Technical What should I be checking when looking at a Multipla Diesel for sale?

[shedtastic]

Hi - I'm new to the forum, I joined because I'm looking at a 2003 85,000mile Multipla JTD 115 ELX that's for sale. I like the car and it drives well - the clutch doesn't seem to slip, the car pulls well and it seems the AC might work (hard to tell when it's so cold anyhow...) I've been advised to check the following:

All electrical toys..
Sunroof for leaks
That the chairs all fold ok (no stretched cables)

On the upside:

• I'm really quite taken with it..
• The price is right (provided it has been serviced..)
• The interior is much tidier than many I've seen that have been abused by children for 85,000 miles..

On the downside:

• At the moment it appears that the dealer has lost the service history
  past 49,000 miles (so I can't be sure the cambelt has been changed) and I guess it should have just had a service at around 84k? I think I can assume that hasn't happened..
• The handbrake doesn't seem to work well
• The dash plastics all seem a bit "sticky.."
• There are quite a few bits of chipped paint (including on the back edge of the bonnet oddly..)
• It has shockingly cheap brand tyres on it..
• I'll have to spend an afternoon transferring a decent head unit and my Parrot handsfree kit from my old car..

Any advice on what to check before I rush in and make a rash purchase on the basis that I like it's quirkiness?

And what mpg can I expect? My commute is mostly 75mph on the motorway.

Thanks in advance,

Neil

 

[BikeDoc]

At the moment it appears that the dealer has lost the service history
past 49,000 miles...

That would be my primary concern to be honest, and it seems a little too 'convienient', if you know what I mean .
I'd ask if they can put you in contact with the previous owner, and ask them.
Most garages will put a sticker somewhere (usually around the drivers door area) quoting the mileage (and sometimes the date) when a timing belt was replaced, so have a good look for that.
Look for any dealer/garage stickers, and contact them, giving the car's reg and asking what work they've done to it, if any.
Failing that, get it changed anyway.

My handbrake didn't work too well either (does it tend to pull/lift up the back on one side only?), turns out the left caliper was totally seized, and the right one wasn't much better.
I had to replace them both, not cheap!
Get them to sort it out as part of the deal if possible, otherwise budget around £90-100 for each caliper and pad set, plus labour if you can't do it yourself.

I wouldn't worry about the budget tyres (unless you're planning on doing track days ), just wear them out and replace with your usual choice.

 

[shedtastic]

Cheers for the advice. The seller says he'll do a service and change the belts, tensioners and waterpump (& show me the old parts that come off..) as he's had the cover off and it looks like its not been done for a long time. I think I'm going to take a gamble that (at least some of) the other servicing has been done and the book not stamped.. (The oil doesn't look that old!) I have looked for any stickers etc but can't see any. He also says he'll have to sort the handbrake in order to give it an MOT.

The only other issue I could find was that one of the rear window switches is broken, but that should be fixable without too much expense, I hope. (Is there no control of the rear windows from the front?)

At the price, and given the overall condition, I think it's worth the punt, even if I am partially blinded by the fact that it was simply fun and quirky on the test drive.. (Plus my current car is not going to pass it's next MOT)

Neil

 

[BikeDoc]

Well if they sort all the problems, go for it, they are great fun and very useful
I was looking for something to replace my knackered Toyota Lucida when I first considered the Multipla.
Not having my two Daughters arguing about whose turn it was to sit in the front was absolutely priceless for me

Just so you're covered, ask for an itemised list of all the work they do and the parts they replace, so you're covered if anything go pear-shaped later.

 

[martbass]

Listen out for knocks etc whilst going over a bump or two.
Drop links are typical and slightly worse, anti roll bar.
All Very common with the multi.

Whats the price by the way?

 

[vincenze]

If the garage agrees to replace the timing belt then you're quids in.

The mileage is fine. I know one or two people with x and y regs who have good Multiplas (diesel) with 120-140K on the clock.

What's the asking price?

Plastic sticky? - they all are.

Handbrake is pretty flimsy as a rule.

I have a ELX 115 JTD '03, too. Nice ride, good torque. In France kept a flat 100mph for long distances (had to replace the RPM sensor on my return though. Its a lovely motor. The fact that this forum exists is a serious help. If it hadn't I'd have got upended by my local garage who wanted to dismantle my fuel line (One of the clever chaps here put me right – crank/rpm sensor).

Run the engine and check the heat bars don't go over three.
Diesel engine isn't the quietest anyway, bit like a big lawnmower, but should be fully responsive to throttling all the way through to 4K rpm. Gear changes are a tad clunky, but smooth out from 3-4-5.
Lovely motor. Good family car. Think it has an NCAT of 3 (Im not sure on this actually whether it had the more rigorous European tests).
I bought mine with 68K on the clock for £5K

 

[widemouthfrog]

If they'll do the cambelt and give you a warranty (they'll have to give you 3 months minimum anyway), then I'd go for it - as long as it's cheap!

