Register Login
Shop4Parts - UK's largest online superstore for FIAT and Alfa Romeo parts
Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old 29-09-2019   #1
Join Date: Dec 2014
Location: Orpington, Kent UK
Posts: 3,959
Thanks: 342
Trader Rating: 0
typecastboy has donated!
United Kingdom 
Single phase to dual phase airbag

As you may know the idiot company who I sent my Airbag ECU from my Abarth to have the crash data deleted has broken my ECU with power supply errors. They told me to send it back and they have sent it back to me again, exactly the same so it is useless.

The car is one of the single stage airbags so there is a compatibility problem from other cars as the single phase was only used for a while so I need to get the same part number.

Feasibility question: If I get a dual phase clock spring with the dual phase steering wheel airbag wires, and then put a dual phase airbag in, will the ECU from a dual phase airbag car work? In theory it should. Opinions?
__________________
FIAT Forum Useful Links:
Donate to FF | Buy FF Merchandise | Classifieds | FF Insurance | How-to Guides

typecastboy is offline Reply With Quote Quote 
Old 29-09-2019   #2
Join Date: Oct 2017
Location: West Yorkshire
Posts: 3,743
Thanks: 212
Trader Rating: 0
chris3234 has donated!
United Kingdom 
Re: Single phase to dual phase airbag

Don't see any reason it shouldn't work if the ECU expects a dual stage airbag and it has one fitted
Assuming the connection to the clock spring from the car is same and there's not additional wire's on it
Likes typecastboy liked this post
__________________
FIAT Forum Useful Links:
Donate to FF | Buy FF Merchandise | Classifieds | FF Insurance | How-to Guides

chris3234 is offline Reply With Quote Quote 
Old 29-09-2019   #3
Join Date: Dec 2014
Location: Orpington, Kent UK
Posts: 3,959
Thanks: 342
Trader Rating: 0
typecastboy has donated!
United Kingdom 
Single phase to dual phase airbag

Quote Originally Posted by chris3234 View Post
Don't see any reason it shouldn't work if the ECU expects a dual stage airbag and it has one fitted

Assuming the connection to the clock spring from the car is same and there's not additional wire's on it


I havenít checked the amount of wires but thereís no extra plugs from car to clock spring. I took the dash out of my latest project this afternoon so maybe I should just try it and if it works I guess I can just get a black one and an Abarth airbag with two sockets.

Got to be worth a try.
__________________
FIAT Forum Useful Links:
Donate to FF | Buy FF Merchandise | Classifieds | FF Insurance | How-to Guides

typecastboy is offline Reply With Quote Quote 
Old 29-09-2019   #4
Moderator
 
g8rpi's Avatar
Join Date: Nov 2013
Location: Cambridge
Posts: 4,448
Thanks: 449
Trader Rating: 0
g8rpi has donated!
United Kingdom 
Re: Single phase to dual phase airbag

Are you going to change the passenger airbag too? What about other components?
Air bag systems are carefully balanced, you can't go mixing and matching components between different versions. If you do you are potentally putting lives at risk.


Robert G8RPI.
Likes jrkitching liked this post
__________________
FIAT Forum Useful Links:
Donate to FF | Buy FF Merchandise | Classifieds | FF Insurance | How-to Guides

g8rpi is offline Reply With Quote Quote 
Old 29-09-2019   #5
Join Date: Dec 2014
Location: Orpington, Kent UK
Posts: 3,959
Thanks: 342
Trader Rating: 0
typecastboy has donated!
United Kingdom 
Re: Single phase to dual phase airbag

Quote Originally Posted by g8rpi View Post
Are you going to change the passenger airbag too? What about other components?
Air bag systems are carefully balanced, you can't go mixing and matching components between different versions. If you do you are potentally putting lives at risk.


Robert G8RPI.


Iíve already changed the passenger airbag. That is dual phase as I believe they all are. Iíve plugged in a good ecu but it is looking for a second phase on the drivers one. There are no errors anywhere else.
__________________
FIAT Forum Useful Links:
Donate to FF | Buy FF Merchandise | Classifieds | FF Insurance | How-to Guides

typecastboy is offline Reply With Quote Quote 
Old 30-09-2019   #6
STOP! Hammer time!
 
306maxi's Avatar
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: The Welsh Riviera
Posts: 23,753
Thanks: 851
Trader Rating: 0
306maxi has donated!
United Kingdom 
Re: Single phase to dual phase airbag

This is an absolutely terrible idea.

Iíve risked my job to prevent lesser risks to people from going out into the real world.

Swallow the cost and for the right parts. Youíll sleep better knowing youíve done the right thing.
Likes g8rpi, jrkitching liked this post
__________________
FIAT Forum Useful Links:
Donate to FF | Buy FF Merchandise | Classifieds | FF Insurance | How-to Guides

306maxi is offline Reply With Quote Quote 
Old 30-09-2019   #7
Moderator
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: Dorset
Posts: 9,690
Thanks: 1094
Trader Rating: 0
United Kingdom 
Re: Single phase to dual phase airbag

Quote Originally Posted by typecastboy View Post
Feasibility question: If I get a dual phase clock spring with the dual phase steering wheel airbag wires, and then put a dual phase airbag in, will the ECU from a dual phase airbag car work? In theory it should. Opinions?
There's two levels to "will it work?"

