Technical Two 'blown' turbos :-(

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Technical Two 'blown' turbos :-(

peter46piper

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I own a Multipla (2004) which is (was) a great car for me and my dogs. However the turbo 'went' and I had it replaced (not cheap reconditioned) which blew again within 80 miles! Turbo people reconditioned it (not cheap) and returned it to garage with instructions on what might have been the problem in the first place. Refitted and blew again after 40 miles while making a noise like a jet engine for those 40 miles :(
Has anyone got any idea of where the problem lies? Garage (local and not Fiat specific) says the car has no problems oilwise ... but I have lost confidence. Would appreciate advice from any experienced Multipla turbo buffs ..as I would like to repair having replaced just about everything else :eek::eek:
 

dandt87

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I'm not an "experienced Multipla turbo buff" but the 2 main things that can kill turbos are lack of lubrication and imbalance. IMHO I suspect that it's not getting enough/any oil.

What's the mileage on the car and oil change schedule?
 
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peter46piper

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I'm not an "experienced Multipla turbo buff" but the 2 main things that can kill turbos are lack of lubrication and imbalance. IMHO I suspect that it's not getting enough/any oil.

What's the mileage on the car and oil change schedule?
Mileage is 133.000 and oil was changed last month. Turbo man says lack of oil and garage says no way :) Garage replaced the 'feed tubes' (my language as I can't remember technicals) to the turbo ..on advice from the turbo man but the re-reconditioned turbo whined when fitted and as the garage accepted this ... I was stupid enough to accept it as well :-( looks like I'm going nowhere with either party as one blames the other ..... and I'm a woman! Is there anything in the feed line to the turbo which could restrict oil feed if not working properly ....like a filter or pump?
Would like to gen up a bit before handing this over to anyone else ... sound as if I know a bit about it :)
 

austenw90

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A bit off topic but when I got my Bravo a few months back the dealer had a Multipla 1.9 mjet on there books, 2008 reg I believe with nearly 300,000 miles on the clock!

The reason I'm saying this is because you said you've lost confidence. I hope you get it sorted and it goes for many many more miles for you!
 

T14086

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Changing the pipes is correct however you must also change the banjo bolts, also I believe from my (fast fading) memory the bottom banjo bolt actually has a filter in it that if clogged can prevent oil passing, seen this before on a scudo.
 

dandt87

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I agree with T14086, the changing of the pipes was OK, don't know if the banjo bolts come with the pipes or not.
The fact of the matter is that oil starvation (if that is in fact the problem here) can be caused by many things like using the wrong type of oil or not having it changed for a long time(big service intervals), that can clog up the oil passages and so on..
It looks like whatever killed your original turbo, killed the second one too, and after that they re-reconditioned unit might have been already on it's way out.

If you feel like you can't trust the guys that 'fixed it' you might whant to ask around the forum for a good mechanic in your general area

ask if you have any other questions, and good luck with your car
Cheers,
Dan
 
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peter46piper

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Thank you all for your replies :) The car is serviced regularly and oil changed more often than need be probably, as an old diesel mechanic told me years ago to change the oil and filter every 3000 miles and I would never have a engine problem! I haven't either 'till now (gearbox yes ..engine no) Come to think of it ... probably no turbo in those days! Like the sound of the 'banjo bolts' and will drop into the conversation at the garage and gauge expressions on the mechanics faces :) I am in South Lanarkshire Scotland ...if anyone knows someone with experience of Multiplas I'm more than happy to give him/her my trade!
 

momoe

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Turbo's shouldn't whine when newly installed, whining/whistling is normally means an out of balance turbo which ain't good.
However, turbo's should have a very good oil supply and if the bearings are not well lubricated then you could end up with the same issue, this does appear to point to oil supply - turbo supplier should be able to provide definitive evidence to back this up?
 

T14086

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Turbo is already knackered so disconnect oil feed from it, no oil and you have found your problem for sure.

Looks like garage could be at fault here unless they we asked to fit the turbo etc
 
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peter46piper

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Nope .. garage were definitely not asked to fit a whining turbo .. and have to say I think they were at fault for not doing their homework! However I may have to eat my words depending on diagnosis from an experienced Fiat mechanic. Will report back :)
 

T14086

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Where did turbo come from, you complaint is with the garage if they did diagnosis, supply and fit the turbo.
 
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peter46piper

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We bought the re-conditioned turbo on-line after the garage diagnosed the fault and the company supplied it and re- reconditioned it when it blew the first time ... giving the garage some advice on fitting the second time round (replacing pipes). Didn't work 'tho ... maybe the re-reconditioning wasn't a good idea ... although minimal mileage done in both cases. I wait with interest to see if I get a second bill from the garage :))
 
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peter46piper

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More advice would be welcome! The saga of the turbo continues. I have contacted a more local turbo company who are prepared to look at the turbo and repair ... but have said that unless the engine/sump are meticulously cleaned I may be throwing good money after bad! I have found an excellent diesel mechanic to fit the turbo ... but wonder if there are any specifics I should pass on as to how to make sure the engine/sump are cleaned before new oil? Any hints and advice welcome .... at the 'Last Chance Saloon' :)
 

widemouthfrog

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I can only give a few pointers from a near-miss turbo failure on our Scenic. For that car, I was told to:

Remove all inlet ducting from the air filter box to the turbo (including the intercooler) and thoroughly inspect/clean everything. Pay particular attention to the intercooler.

Remove the front half of the exhaust and remove all oil/sludge deposits. Check that the catalytic converter is not blocked - soak in cleaner and reverse-blow through if necessary. Back pressure caused by a blocked converter can do all sorts of damage.

Remove all oil feed pipes to/from the turbo, flush and clean. When refitting, prime with oil where possible.

Check that the oil supply pipe is providing a good flow of oil (they didn't tell me how to do this though!)

Drop the sump off and remove oil and sludge deposits - there may be all sorts of nasty little bits of debris buried in there. Check the bottom end for any other bits that should be there while the sump is off.

Check compression on all 4 cylinders. Turbo failure can easily blow a hole in a piston, either by mechanical impact from disintegrated bits sucked in to the engine, or by the engine going rev-bananas by running on its own engine oil once it's blown a turbo impeller shaft seal (a favourite way of the Renault turbo diesel commiting suicide).
 

urchin

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I can only give a few pointers from a near-miss turbo failure on our Scenic. For that car, I was told to:

Remove all inlet ducting from the air filter box to the turbo (including the intercooler) and thoroughly inspect/clean everything. Pay particular attention to the intercooler.

Remove the front half of the exhaust and remove all oil/sludge deposits. Check that the catalytic converter is not blocked - soak in cleaner and reverse-blow through if necessary. Back pressure caused by a blocked converter can do all sorts of damage.

Remove all oil feed pipes to/from the turbo, flush and clean. When refitting, prime with oil where possible.

Check that the oil supply pipe is providing a good flow of oil (they didn't tell me how to do this though!)

Drop the sump off and remove oil and sludge deposits - there may be all sorts of nasty little bits of debris buried in there. Check the bottom end for any other bits that should be there while the sump is off.

Check compression on all 4 cylinders. Turbo failure can easily blow a hole in a piston, either by mechanical impact from disintegrated bits sucked in to the engine, or by the engine going rev-bananas by running on its own engine oil once it's blown a turbo impeller shaft seal (a favourite way of the Renault turbo diesel commiting suicide).

some good advice there about cleaning out the intercooler and pipes I work on alot of taxis (skoda's) and always clean out the intercooler when fitting a turbo, the amount of oil that gets in there is unbelivable.
 
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