Technical Lightning for MOT

[SDHXIII]

Hello.

I have RHD (originally Italian registered) 500F, which I purchased after the previous owner has fully restored it. It came with an MOT (6 months left). I have not done anything with the lighting other than replace a bulb.

I put it through its MOT last week and it failed because:

"006 Direction indicator adversely affected by the operation of another lamp nearside front (comes on when side light operated)"

Basically when I switch the lights on (via dashboard switch and subsequent stalk switches) the front indicators come on as a solid lamp. When I indicate the isolid element stays on and the second elelemenflash as they should.

My indicators are white bulbs with the orange plastic transparent cover. I have some seen other 500's that have clear covers.

Given that the car passed its last MOT with the same thing happening when lights were on which is right and which is wrong?

Any ideas gratefully received.

Stu...

*************
1969 FIAT 110 F (Berlina) 500

 

[AndrewHarvey]

This is a popular problem.
The issue is that for uk use you need white side lights and orange indicators
One solution is the use of uk spec headlamps with side lights (kinda) built in
Other option is white lenses with dual colour LED lamps one white one orange
This is the option I carried out - total cost £15

 

[Vitesse]

Hi Stu by the book it is an MOT failure so it shouldn't have passed first time around really.

I assume it is a RHD conversion if originally it came from Italy? Also it appears to have the LHD Italian wiring which explains why it has the double filament bulb in the indicator/side lights and originally would have clear lenses. RHD cars have a small bulb in the headlights for the side lights.

Some people have successfully passed the MOT with clear lenses as I should imagine they are deemed a little bit safer than having an orange side light on all the time, as someone might just glance at it at a junction and assume you are turning???

The only way to guarantee a pass is to change it to the setup with the side light in the headlight or find a less demanding MOT tester. The more sensible ones, in my opinion, realise that most of these cars are nearly 50 years old and are a little bit more forgiving. It's certainly the case with my one.

Tony

 

[Vitesse]

This is a popular problem.
The issue is that for uk use you need white side lights and orange indicators
One solution is the use of uk spec headlamps with side lights (kinda) built in
Other option is white lenses with dual colour LED lamps one white one orange
This is the option I carried out - total cost £15

Is it a single bulb with two separate LED's in Andrew?

 

[g8rpi]

To be legal in the UK you must have a white "front position light" (sidelight). The best solution is to fit a headlamp with integral sidelight. You could just drill the reflector and fit a clip-in lamp but this is likely to result in rusting of the reflector long term. A combined side light and indicator is not acceptable.
http://www.legislation.gov.uk/uksi/1989/1796/schedule/1/made
http://www.legislation.gov.uk/uksi/1989/1796/schedule/2/made

Robert G8RPI.

 

[AndrewHarvey]

It is a single lamp - two positive terminals - one gives white illumination one orange.
With clear lense - MOT pass

 

[g8rpi]

Re: Lighting for MOT

It is a single lamp - two positive terminals - one gives white illumination one orange.
With clear lense - MOT pass

Hi,
It may have passed the MOT, but it does not meet the regulations. Also what happens to the indicator visibility when the side lights switched on? Does the side light go out when you indicate? This is the only way I could see this arrangement being practically acceptable regardless of legality. A white light getting brighter and yellow does not have the same visibility as a flashing yellow. On a separate issue, LED replacements don't meet the requirements either as they are not approved and E marked.


Robert G8RPI.

 

[AndrewHarvey]

White lamp is on when side lights / dipped beam is activated. Orange can flash at any time separately or in conjunction with white lamp still being activated

 

[SDHXIII]

Problem solved. I hope.

At the moment, strictly speaking the car is an MOT failure.

If I have orange covers the side/parking lamp will always be on when lights are switched on. Failure due to orange lamp.

If I have white covers the flasher will be white. Failure due to non orange signal.

Solution. Unplug the wire which operates the solid lamp under orange cover. When lights are switched on the parking lamp does not come on but when I indicate they still flash.

Only problem might be if working parking lights are compulsory or just an option...

 

[g8rpi]

Re: Lighting for MOT

Problem solved. I hope.

At the moment, strictly speaking the car is an MOT failure.

If I have orange covers the side/parking lamp will always be on when lights are switched on. Failure due to orange lamp.

If I have white covers the flasher will be white. Failure due to non orange signal.

Solution. Unplug the wire which operates the solid lamp under orange cover. When lights are switched on the parking lamp does not come on but when I indicate they still flash.

Only problem might be if working parking lights are compulsory or just an option...

Side position lights are mandatory. See links on earlier post.


Robert G8RPI.

 

[Bleeding Knuckles]

White lamp is on when side lights / dipped beam is activated. Orange can flash at any time separately or in conjunction with white lamp still being activated

Andrew, can you please point me to the LED lamps you have used. I have the same system with white lamps side/indicator and have been lucky enough to have a sympathetic MOT tester!!!!

Ian.

 

[Pete145]

Hi Stu,

Yes, as others have pointed out this is very common. My car passed TWO MoTs here in the UK before failing for essentially the same issue.

I eventually went for orange indicators and separate sidelights wired in to the headlights, Middle Barton did this for me while they were doing some other work.

I'd actually bought some UK spec, RHD headlights (with the sidelights included) from Ricambio to complete the fix myself, but Middle Barton got the jump on me, so I've essentially got a brand new, compliant pair still sitting in their boxes in the garage. If you're interested in taking them off my hands (for a reduced price) just send me a private message and we'll figure something out.

Pete

 

[SDHXIII]

I eventually went for orange indicators and separate sidelights wired in to the headlights, Middle Barton did this for me while they were doing some other work.
Pete

Having read the history file and having had a fiddle, it would appear that the car already has the UK RHD spec headlight which have sidelights built in.

Thanks for all the advice and thanks Pete for your kind offer, which I probably would have taken you up on.

Hopefully the car will now pass the MOT on Monday, ready for its first display the following weekend...

...I will let you.

 

[Pete145]

Thanks for all the advice and thanks Pete for your kind offer, which I probably would have taken you up on.

Hopefully the car will now pass the MOT on Monday, ready for its first display the following weekend...

...I will let you.

No problem, and good luck! Sounds like you've got it sorted.