Tuning Imola finally gets boost 1242 8v mpi turbo info thread

[Lecook]

Hi guys and girls...

So the time has come for imola to become a member of the boosted cento club.. Ive decided to make a new thread to hopefully help others along the way one day and hopefully to reach out to those in the know ( I may need some help ) and also to hopefully get another thread thats easy to find for a p75 mpi based turbo conversion

So this is the plan..

P75 head that will be worked and may have a minor skim
P75 inlet and throttle body bored out to 40mm
P75 '866' camshaft
1242 8v block from a mk2 punto with 1242 16v pistons and rods (to lower the compression ratio)
As yet ive not decided what crankshaft ill be using however itll be either the standard 1242 8v item or the lightened and knife edged 8v one from the wolf direct engine
modified sump with oil return and hopefully an added breather to an oil catch can
Garret gt14559 roller bearing turbo with spi manifold modified with a turbo flange
Mocal oil cooler and thermostatic sandwich plate with braided lines
Unknown front mount intercooler will update (fmic)
Sard fuel pressure regulator (fpr)
Innovate motorsport lc2 wideband controller
Prosport boost, oil pressure and oil temp gauges

This is the initial spec of parts I have and that il shall be collecting over the next week or so, ill also be looking into a turbo timer and either the det3 from ecumaster or megasquirt as engine management, I need to get a 3bar map sensor and work out why and where a fcd gets wired in.. (more research to do)

If anyone can identify things that ill need that isnt listed above then your input would be greatly aprreciated

This will be a slow build and ill update as and when progress happens

Cheers in advance

Lee

 

[MazCinq]

looks like you have the basics covered.

 

[fingers99]

Main thing that falls to my mind is management.

 

[Lecook]

Main thing that falls to my mind is management.

Yes.. still something that i need to make a decision on... and also something I have no clue about (however currently reading up on it im my spare time)

Im still thinking ms2 would be a good option however have read on other forums that its not a great on the reliability side of things??? however if I were to get it id have it built rather then building it myself... pros to it are there are many places in the uk and even some mobile tuners that will come out to the car and live map... obviously at a cost but saves trailer hire and moving the car around thd country.. also the added gadgets being the switchable maps and launch control.. and if im correct solinoid boost control too?? And another bonus being I can connect my wideband controller to it and type in a target afr for it to constantly adjust to the best possible afr...

Another option is the ecumaster det3... nice and easy to wire in due to it being a piggyback.. alot cheaper with the same gadgets as the ms2.. alot more base maps are available through the poles however I think it would be more difficult to have tuned in the uk.. this is my main concern..

the other option is to go to emerald and let them do their magic... and just foot the bill

 

[fingers99]

Or the full ECU ECU Master do?

Can't see any reason why MS2 would be less reliable than anything else.

 

[craigb244]

Megasquirt is very reliable it just comes down to how well it's fitted. I've seen just as many high end ecu fitted with wiring just twisted and tapped together as I have megasquirt.

My megasquirt has everything running on it and would put any expensive ecu to shame and has also been 100% reliable... So yeah

 

[woj]

I would consider EMU from ECU master, they actually now have a UK base page:

http://www.ecumaster.co.uk/products

It will do everything for you, including wideband (not sure how to get the signal out for a clock, but it should be possible), boost control, and launch control. Then you can save on Innovate which IMO is a waste of money considering the other options you have. I know you have doubts about finding a tuner, but to be honest the system is so easy to work with that I cannot imagine an experienced tuner not to be able to get round to tuning it in half a day or so.

(You can also always talk to me about getting the 8V MPI ECU fully premapped for your engine , no wideband in this case).

Not sure why you all guys insists on mounting an aftermarket fuel pressure regulator. The MPI fuel rail have a fully capable 2.5 bar regulator, and if that is not enough it can be easily replaced with 3, 3.5, or 4 bar Bosch regulator for peanuts. I run the 2.5 bar stock one since the first day of my turbo and never ever had any fuel pressure related problems.

 

[craigb244]

I agree woj people keep fitting fpr when the Bosch ones are spot on. Have been used for years and still used on most cars now.

Oem reliability. Something that cost millions to design, yet people replace them with some shiny chinese tat

I think they are all 1:1 regulators to so will always keep the injector pressure up on boost

 

[Lecook]

I agree woj people keep fitting fpr when the Bosch ones are spot on. Have been used for years and still used on most cars now.