With regards to the service history (or lack of it), get the phone number of the last garage in the service book and call them. They might be able to fill in some gaps. If you get the registration you can also check with your local Fiat dealer for any service records. I did that with mine and it's been useful on a couple of occasions.

The other thing you can do is go here:

http://www.motinfo.gov.uk/

If you've got the reference number from the last MOT or the serial number from the V5, you can view the MOT history for the car. It may lso help verify the mileage if you're lucky.

The sticky dash plastics are just caused by using a silicone based spray (like Back to Black, for example). The hard dash surfaces have a rubberised coating that doesn't take kindly to having this stuff on it. No damage done though - just wipe it off with isopropyl alcohol or even some soapy water.

I love my Multi. I wasn't sure if I'd made the right choice when I bought it, but the more time I spend in it/using it, the more impressed I am. It's a very clever piece of design, perhaps a little let down/compromised by some cheap engineering in places. Shorter than a Golf, more spacious than a Tardis!

 

[BikeDoc]

I missed the bit about sticky parts.
Just the gear lever surround on mine is like that, I'll try the IPA suggestion, we use it at work .

 

[JTDman]

Make sure there is no oil leaks in the gearbox area as its a common problem and to replace the cheap seal its a box out job or the box wil get real noisey and eat its own bearings.
Cambelt is a must especially if its been sat on a forecourt for a while as the bearings in the idlers/tensioners can seize causing failure.
Crackin cars but you will have niggles that you have to take on the chin but dont let me put you off they are great.

 

[shedtastic]

Cheers for all the advice - especially (hopefully!) the solution to the sticky dash issue!

I've had another look at the car, and decided to go ahead. It was advertised on the forecourt for £3,250 - but I'd seen it on autotrader for £3,000. By the time I talked to the seller a couple of days later and mentioned it was cheaper on autotrader, he said "oh, yeah, I've reduced it now to £2,750.." so that was nice.. :->

That seems quite a good price for an '03 ELX to me, for a trade sale - but obviously as discussed above the history is patchy and going over it more thoroughly there are a few more scuffs on the outside than I at first thought, some broken plastic trim on the rear seats where the seatbelts have got trapped when the door has closed, one rear window switch is broken and the adjustment of one mirror is erratic.. (the final two, he said he'd 'look at'..) There's also no tax on it.

I get a measly px value on my old car, but then it is pretty worthless ('98 Saab with >150k miles and <2 months MOT) so that's fair enough..

I just hope that the MOT, service, belt change etc are all done properly with no attempts to cut corners.. I'll check that the oil looks new when I go to pick it up, and that the handbrake works, but otherwise I'm not sure I'll be able to tell if the waterpump and tensioner etc are done too. But I'm going to be optimistic!

Should get it in a couple of days.. I'll let you know how it goes, and then bug you endlessly for advice on how to fix things... :->

Neil

Neil

 

[martbass]

Hasn't anybody seen my 04 ElX for sale in the classifieds?

reading this thread and seeing prices has got me thinking to put the price up!!


It's service history and provenance are without question!!

 

[shedtastic]

Hi - To be blunt, no I'd not seen it. It looks a cracker!

You thought of sourcing a 6th seat to sell with it? I can't help thinking that not many people would want a six seater with only 5 seats? £3K is distinctly more than the £2350 that I need to pay for the 03 with fewer miles that I'm looking at mind you (since my old car is worth little more than scrap.. the £400 px is actually more convenient for me to just ditch it at the dealer than to try and sell it for peanuts or scrap it...)

But it does look the better car! I hope you've advertised it beyond the FF classifieds, Autotrader or eBay are still the first places I would look..

I take it you think I'm paying too much then!

Neil.

 

[topaztigs]

Listen out for knocks etc whilst going over a bump or two.
Drop links are typical and slightly worse, anti roll bar.
All Very common with the multi.

Whats the price by the way?

Ooh... I've just bought a Multipla and just put it in for a service and it has that 'knocking sound' which you speak of... the garage people reckoned it was the bush on the front antiroll bar, but when they've looked at it closer it seems that it's all welded together... Fiat themselves apparently don't sell the bushes individually, only as a complete rollbar... however, ebay does have them available...
Can you offer any advice... or can anybody else?
Be grateful!

 

[Dieselrob]

Hi,

if you're still looking, here's a couple of suggestions from my experience (52 plate 115JTD ELX with 74000):

• Turbo wastgate actuator. Ours jammed with the effect that engine management kept putting car into limp home to protect turbo. Turn off engine and re-start all fine until you needed to hoof it a bit. Needed replacement turbo as no serviceable parts
• excessive oil consumption with a lot of smoke on start up but nothing later. Turned out to be a seal in the recon. turbo. Diagnosed by me despite the garage saying it couldn't be that and changing loads of other stuff first :bang:
• Clutch not fully disengaging when hydraulic fluid full and cylinders OK. Happened in France when rushing back for ferryFound could only put in 1st or reverse with engine off then hold on brakes until ready to go, and re-learnt ancient art of double declutching, and even clutchless changes. Needed new clutch which surprised me as I thought if clutch failed it would slip, not fail to disengage.
• Plastic trim brittle. Various bits cracked or missing.
• Won't go into fourth gear - my current problem and subject of another thread.