There's "will it work" as in "will it extinguish the warning lights and cause the airbag system to appear functional".

Then there's "will it work" as in "can I be certain that the correct airbags and other SRS components will deploy properly in the event of a future accident".

This kind of amateur dabbling when you don't even have access to the manufacturer's service documentation may just possibly achieve the first, but it will never achieve the second.

Quote Originally Posted by 306maxi View Post
This is an absolutely terrible idea.

I’ve risked my job to prevent lesser risks to people from going out into the real world.

Swallow the cost and for the right parts. You’ll sleep better knowing you’ve done the right thing.
There's clear industry guidance that airbag system components should never be reused in this way. Sure, properly certified replacements may make the repair uneconomic, but that's one of the reasons why these cars get written off in the first place.

Secondhand airbag components of unknown or dubious pedigree can be bought cheaply on ebay and similar sites; given the cost of OEM parts, the temptation to use them is obvious.

It's widely recognised that stopping this sort of practice will require a change in the law.

@typecastboy: you're probably the most knowledgeable amateur here when it comes to answering your original question; you've probably more experience in rebuilding airbag systems using secondhand parts than anyone else who's likely to respond. Industry professionals with proper access to this information are unlikely to post the details on a public forum.
Likes g8rpi, 306maxi liked this post
__________________


"Just 'cos you're not paranoid, doesn't mean they're not out to get you"


Last edited by jrkitching; 30-09-2019 at 08:44.
jrkitching is offline Reply With Quote Quote 
Old 30-09-2019   #8
STOP! Hammer time!
 
306maxi's Avatar
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: The Welsh Riviera
Posts: 23,753
Thanks: 851
Trader Rating: 0
306maxi has donated!
United Kingdom 
Quote Originally Posted by jrkitching View Post
There's two levels to "will it work?"

There's "will it work" as in "will it extinguish the warning lights and cause the airbag system to appear functional".

Then there's "will it work" as in "can I be certain that the correct airbags and other SRS components will deploy properly in the event of a future accident".

This kind of amateur dabbling when you don't have access to the manufacturer's documentation may just possibly achieve the first, but it will never achieve the second.

There's clear industry guidance that airbag system components should never be reused in this way. Sure, properly certified replacements may make the repair uneconomic, but that's one of the reasons why these cars get written off in the first place.

Secondhand airbag components of unknown or dubious pedigree can be bought cheaply on ebay and similar sites; given the cost of OEM parts, the temptation to use them is obvious.

It's widely recognised that stopping this sort of practice will require a change in the law.
Yep.

I wonít say where I work for obvious reasons, but being simplistic, just before a car rolls off the production line, it gets plugged into a production system that interrogates each diagnosable part of the car and checks it against a version list of parts and software. This is 1 to make sure that itís got the latest and greatest parts and 2 To check that the correct software for the parts fitted, but 3 and quite importantly to also catch any parts which might have been recalled, but are still in the supply chain. Letís say purely hypothetically that if the C level airbag fitted to the steering wheel has shown to not fire on some occasions and is replaced with a D level part and all C level parts should be destroyed, this checkpoint will flag up any potentially dangerous parts which have been fitted. The C level part might not flag up a warning...

Fitting anything other than identical parts OR later parts which have superseded the old parts is extremely reckless.
__________________
FIAT Forum Useful Links:
Donate to FF | Buy FF Merchandise | Classifieds | FF Insurance | How-to Guides

306maxi is offline Reply With Quote Quote 
Old 30-09-2019   #9
Join Date: Dec 2014
Location: Orpington, Kent UK
Posts: 3,959
Thanks: 342
Trader Rating: 0
typecastboy has donated!
United Kingdom 
Re: Single phase to dual phase airbag

This is exactly why are asked the question as I knew there were some knowledgeable people on this subject out there.

Thanks Guys, I'll just have to source one with the correct serial or bite the bullet and get a new one.
Likes Gina500, jrkitching liked this post
__________________
FIAT Forum Useful Links:
Donate to FF | Buy FF Merchandise | Classifieds | FF Insurance | How-to Guides

typecastboy is offline Reply With Quote Quote 
Reply
Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump
Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
(S) Phase 1 Bumper on a Phase 2 Seicento possiblepanda Cinquecento / Seicento 1 08-04-2014 21:06
(G) My new gt! phase 2. GTGiov Punto (Mk1) 0 11-09-2009 19:52
My phase 2 sporting cossieboy Members Motors 4 03-11-2008 16:05
3 phase dave Leisure Lounge 69 19-07-2008 12:07
(S) Converting a Phase I to a Phase II Rich Stilo 3 13-08-2005 22:08