Technical Pinking Panda......Help Please.....

[elbandito472]

Hey guys, I'm still sorting 'Giuseppi' (my new CLX) out, and got loads done now...new master cylinder, wheel cylinders, flexi hoses, cambelt and tensioners and i must say he is coming along nicely. However.......
one annoying issue is he tends to pink a bit up hills and between gear changes for a second....my Cinquecento sporting did this when i owned it, and it turned out to be the mapping sensor....is it possible its the same issue on Giuseppi? He is a 93 clx with injection.....if he was carb. and distributor id check the spark timing and condition of points along with the dizzy cap and rotor.....however fuel injection (even this basic) is stil reasonably new to me, so any help would be greatly appreciated. Anyone had this issue before or is it normal for injection Panda's???? Please let me know if you can help. Cheers:slayer:

 

[urchin]

I used to have the same problem with my old 1995 colour but i never got to the bottom of it I just had to live with it

 

[elbandito472]

I used to have the same problem with my old 1995 colour but i never got to the bottom of it I just had to live with it

I'm wondering if its just the way of the injection Panda's......my fiance's sister has a fizz and hers does the same.......lol. Higher octane fuel then!:slayer:

 

[CLXCraig]

Slightly OT but what causes pinking? Is it to much air or to much advance on timing...?

 

[elbandito472]

Slightly OT but what causes pinking? Is it to much air or to much advance on timing...?

Could be both of those things lol. Im gonna check all the earths, change the ht leads and plugs and then if it still does it, try a diff map sensor.....also i had forgotten but i jujst remembered while writing this...its a common issue on FIRE engines to get leaks around the inlet manifold gasket and that causes pinking too.......hmmmmmm, think i might check that first...something to keep me busy this weekend. Lol, Thanks for the help with this one guys..:slayer:

 

[CLXCraig]

could be worth changing the inlet manifold gasket i suppose if all else fails.

 

[elbandito472]

could be worth changing the inlet manifold gasket i suppose if all else fails.

Sounds like a plan te he.

 

[John H]

In 1993 two completely different fuel injection and ignition systems were used:

the very early ones used an electronic distributor - the timing adjustment is same as a normal distributor. (they had Bosch single point injection, and a catalyser in the downpipe rather than under the car).

the later (and all subsequent, AFAIK) ones used Magnetti-Marelli engine management, with the base ignition timing determined by a serrated ring on the aux belt pulley end of the crankshaft.

Our last (and now departed) '95 CLX pinked until the head gasket (and head) were changed.

Quite whether the fix for the pinking was down to a leaking inlet gasket, too much compression on a previously skimmed head, or coolant leaking into a cylinder, I'll never know.

Go with the cheapest first - inlet leak.



One other thought, there is an old-school tool which has now fallen out of favour: an inlet manifold vacuum gauge.

You can tell a lot about the health of an engine using one, including inlet leaks.

There are lots of guides if you google "using a vacuum gauge". Some are even in UK English.

 

[CLXCraig]

how do they attach to the inlet manifold?

may look into this at sometime

 

[Chas Uno]

how do they attach to the inlet manifold?

may look into this at sometime

You drill and tap a hole into it, then screw in a hose union. The vacuum pipe then connects to this and the gauge.

Alternatively, you can do what the some of the mk1 Unos did. Some models (45S and 60S) came fitted with an 'Econometer', which was just a vacuum gauge under another name. They tapped into the brake servo vacuum pipe using a T piece, which then ran a smaller vacuum pipe to the electronic sender for the gauge. If you tapped into the brake servo vacuum pipe you could send a vacuum reading to an aftermarket mechanical gauge. Obviously though this would only work on Pandas that came fitted with servo brakes!

 

[CLXCraig]

i dont have servo brakes and dont fancy drilling into the manifold

what about vacumm advance for dizzy? same idea be applied as brake vacuum,?

 

[John H]

i dont have servo brakes and dont fancy drilling into the manifold

what about vacumm advance for dizzy?

Yes, that works. You can pull the pipe off the advance unit and fit the gauge there.

But it's better with some extra pipe and a "T" adapter so the vacuum advance effect on the timing is correct, and any air leakage is apparent too.

Equally, if you have a distributor with vacuum advance, the advance capsule is well known for "popping". If you can blow through it, it's broken.

If advance capsule is broken and the timing has been advanced to 15 BTDC at idle, it will pink like nobodies business because the timing doesn't retard when you put your foot down, and you've extra air through the leak too.

 

[Chas Uno]

i dont have servo brakes and dont fancy drilling into the manifold

what about vacumm advance for dizzy? same idea be applied as brake vacuum,?

For some reason, all cars I've seen with vacuum gauges have different take offs for the gauge and for the vacuum advance unit. Maybe having both on the same vacuum pipe would affect each other?

If your Panda doesn't have a brake servo then maybe you still have the vacuum take off for it on the manifold? It may simply have a blanking bolt that you could remove and then fit a vacuum take off nipple. If so, then I suspect you'd only need a reducer to fit the size of pipe of pipe required for the gauge

 

[elbandito472]

In 1993 two completely different fuel injection and ignition systems were used:

the very early ones used an electronic distributor - the timing adjustment is same as a normal distributor. (they had Bosch single point injection, and a catalyser in the downpipe rather than under the car).

the later (and all subsequent, AFAIK) ones used Magnetti-Marelli engine management, with the base ignition timing determined by a serrated ring on the aux belt pulley end of the crankshaft.

Our last (and now departed) '95 CLX pinked until the head gasket (and head) were changed.

Quite whether the fix for the pinking was down to a leaking inlet gasket, too much compression on a previously skimmed head, or coolant leaking into a cylinder, I'll never know.

Go with the cheapest first - inlet leak.



One other thought, there is an old-school tool which has now fallen out of favour: an inlet manifold vacuum gauge.

You can tell a lot about the health of an engine using one, including inlet leaks.

There are lots of guides if you google "using a vacuum gauge". Some are even in UK English.

You are quite right sir....unfortunately i have the tempremental italian latter option lol. Hoping its not the headgasket....all the levels seem fine so im hoping for an air leak.....well not hoping for an air leak...but hoping an air leak is the problem..... Cheers.