Technical Lancia Y longer 5th gear

[840rosso]

Hello everyone,

This is my first post. I have a 1999 Lancia Y 840 elefantino rosso, basically a Punto 176. It has the 5 speed gearbox (C514, I think, could anyone confirm?) with the ratios:
1. 3.909
2. 2.158
3. 1.480
4. 1.121
5. 0.897
These seems to be quite common. The final drive is 4.071, shorter than the 3.867 of the 1.2 8v and 3.733 of the 16v Y, which is fun, but a bit too short for the highway (4000rpm at 120 km/h). First I thought of changing it for a 6-speed C514, but that's quite expensive and difficult, so I'm now considering just changing the 5th gear for a longer one. This seems to be quite easy, since the 5th gear can be accessed directly from behind the driver's wheel. The actual problem is finding the gears to change them with. Has anyone ever done this and has some experience?
The Y 840 had the option for a 6 speed with a 5th gear of 0.766 and a 6th gear of 0.640 (which I believe is different from the 6speed Punto 176). Would the 0.766 5th gear be interchangeable with the 5th gear from my Y? Are the C514 5-speed and C514 6-speed the same?
The Panda 169 1.3 Multijet with 75PS had a C514R gearbox (and I guess the 199 Punto as well) with a 5th gear of 0.766. Is this the same as the 5th gear of the 6speed C514? What are the differences between the C514 and the C514R?
Is there any other possible gear to change for?

Thank you very much

Henrique

 

[rmjbn1]

Hi and welcome @840rosso

Sorry you've not had any replies, Punto Mk1 pages have gone a bit quiet.

There have been a few gearbox swaps on here, eg:

5sp gearbox swap with Ford Ka - gear ratios [2012 Punto Pop 1.2] | FIAT Grande Punto

This might be a daft question but..... I've just had a used Ford Ka gearbox fitted in a 2012 Punto Pop 1.2. The car definitely feels like it has higher gearing now. A Ka of the same age had 14" wheels as OE (versus 15" OE on the Punto) so I guess the final drive ratio could be higher to make...

www.fiatforum.com

Punto, Panda, 500, Ford Ka, gearboxes from equivalent engines physically fit, have different ratios for different weights of car, final drive seems to be biggest difference.

Maybe as there's not much supply of individual gears, but plenty of gearboxes, this might be a solution? You'd lose on acceleration with a taller final drive.

The six speed box is longer, used in the 100hp Panda it results in less steering lock.

This might be a useful resource for gear ratios:

GEARBOX - Fiat - GRANDE PUNTO - eLearn - 4CarData

 

[Seatpanda]

Hello everyone,

This is my first post. I have a 1999 Lancia Y 840 elefantino rosso, basically a Punto 176. It has the 5 speed gearbox (C514, I think, could anyone confirm?) with the ratios:
1. 3.909
2. 2.158
3. 1.480
4. 1.121
5. 0.897
These seems to be quite common. The final drive is 4.071, shorter than the 3.867 of the 1.2 8v and 3.733 of the 16v Y, which is fun, but a bit too short for the highway (4000rpm at 120 km/h). First I thought of changing it for a 6-speed C514, but that's quite expensive and difficult, so I'm now considering just changing the 5th gear for a longer one. This seems to be quite easy, since the 5th gear can be accessed directly from behind the driver's wheel. The actual problem is finding the gears to change them with. Has anyone ever done this and has some experience?
The Y 840 had the option for a 6 speed with a 5th gear of 0.766 and a 6th gear of 0.640 (which I believe is different from the 6speed Punto 176). Would the 0.766 5th gear be interchangeable with the 5th gear from my Y? Are the C514 5-speed and C514 6-speed the same?
The Panda 169 1.3 Multijet with 75PS had a C514R gearbox (and I guess the 199 Punto as well) with a 5th gear of 0.766. Is this the same as the 5th gear of the 6speed C514? What are the differences between the C514 and the C514R?
Is there any other possible gear to change for?

Thank you very much

Henrique

Henrique

I was looking for a Fiat Punto mk1 Sporting or a Lancia Y 840 elefantino rosso gearbox that has a final drive of 4.071
I have with me a Fiat Punto mk1 75 ELX gearbox with only 93.000km on the clock
How many km's has your gearbox on the clock?
will you be interested to exchange it with mine? (3.867 final drive)

 

[840rosso]

Hello SeatPanda! Sorry for the late reply, I hadn't noticed you anwsered my threat and don't come to the forum much...

I ended up getting a new old stock 5th gear from an early Fiat Seicento (PNs 7729343 and 7729344, from galicianparts.com for 55€ plus 20€ shipping). I changed the gears a month ago and have done 3000 kms since, without issue. The 5th gear now has a ratio of 0.766 (36/47) and does 3400 rpm at 120 km/h, compared to the 4000 rpm of the original. The engine is considerably quieter and I don't feel like I'm torturing it on the highway anymore, which used to worry me a bit on longer trips on the highway. On the other hand it has less power and naturally doesn't manage to accelarate as well anymore, but that's not a problem in my case. On fuel consumption I haven't come to a conclusion yet.

So I thank you for the offer of your gearbox, but I'm happy with my solution for now. As far as I know the 1.1 Lancia Y (sold until the facelift of 2000) had the same gearbox as the Elefantino Rosso with the final drive of 4.071 and are probably much easier to find. Don't know if the 1.1 Punto used the same gearbox, they often don't match in terms of ratios, even across the same engine.

 

[Seatpanda]

Hello SeatPanda! Sorry for the late reply, I hadn't noticed you anwsered my threat and don't come to the forum much...

I ended up getting a new old stock 5th gear from an early Fiat Seicento (PNs 7729343 and 7729344, from galicianparts.com for 55€ plus 20€ shipping). I changed the gears a month ago and have done 3000 kms since, without issue. The 5th gear now has a ratio of 0.766 (36/47) and does 3400 rpm at 120 km/h, compared to the 4000 rpm of the original. The engine is considerably quieter and I don't feel like I'm torturing it on the highway anymore, which used to worry me a bit on longer trips on the highway. On the other hand it has less power and naturally doesn't manage to accelarate as well anymore, but that's not a problem in my case. On fuel consumption I haven't come to a conclusion yet.

So I thank you for the offer of your gearbox, but I'm happy with my solution for now. As far as I know the 1.1 Lancia Y (sold until the facelift of 2000) had the same gearbox as the Elefantino Rosso with the final drive of 4.071 and are probably much easier to find. Don't know if the 1.1 Punto used the same gearbox, they often don't match in terms of ratios, even across the same engine.

No worries, I have found a punto MK1 sporting gearbox for 120€ inc shipping. I would need a shorter one, but it will be very expensive