Technical Uno FIRE gearbox compatibility

[a73uk]

Hi all, does anyone know which other Fiats use the 89-91 Mk2 type gearbox?

Epers giving me 2 options (& 4 recon part numbers) on my chassis number, both hydraulic (mine was cable from new) & it doesnt explain why theres 4 options anyway. I`ve gone through the info on all the other 7 boxes listed & all are either hydraulic cluch or it doesnt mention clutch actuation.

I suspect something in my diffs gone, if I cant get another box I`ll have to dismantle my box, I dont have the time or health to do this at the moment.

This is from eper:



I obviously need a box ASAP so I`m trying to find out what other model options I`ve got, I`ve ordered a new clutch & driveshaft gators ready to do at the same time, but Uno`s dont get dismantled in SE breakers, they go straight to crusher....

 

[Louie Bee]

I remember looking through the eper at my 1993 999cc uno which apparently has a cable clutch and no sign of the hydraulics well apart from in my engine bay .

On the 999cc Unos I’ve seen the hydraulic clutch boxes have a gearshift that runs through the firewall and dry cups, where cable clutch have under car gear shifter and I suspect wet cups.

I'm not sure about the early 1108 but note that the MK2 turbo gearbox can be converted back to cable by swapping over the clutch arm lever - 1 chevis pin. The casting still carries the clutch cable sheath ending point.

 

[a73uk]

Thanks Louie,

As far as I remember all my previous Uno`s were hydraulic, including a 91 FIRE 999cc, but this ones all original & has cable. Its the Mk1 type box without a push down reverse.

As you can see, epers saying the 999 & 1108 have different part numbers, I dont know whats different, could be the gear or diff ratios, or maybe clutch or selector actuation, it doesnt elaborate.

Mine does have wet cups & an underfloor change.

I could probably get a Panda or 999 Uno box, but I dont want to change it if it messes up the drivability, although the rareness of the early cable box may force me into it.

 

[Louie Bee]

there are a few people on turbo collective canabalising low millage low hp Unos for their shells.

engine and gearbox usuley go for scrap - i've scrapped 2 but still have a 999cc box but is dry cups...

I could post up a wanted on there to put the feelers out for a box - think they are all 999cc but could find out. one or two are your way IIR.

 

[a73uk]

That would be much appreciated Louie, thanks.

I`ve just gone through my Haynes & Porter manuals, neither specify 1108 rod change gear or diff ratios, I`ll dig my handbooks out, although I dont know if I should believe them after the eper thing!

I only got my road tax the end of last week, not over the moon it may be off the road for a while!

 

[a73uk]

Ok, my 1990 handbook recons the 999 & 1108 have the same ratios on both gears & diff (15/56).

My 94 handbook says the 999 has 15/58 & the 1108 has 15/56 diff (& all different gear ratios bar 1st).

The 90` handbook also shows a cable clutch.

That helps, in theory I should be able to fit a wet cup cable clutch 999 box, which should be much easier to find than an 1108 one... in theory!

 

[Louie Bee]

Done

http://www.turbocollective.net/phpB...&start=0&sid=fad40396164f4abdfa8f1a42de60adfc

May be worth trawling through the restro section to pick out likley suspects too

Quaffe don't seem to list many difs for fiats - same number for all? http://www.quaife.co.uk/catalogue/search/results/taxonomy:133

 

[a73uk]

Nice one Louie, many thanks.

I`d love a qualfe, but my budget is a millionth of that!

So if I`ve got wet cups, underfloor rods & a cable cluch, its a C501 box?

I`ve never been 100% sure what oil to put in it...

 

[Louie Bee]

Back to the Fiat handbook for Oil..

EP or non EP?

do you have the soft white metal that is eaten by EP

 

[a73uk]

This is what I dont know! 1990 Handbook says Tutela ZC90... which I assume is EP90...

 

[Louie Bee]

https://www.fiatforum.com/uno/40569-gearbox-oil-45-fire.html

 

[a73uk]

https://www.fiatforum.com/uno/40569-gearbox-oil-45-fire.html

Thanks Louie,

Its still a bit confusing, we should really have a chart explaining the different oils & gearboxes.