Oem reliability. Something that cost millions to design, yet people replace them with some shiny chinese tat

I think they are all 1:1 regulators to so will always keep the injector pressure up on boost

I plan on using the p75 inlet and rail which has a webber fpr doesnt have much written on it but makes little sense to me

It is as follows

rpm 36
250kpa
2067/01

I also plan to place a 1l swirl pot either just out of the tank or in the engine bay due to having fuelling issues before with my 16v conversion mounted to a inline fuel pump to the rail

megasquirt is my current favorite as its been tried and tested many a time on centos however the loom building side of things doesnt sound fun

lee

 

[craigb244]

Might be Webber but still a Bosch part.

I used standard p75 fuel rail with regulator all the way until I went 16v and that has the same regulator on the rail.

It will have a non running(no vac) fuel pressure of 2.5 bar and about 1.7 (iirc) at idle
Once on boost it will increase pressure to compensate for boost pressure (so at 1bar of boost it will have 3.5 bar at the fuel rail so keeping 2.5bar at the injectors)

 

[Lecook]

Might be Webber but still a Bosch part.

I used standard p75 fuel rail with regulator all the way until I went 16v and that has the same regulator on the rail.

It will have a non running(no vac) fuel pressure of 2.5 bar and about 1.7 (iirc) at idle
Once on boost it will increase pressure to compensate for boost pressure (so at 1bar of boost it will have 3.5 bar at the fuel rail so keeping 2.5bar at the injectors)

Cheers for clearing that up for me ive just been reading the user manual for the emu and its looking like a strong contender if im honest... the only thing I havent worked out is whether is supports solinoid boost control?? As purely out of choice id like to use it over the bleed valve adjustment

cheers
lee

 

[craigb244]

In not sure how much then ecu are but they should be good. I had their haldex controller on my Audi TT and it was a brilliant but of kit but very expensive (but then no one else makes them so they can charge what ever they like)

 

[craigb244]

In not sure how much then ecu are but they should be good. I had their haldex controller on my Audi TT and it was a brilliant but of kit but very expensive (but then no one else makes them so they can charge what ever they like)

 

[Lecook]

In not sure how much then ecu are but they should be good. I had their haldex controller on my Audi TT and it was a brilliant but of kit but very expensive (but then no one else makes them so they can charge what ever they like)

Theyre around about the same money as a megasquirt I think.. theyre around £600 on ebay but in sure like the ms itll be possible to find cheaper

 

[fingers99]

I also plan to place a 1l swirl pot either just out of the tank or in the engine bay due to having fuelling issues before with my 16v conversion mounted to a inline fuel pump to the rail

Simpler, I'd have thought, just to fit an in tank pump with higher capacity. Literally, just pull the old pump out, stick a decent Walbro or Bosch one in. No need to over complicate things!

 

[Lecook]

Simpler, I'd have thought, just to fit an in tank pump with higher capacity. Literally, just pull the old pump out, stick a decent Walbro or Bosch one in. No need to over complicate things!

I currently run the 1.4 16v pump from the mk2b however ive had problems from day one of it some how lifting itself out of the fuel pump housing... its held in to the housing with a jubilee yet over the space of a couple of months its some how lifted from the bottom of the housing.. leading to fuel cut when cornering hard when I get down to around 1/4 of a tank of fuel... it didnt do any damage to the 16v however the turbo engine most likely wont be so forgiving

 

[fingers99]

The one Imola Blue has is a straight fit in place of the stock 1.1 SPI one. I think about £85 from glencoe. I'll dig out the part number tomorrow if you like. Never had an issue with it.

 

[woj]

the only thing I havent worked out is whether is supports solinoid boost control??

Yes it does, and with a twin map too. The problem with the downloadable manual is that it is incomplete. What I did is I downloaded the PC software and went through it (it will will work without the ECU, you can even save projects I think).

 

[Lecook]

The one Imola Blue has is a straight fit in place of the stock 1.1 SPI one. I think about £85 from glencoe. I'll dig out the part number tomorrow if you like. Never had an issue with it.

Ive got a mate thats selling a walbro 255 for not alot of money, ive been considering that for a while, maybe I should snap that up??
woj looking into it a little more im thinking what does it do better than the det3, the emu is nearly £800 from the uk supplier and for that money theres emerald just up the road from me

I need to look up some more options and shoot a few more emails to different companies

Cheers
lee

 

[The Black Box]

I'd go for that walbro fuel pump myself a very vital component so pays to get a decent one same with fpr. I'm fairly sure det3 supports a wideband input. That's tge route I would go just means you've got a base na map to work from rather than starting from scratch.

tb I'm making an adaptor for mine so that a 16v tb can be mounted onto a p75 inlet just means you haven't got coolant running through it like the 8v ones have also opens up the possibility of using the bigger marea? Tb which I think might be too big but worth a try.

Cranks I thought I read somewhere that 16v cranks are better than 8v ones not sure worth a look?