pour in the coolant. I find the extra head of pressure, small as it is, chases coolant through to the bleed nipples most satisfactorily. Once both bleeds have stopped emitting air they are closed off and the engine run. There will be trapped air which will circulate and drop the level in the expansion tank so you need to watch it carefully and top up as the engine warms through. A wee extra bleed of the heater hose may also be needed with the engine running to completely eliminate air in the heater circuit but I have had no problems with the heater circuit air locking when filling in this way.

Well, hope some of that was helpful? I wouldn't be surprised if my "pugglt" old brain has forgotten to mention something? feel free to comment anyone?

Regards
Jock

PS If coolant concentration is really "bugging" you then buy an antifreeze tester. Auto Express did a very good comparison review in July of this year which you can find on line.
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Last edited by Pugglt Auld Jock; 4 Weeks Ago at 22:24. Reason: add PS
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Old 4 Weeks Ago   #20
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Re: Antifreeze Super Flush - Ensuring 50/50 mix

Hey Guys - Posting UPDATE.

So I have to say it was a fun job to do without its few minor hiccups. So positives:

1) With the TJET you need to remove quite a few things to get to thermostat and have good working space. I removed battery / expansion tank / engine cover / oil separator / side bracket / maf sensor / turbo by pass valve / spark plug connectors. Now may not needed to remove it all but I just followed steps. I say this is good cz it gives you a real look around engine and see what things are my engine is quite full of pipes here there everywhere so good to learn about them and connections.

2) A super flush was needed, my old coolant had a fishy smell and also noticed a lot of salt or something in the bottom of the jugs when I collected the old flushes. Also in expansion tank there was also chunks of what looked like that drink Slushy lol. So was needed.

3) Tested old vs new thermostat and they both worked in pot of hot water opened at I believe 76 - 85 degrees (did wrote down but post it now) so was good to see how thermostat actually works.

Negatives:
1) The clips such a headache if been put on upside down which mine were on the thermostat and upper rad hose - had to use a flexible dremel end and cut through the clips enough to be able to prize off.

2) Drain tap IS very delicate take your time here it's meant to be 13mm but mine kept slipping after 2nd flush so had to use a 12mm to crack off and then finish with 13mm

3) make sure to tighten the "Oil heat exchanger coolant supply pipe" good, as I assembled back my car torqued this to spec and upon do a star up it had a leak where it meets the washer. Now I tightened it some more from underneath car with a 22mm spanner and that seemed to do. Can only assume that when I torqued it originally I had to nus a flexible adaptor and a small extension bar to get on it meaning the torque wrench wasn't quite doing it to spec due to added length.

4) In end had to leave the old upper rad quickmconnector on and just change the hose as it is a nightmare to get off (as someone mentioned) and I was pulling so hard was worried about cracking radiator


Attached a few random pictures for people to see, not in any order but are from points listed. The job in all took me 3 full days (I know - bloody hell) but flushed system 4 times + new thermostat + new clips a d learning experience .

MASSIVE THANKS TO ALL. YOU GUYS ARE AMAZING!Click image for larger version

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Old 4 Weeks Ago   #21
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Re: Antifreeze Super Flush - Ensuring 50/50 mix

Lastly in addition of getting this exact 50/50 mix. In the end I just filled up with 50/500 mix. I managed to get about 4L in meaning there is 1 LITRE of pure distilled water in the system. I would suspect over time the coolant level may drop a wee wee tad due to not being exactly 50/50 but I will just top up with pure antifreeze and keep a litre to a side and that way I know I'll slowly but surely get to that exact 50/50
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Old 4 Weeks Ago   #22
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Re: Antifreeze Super Flush - Ensuring 50/50 mix

I hope I don't sound patronising but I'd like to say "Jolly well done that man"! Your post is a very welcome addition to the reading on this forum. It certainly looks like you did the right thing by flushing it through. Probably never been done in the life of the vehicle judging from the "stuff" in those bottles. So glad for you that it turned out so well.

How did the bleeding go? No problems?

I'm looking forward to reading any more posts you might do in the future.

Kindest regards
Jock
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Old 4 Weeks Ago   #23
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Talking Re: Antifreeze Super Flush - Ensuring 50/50 mix

Quote Originally Posted by Pugglt Auld Jock View Post
I hope I don't sound patronising but I'd like to say "Jolly well done that man"! Your post is a very welcome addition to the reading on this forum. It certainly looks like you did the right thing by flushing it through. Probably never been done in the life of the vehicle judging from the "stuff" in those bottles. So glad for you that it turned out so well.

How did the bleeding go? No problems?

I'm looking forward to reading any more posts you might do in the future.

Kindest regards
Jock
No not at all, I appreciate the kind words. I genuinely love this forum people are so knowleable and helpful. Im on the corsaD forum and it is a ghost town except for a few of us left, which is a real shame. Really hope this forum keeps going strong even with puntos no longer being made. The bleeding seemed to go fine, open bleeder> wait for coolant 2 come out>close it back>squeezing hoses leftright and centre lol> and let fans kick in a few times>test drive. I dont drive my car as much as average people do due to working from home office, so not out of woods yet will bee keeping an eye for next week or so and keep people informed should anything be wrong
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Old 1 Hour Ago   #24
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Re: Antifreeze Super Flush - Ensuring 50/50 mix

Guys, after full heating up engine when thermostat opens, can you press big hose from thermostat to upper radiator corner sofly by two fingers like I do? I thought when thermostat is fully opened, borh hoses from (and to) radiator should be hard like rock...?
GP 1.4 8V 2013

Thx ;-)
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