According to the Castol site, mine should have SMX-S, a "Fully synthetic SAE 75W-85 manual gear oil", as should all the Mk2 FIRE gearboxes 90-95, but Alex is using VMX on that thread, which according to the site is an EP 80 oil.

According to Castrol the Mk1`s should have Syntrax Universal, a "part-synthetic multigrade gear oil"

But then it also says Uno`s should have Dextron in the power steering, which makes you question if they know what theyre talking about...

Its probably had the wrong oil in it which has cause the break, but I`m not suprised as its so confusing!

 

[alexGS]

OK, I haven't changed my opinion in all the years since I wrote on that thread

FIAT ZC90 oil and Castrol VMX oil seem very similar. Both may have some sort of mild EP additives but nothing like the level you get in regular gear oil, both have no smell and are therefore not EP. Both of these are NOT 'GL-5' specification. The FIAT ZC90 oil is not overly expensive and is available at FIAT dealers in NZ.

If you have an oil that is GL-5, that means it has EP additives for hypoid bevel drive (back axle of rear-wheel-drive cars), and this oil should not be used in the Uno gearbox. So, check the specification for the Syntrax and for the SMX-S. If they are described as meeting GL-5 standard and/or have a pungent smell, don't use.

Engine oil in the gearbox is still a safe option if there is no non-EP gear oil available. There are also additives available to smooth gear shifting and you could add one of these additives to a fill of engine oil, which would give a good result at a low price.

The most important thing is not the exact grade of the oil but rather that there is oil actually in there...

-Alex

 

[a73uk]

OK, I haven't changed my opinion in all the years since I wrote on that thread

FIAT ZC90 oil and Castrol VMX oil seem very similar. Both may have some sort of mild EP additives but nothing like the level you get in regular gear oil, both have no smell and are therefore not EP. Both of these are NOT 'GL-5' specification. The FIAT ZC90 oil is not overly expensive and is available at FIAT dealers in NZ.

If you have an oil that is GL-5, that means it has EP additives for hypoid bevel drive (back axle of rear-wheel-drive cars), and this oil should not be used in the Uno gearbox. So, check the specification for the Syntrax and for the SMX-S. If they are described as meeting GL-5 standard and/or have a pungent smell, don't use.

Engine oil in the gearbox is still a safe option if there is no non-EP gear oil available. There are also additives available to smooth gear shifting and you could add one of these additives to a fill of engine oil, which would give a good result at a low price.

The most important thing is not the exact grade of the oil but rather that there is oil actually in there...

-Alex

I think I`ve got some bottles of tutella in the garage, not sure which one, I`ll probably use that when I get the box sorted!

I`ve still not managed to locate a box yet, plus I`m pretty broke after Christmas (I`m a father of 2!), so my babys still sitting in the same place, I managed to get my Panda back from my mate, it`ll save me a fortune in petrol & is much easier to drive in snow than my Jag, 400bhp, an auto box, wide tyres & RWD isnt fun in snow & ice, believe me, plus its cost me a good £200 in extra petrol in the last 2 months my Uno`s been dead... :bang:

I started looking on eper for individual part numbers (I believe the diff is at fault in mine) & started searching online for people selling them, I found this site which lists parts on alot of the Fiat boxes & I discovered the diff is shared between the 501 & 526 boxes, as are some of the gears, which opens my options up alot as it looks like I`m going to have to strip & rebuild my diff & box (something I hate doing, but needs must).

Its useful info & will be handy for some of you in future too, heres the link:

http://www.tecnotrasmissioni.com/ricambi-dettmod-EN.asp?m=27&m2=0

This is the relevant pic for me:



I may well be getting a 4 speed box from Mr Ucof, which in theory, has a diff that`ll physically fit... the ratios are likely to be off, but its better than it not moving at all...

Anyway, I wish all of you a happy, healthy, uno-tastic new year!