But on the plus side it's pretty economical, seats 6 adults plus kit in comfort, handles amazingly well for an MPV with pretty decent performance and is capable (when all gears are available) of well over 100mph and still feels stable as found on another continental trip.

 

[martbass]

Hi shed
I did think you were paying too much for it comparing mine but I missed the fact your getting 400 off for trade in.
At the original 3k or so asking price without the service history I'd have said mine was a far better deal......fridge n all!
All the parts and work done etc listed in my ad were, in hindsight common to most of the multi's I had tried before buying mine (which seemed relatively fine at purchase)
I didn't take too long before getting to know the car that it suffered from quite a few of the regular faults we see on this forum!!
All done now though......I would recommend anyone looking to buy one that they budget quite a bit extra for these common faults which do add up to a pretty penny!!

enjoy the bug!!

 

[shedtastic]

Well, I picked it up, freshly serviced and MOT'd, this week and am pretty impressed with it to be honest. The non-functioning handbrake (that I was told would need to be 'fixed' to get the car MOT'd) was, in my opinion, bodged - I think they have got the last fraction of adjustment out of it so that it just works enough to get through the MOT. It was still an advisory though (I had to ask for the advisory sheet - it had been detached from the MOT..) and so I said I wasn't happy with that. It goes back at the weekend to get the cable swapped. It also needed a tyre for the MOT and he's really exceeded my expectations - by finding a brand of tyre SO cheap that google had trouble finding reference to them. I thought the "Riken" tyres on the back were pretty Pikey, but the new "Vee Rubber V24" takes it to a new level.. "Pride of Thailand" says the Vee Rubber website, and I can find no UK website that lists them, so I'm not sure what kind of lorry it fell of the back of..

Other than that though I just have a short list to work through:

• Broken aerial
• Non-functioning rear squirter (pipe probably blown off in the bootlid) & passenger squirter (odd that that wasn't needed for the MOT? hmm..)
• Swap the radio over
• work out why the passenger side mirror is 'wobbly' in it's housing..
• Replace the rear window switch (as promised by the seller, it has been fixed and now works, but it feels like it's on it's last legs and I know it will fail when the window is 'down' knowing my luck. So I'd rather just replace it.

But I'm well impressed with how quiet it is, how rattle free (No suspension clonks!) , how comfy, & how there's no error messages! I just need to check that the true mpg is better than indicated (as discussed on the mpg thread..)! Thanks to all for their advice!

Oh - and should add that the VOSA website did indeed confirm (now I have the reg number AND an MOT certificate number) the mileage history and now I have the name of the garage that looked after it I am getting the missing service history. Thanks for that advice too!

Neil.

 

[widemouthfrog]

Glad that you're pleased with your purchase!

Of the things on your 'to do' list:

I'd just get a replacement (2nd hand) passenger side mirror form one of the specialist breakers. Ugly Bug Bits and DAM Fiat are the two that get mentioned here most. The passenger mirrors tend to get a right tw*tting form hedgerows etc. They're about £20-25 and are very easy to swap over - no more than 15 minutes work at absolute maximum. Just be sure to ask for one that a) is heated and electric folding to suit your ELX - they should have 7 wires going to the connector plug, and b) has all its black paint still intact. The aluminium stem casting is notorious for peeling. You could get yourself a window switch at the same time. Both companies do mail order.

The aerial stems are readily avalable on ebay. Fitting them sounds like a bit of a pain, reading the 'how to's' on here.

I've just had all three handbrake cables replaced for my MOT. It feels miles better now. Cost inc. parts, labour and VAT was about £100 from a non-franchised specialist.

If you're lanky, I'd highly recommend jacking up the front of the drivers seat with some longer bolts. I put a guide on here some while ago. I'm about 6'4" and I find the seat far, far more comfortable like this. It is also the only car I've ever driven where I have the seat fully forward!

RE: MPG, I do a fair mix of motorway, A and B road stuff and town driving and I have averaged a true (i.e. not measured by the trip computer) 41mpg over the last year. Could be better, but not bad either.

 

[shedtastic]

Ugly Bug Bits and DAM Fiat are the two that get mentioned here most.

Anyone know where I can contact Ugly Bug Bits? All I can find for them is a defunct ebay store (http://stores. ebay.co.uk/ Ugly-Bug- Bits).

Neil.

 

[widemouthfrog]

Try sending a PM to Booklady on this forum. They're one and the same. I'm sure they've still got a presence on ebay. I'll go have a look.

DA Motors number is 01268 767424.

 

[shedtastic]

Try sending a PM to Booklady on this forum. They're one and the same. I'm sure they've still got a presence on ebay. I'll go have a look.

DA Motors number is 01268 767424.

Sad to say the feedback from booklady is that Ugly Bug Bits is no more - they have ceased trading as such. There's a list of remaining stock here:

http://6kyd.com/?page_id=579

Cheers,

Neil.