Technical Panda 750 Gearbox Assumptions

[biggelmo]

Hi, Ive been competing in Sprints & Hillclimbs in my much modified Cinquecento Sporting and now need to fit a gearbox with a shorter diff for better acceleration.
After lots of Googling and ePER searches I think a Panda 750 box could be what I'm after.
Am I correct with the following, the Panda 750 Gearbox has a or is a.......

C514 5 speed.
4.20:1 final drive diff ratio
Cable gear change
Bolted crownwheel - NOT BONDED

I will be fitting a Quaife diff so the bolted crownwheel is very important

Any other knowledge on this gearbox would be very helpful

 

[rendo]

Not sure, but mine is a 4 speed.

sorry, not much help

 

[JimMagill]

I fitted an 1108 to my 750L and yes, it is certainly lower geared. I can spin the wheels in second...

Thou this may be due more to the Polish tyres but it's still quite the buzzbox

Jim

 

[kolza]

Jim, is yours 5 gear?

 

[JimMagill]

4speed, the 5 speed is very rare and only came in the last cars that had the normal seats, not the Hammock style ones.

 

[Didge3]

blu73 should have a 5spd 750 gearbox available, not sure what his plans are for it though...?

4 & 5 speed 750 boxes differ by the 5spd has the same ratios as the 999cc gearbox but a shorter final drive. However the 34hp 750 would spin its wheels in 3rd if you were exciting a roundabout hard enough with the 5spd so still mightly low gearing!

 

[kolza]

Even if you will find one the chances for it to be cable driven are low.

 

[panda-sport]

Am I correct with the following, the Panda 750 Gearbox has a or is a.......

C514 5 speed.

NO

4.20:1 final drive diff ratio

it is low

Cable gear change.

NO twin rod

Bolted crownwheel - NOT BONDED.

NO its bonded

I will be fitting a Quaife diff so the bolted crownwheel is very important.

Quaife do not make a diff that fits this gearbox

 

[blu73]

blu73 should have a 5spd 750 gearbox available, not sure what his plans are for it though...?

4 & 5 speed 750 boxes differ by the 5spd has the same ratios as the 999cc gearbox but a shorter final drive. However the 34hp 750 would spin its wheels in 3rd if you were exciting a roundabout hard enough with the 5spd so still mightly low gearing!

that box is still in the car, just connected to a p75 instead

 

[Didge3]

that box is still in the car, just connected to a p75 instead

Ah never mind then That p75 will spin those wheels in 4th probably unless you get bigger tyres

 

[blu73]

Yes Dom, gears are so short should make for some interesting traffic light grand prix's lol... new wheels are 13" still but are 6j, not sure what size tyres i will be using yet though..

back to the original topic and not just my not sober no you can't have my gearbox post lol..

750 box i have is rod not cable - sure that could be swapped over to cable with faffing though.

Its a wet-shaft box, unlike the cento box (well the 1.1 boxes at least) if you damage a boot all the gearbox oil falls out and all the other people at the hillclimb will hate you forever and ever lol.
panda-sport quaife don't list a diff for it no but there was a group buy in the cento section many years ago for some quaife LSD's and they require the box to have a bolted crown wheel rather than bonded so the OP could very well have one of these to fit, he isn't mental, it is a thing. Quite a few are still floating around as we needed, from memory, 10 to be made for quaife to agree to make them - i know of at least 2 people who have at least one sitting doing nothing who bought multiple units to get the group buy done. Really wanted one for my turbo but could justify the expense..

If I were you biggelmo I'd forget about a panda box - the seicento abarth and schumachers had a slightly shorter final drive - this was because they came with slightly bigger wheel and tyre combo and they would have been slower than a normal sporting without it.

OR

Find a 6 speed from a mk2 punto sporting, the only downside to using the 6 speed is you lose a little bit of steering angle but put some stoppers on the rack to stop the wheel hitting the gearbox and you'll be good, its more when doing a 3 point turn in the road that you notice the lack of angle than actually it ever being an issue. The 6 speed has closer ratios obviously but it also must have a shorter final drive because once in 6th you are at higher revs than a 5 speed at the same speed.

So yeah, i'd go with one of them boxes myself, from what i have read the whole bonded/bolted crown wheel thing seems to be a bit hit and miss, no-one i know has been able to categorically say these models have bolted and these bonded, doesn't seem to be any pattern to it.

 

[panda-sport]

panda-sport quaife don't list a diff for it no but there was a group buy in the cento section many years ago for some quaife LSD's and they require the box to have a bolted crown wheel rather than bonded so the OP could very well have one of these to fit, he isn't mental, it is a thing. Quite a few are still floating around as we needed, from memory, 10 to be made for quaife to agree to make them - i know of at least 2 people who have at least one sitting doing nothing who bought multiple units to get the group buy done. Really wanted one for my turbo but could justify the expense..

I know quaife make a diff for the cento/punto/500 box, I've used one. You can buy them new from quaife, however they do not fit the classic panda gearbox in any way or form. There is a reason I have fitted cinq and 500 boxes to a couple of my pandas, it wasn't for the ratios

 

[blu73]

do they actually list an actual lsd now then? i appreciate its been literally years and years since that initial group buy so i guess that entirely plausible.

random question then for my curiousity... if you fit cento box on a panda what driveshafts do you use? is there a factory driveshaft the right length. Something i had considered doing in mine at some point was swapping to a dry shaft box.

 

[biggelmo]

OK thanks for all the help and replies, it now seems the Panda 750 box is not the answer to my prayers, I'll keep looking for a 4.06:1 Seicento box.
Other options are a Mk1 Punto 55 6 speed box with its 4.9:1 FD ratio or a Mk2 Punto Sporting 6 speed box with its 4.06:1, whatever I end up with it'll have to have the diff housing removed to confirm what the ratio & crownwheel fitting is before I buy it.