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Old 02-05-2007   #1
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I need an Opinion

I currently have an '80 x1-9, with the 1300 and a 5spd conversion.

The performance isnt up to what i would like as a 'p' plater (im up against guys in skylines for god sakes) and I have come up with a few ideas on what I could do to make it a little faster. Can I get your collective opinions as to which option I should undertake, and the rough budget I would be needing to do this..

Option 1) Keep the existing 1300 motor, but convert it to Fuel Injection through the use of a 1500 FI setup, taken from a wrecked x1-9

Option 2) UnoT.

I like the first option better, as it is more 'Ps' friendly, the cops down here dont like snails on anything.

Anyway, opinion away.

Ta

blu
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Old 02-05-2007   #2
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Re: I need an Opinion

In terms of tuning the 1300 you have plenty of options but switching to later FI 1500 head is actually one of the more difficult ones. After about 1980 Fiat changed the head stud sizes and added in 4 extra smaller studs to assist in keeping the head flat.

You may as well just fit a later engine - like a 1300 or 1400 fuel injected Uno engine or just adopt the 1500 FI engine complete.

You could use the Uno turbo engine without the turbo, just use a different crank, rod and piston set from one of the other engines in the family.

The 1500 head for FI purposes isn't much different though (ignoring the extra studs). Basically all you have different is the recesses cut into the inlet port to accomodate the injectors, machining them into a 1300 head is not too difficult and then all you need is the inlet manifold with attached fuelling components.

What you don't have is the crank trigger - that leaves you with much the same problem as the Uno Turbo conversion, assuming you wish to use the original Fiat engine management. If you don't mind stretching to programmable management then it gets a bit simpler as you can use a toothed wheel attached to the timing belt pulley. The downside to this is the map.
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Old 04-05-2007   #3
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Re: I need an Opinion

Quote Originally Posted by jimbro1000 View Post
In terms of tuning the 1300 you have plenty of options but switching to later FI 1500 head is actually one of the more difficult ones. After about 1980 Fiat changed the head stud sizes and added in 4 extra smaller studs to assist in keeping the head flat.

You may as well just fit a later engine - like a 1300 or 1400 fuel injected Uno engine or just adopt the 1500 FI engine complete.

You could use the Uno turbo engine without the turbo, just use a different crank, rod and piston set from one of the other engines in the family.

The 1500 head for FI purposes isn't much different though (ignoring the extra studs). Basically all you have different is the recesses cut into the inlet port to accomodate the injectors, machining them into a 1300 head is not too difficult and then all you need is the inlet manifold with attached fuelling components.

What you don't have is the crank trigger - that leaves you with much the same problem as the Uno Turbo conversion, assuming you wish to use the original Fiat engine management. If you don't mind stretching to programmable management then it gets a bit simpler as you can use a toothed wheel attached to the timing belt pulley. The downside to this is the map.
What sort of costs am I looking at? This is a big clincher for me, I'm still a student.

blu
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Old 04-05-2007   #4
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Re: I need an Opinion

Forget migrating heads then - it is too expensive unless you just happen to own your own workshop.

Cheapest option is to get a 1500 motor in there - the only complicating factor is adopting a 5-speed gearbox if you want one and the slightly taller engine which all fits except for the air filter.

The Uno 1300's are (from memory) based on the 1500 engine but with different bore and stroke so you will have a similar problem with them but you have the option of fuel injection which in turn negates the problem.

Cost comes down to what you can get the engine for with all the ancillaries and electrics (I just bought the front half of a car when I did my uno turbo conversion).

The crank sensor is going to be the hard part as it is fitted into the gearbox bellhousing and the position is absolutely critical relative to the flywheel.

Everything else is DIYable although it can be time consuming (especially the electrics as the ECU wiring is numbered rather than colour coded and finding the numbers can be fun).
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Old 31-05-2007   #5
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Re: I need an Opinion

Will a Lancia Beta engine fit?? theres a cheap one for sale near me and im half interested.

blu
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Old 31-05-2007   #6
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Re: I need an Opinion

Quote Originally Posted by bludvl_x19 View Post
Will a Lancia Beta engine fit?? theres a cheap one for sale near me and im half interested.

blu
It has been done (I don't have any personal experience unfortunately), but you will probably need a Beta gearbox and custom drive shafts.

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Old 31-05-2007   #7
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Re: I need an Opinion

The engine bay was originally designed to take the twink engine (Fiat decided they wanted a lower performance car so it changed to the SOHC - the Beta Montecarlo got the twink instead) so there is plenty of space to accomodate the Beta engine *but* the engine mountings are all wrong.

You used to be able to buy a subframe to mount the twink in an X1/9 but I have no idea if you can still get them - somehow I doubt it.

Gearbox swap is essential and ideally you want a montecarlo/scorpion box as the shifter is in more or less the right place.
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Old 01-06-2007   #8
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Re: I need an Opinion

Quote Originally Posted by jimbro1000 View Post
The engine bay was originally designed to take the twink engine (Fiat decided they wanted a lower performance car so it changed to the SOHC - the Beta Montecarlo got the twink instead) so there is plenty of space to accomodate the Beta engine *but* the engine mountings are all wrong.

You used to be able to buy a subframe to mount the twink in an X1/9 but I have no idea if you can still get them - somehow I doubt it.

Gearbox swap is essential and ideally you want a montecarlo/scorpion box as the shifter is in more or less the right place.

by cheap one, I meant that there was a complete car for sale near me.

blu
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Old 01-06-2007   #9
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Re: I need an Opinion

Montecarlo bits in Australia is problematic since it was never sold here.

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Old 01-06-2007   #10
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Re: I need an Opinion

You could go with 1500 or 1600 sohc fiat engine, possible to squeeze 160hp out of them with serious tuning. Buy a fast road cam and bolt a good downdraught on it and away you go. You won't get 160hp but enough to have some fun with it.
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Old 01-06-2007   #11
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Re: I need an Opinion

Never said it would be easy - just that it can be done :O

Monte bits, while relatively sparce, are available. You could solve the problem with some customisation of the bellhousing and gear linkage. Given the exhange rate and shipping costs it might work out cheaper that way.

I've seen some very convoluted solutions in the past - the worst being an 8 valve HF turbo engine and box in the back of an X1/9. The linkage conversion was the weakest point and caused a lot of problems and when you saw how it was built you can understand why! It was an utter mess of levers and cables...
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Old 01-06-2007   #12
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Re: I need an Opinion

How about a Thema 16 valve turbo....
Have seen one with a Beta twin cam awhile back, think it might have been fuel injected aswell(later Beta ie engine).
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