Technical Starter Motor Failure 2005-2009 Grande Punto (1.2 8V)

[lamboboss67]

Hi everyone,

My Punto has suffered a starter motor failure. For the past 4 years or so, the car has made a single loud screeching noise upon starting the engine. At that time, I took it to my mechanic, assuming that it was a drive-belt related problem - but he assured me it was related to the starter motor and that it was merely a noise, with no particular mechanical repercussion, and that the only way to fix it would be to replace the starter (which he didn't recommend doing).

Now, as of Monday, the starter motor has totally failed. Having dug a little deeper, I now understand that there is some kind of earthing issue common in this car that results in the starter motor not disengaging at the right time upon startup - with the result that it grinds against the flywheel, this producing the screeching noise (potentially) that I had been experiencing for several years prior. I am not a mechanic so forgive me if I am making any incorrect assumptions.

On that basis I am concerned that the underlying issue of the poor earth connection must be resolved to prevent the issue from reappearing in the event of a new starter motor being fitted. However, we also now have another issue, which is that my current mechanic, who is in possession of the car as we speak, cannot locate a starter motor to fit the vehicle. He has stated that the original component which has failed has 11 teeth, whereas all available components for this precise vehicle have only 10 - and even share the same part numbers, in spite of having a different number of teeth.

As of this moment, he is attempting to refurbish the existing starter motor. I am curious as to the following:

1. Is it likely that my initial assumption is correct, and that this issue will never be resolved long-term without the earthing connection being resolved also?
2. Is there any reasoning as to the inability to acquire an 11 pin starter - presumably Fiat changed the design of this component mid-production, with the result that many vehicles cannot be fitted with the presently available OEM parts.
3. In the event that an 11 pin starter motor (if anyone has indeed ever heard of such a component?) cannot be obtained, would it be possible to simply change the flywheel also, and/or any other related components, in order to fit a 10 pin starter motor to the vehicle and all related components?

Thank you in advance for your help!

 

[bugsymike]

Hi everyone,

My Punto has suffered a starter motor failure. For the past 4 years or so, the car has made a single loud screeching noise upon starting the engine. At that time, I took it to my mechanic, assuming that it was a drive-belt related problem - but he assured me it was related to the starter motor and that it was merely a noise, with no particular mechanical repercussion, and that the only way to fix it would be to replace the starter (which he didn't recommend doing).

Now, as of Monday, the starter motor has totally failed. Having dug a little deeper, I now understand that there is some kind of earthing issue common in this car that results in the starter motor not disengaging at the right time upon startup - with the result that it grinds against the flywheel, this producing the screeching noise (potentially) that I had been experiencing for several years prior. I am not a mechanic so forgive me if I am making any incorrect assumptions.

On that basis I am concerned that the underlying issue of the poor earth connection must be resolved to prevent the issue from reappearing in the event of a new starter motor being fitted. However, we also now have another issue, which is that my current mechanic, who is in possession of the car as we speak, cannot locate a starter motor to fit the vehicle. He has stated that the original component which has failed has 11 teeth, whereas all available components for this precise vehicle have only 10 - and even share the same part numbers, in spite of having a different number of teeth.

As of this moment, he is attempting to refurbish the existing starter motor. I am curious as to the following:

1. Is it likely that my initial assumption is correct, and that this issue will never be resolved long-term without the earthing connection being resolved also?
2. Is there any reasoning as to the inability to acquire an 11 pin starter - presumably Fiat changed the design of this component mid-production, with the result that many vehicles cannot be fitted with the presently available OEM parts.
3. In the event that an 11 pin starter motor (if anyone has indeed ever heard of such a component?) cannot be obtained, would it be possible to simply change the flywheel also, and/or any other related components, in order to fit a 10 pin starter motor to the vehicle and all related components?

Thank you in advance for your help!

Original mechanic is correct in that it is not uncommon for a starter motor to make noise as engine starts up, caused by a dry bush/bearing in starter motor armature support. In the past it was common to remove starter and oil the bearing, these days many garages replace the starter at greater cost and this may have been what your mechanic was trying to save you from. Indeed I have an old Nissan that does this, I will fix at some point, but knowing what it is I don't consider it a priority at present.
Conversely I had a customer whose ignition switch was faulty which caused the starter to stay engaged after key released destroying the starter motor, so it may be an idea to check the switch side otherwise you may end up with needing another starter.
Re tooth number on starter Bendix, if the original before it started to fail had no issue with that number of teeth then it must have been correct.
However if a new starter with a different design is mounted nearer or further away from the flywheel this could affect tooth number possibly.
Found this on internet, but note, it means a different starter body!. :-

Starters with different numbers of teeth​

forvia hella
https://www.hella.com › techworld › starters-with-differ...




The number of teeth on a starter doesn't matter; the distance between the pinion and ring gear is key. A different number of teeth starter can be installed if ...
Also this :-
Will a 9 tooth starter replace an 11 tooth starter?

The only difference is the diameter of the drive gear. Since the 11-tooth drive gear has two more teeth it is naturally larger in diameter. To compensate for its smaller diameter, the center of the 9-tooth drive gear is located closer to the flywheel. Both starters are thus completely interchangeable.