How to access the strainer / internal filter on a Bosch CP1H3 0 445 010 266 / 0445010266 ?

[Matt Quinn]

Can anyone out there advise the correct or at least a sensible procedure for removing the inlet pipe - and thereafter remove/replace the strainer (items 29 and 81 on the diagram below) - on the 0 445 010 266 HP pump as fitted to a 1.3 JTD - in this particular case it's on a Qubo, and looks to be accessible on the car.

- Whilst the diagram seems to suggest/hint this is a screw-in item or at least has a hex head to it; the photograph of the actual pump indicates it hasn't. I'm not about to butcher the thing with screwdrivers, pliers or do the 'bull at a gate' thing. I'd rather acquire the correct tool - if I don't already have it; but am willing to listen to more experienced people. - Advice on re-fitting would also be useful. My intention is to fit a new replacement strainer.

 

[bugsymike]

I have always found Darwen Diesels in Blackburn to be very helpful and may be able to supply a suitable extractor/ replacer as well as the filter and maybe with advice on how to do the job.
It's not something I have ever fitted although I did look into the Peugeot video about a return filter but on an earlier pump than yours as it spoke of removing a blank to access that filter, when doing my Scudo as same 2.litre engine but unfortunately not Bosch pump but Siemens.
Just another thought you mention inlet pipe, have you checked where pipe goes as may be the return to the fuel tank as I have a feeling in the video it mentions it being a return, I may be wrong but with vehicle there you will be able to see where the canister fuel filter is in the route to confirm.
Looking at your diagram I agree with you, I don't think it is screwed in, more likely pressed or driven in with a sealing ring, so not something to easily pull out without suitable extractor tool.

 

[Matt Quinn]

Hi Mike - I did look at the Darwen site as I was looking for an alternative to injectionpumps.co.uk - But Darwen had neither the strainer or the inlet pipe listed. I've ordered the 'filter' from the cryptic 'Diesel Injection Pumps' link shown in the other thread... Used PayPal and a Creit Card for safety; we'll see what, if anything, turns up!

Yes; the video - which tackles the 'long' version of the pump - does indeed appear to reference the return line; i.e. that running over-pressure. You can find the diagram I'm using here at: http://dieselcatalog.online/en/bosch/04450/0445010266.html

The pump in question is a 0 445 010 266 - different from that in the commonly-found diagram. The photograph is of the pump on my car - I've actually changed the fuel filter, and can confirm the white 'star' connector is indeed the supply from it.

A 'blank' does indeed seem to require removal to access the same strainer on the 'long' version of the pump - as per the other thread on the subject.

 

[bugsymike]

Hi Mike - I did look at the Darwen site as I was looking for an alternative to injectionpumps.co.uk - But Darwen had neither the strainer or the inlet pipe listed. I've ordered the 'filter' from the cryptic 'Diesel Injection Pumps' link shown in the other thread... Used PayPal and a Creit Card for safety; we'll see what, if anything, turns up!

Yes; the video - which tackles the 'long' version of the pump - does indeed appear to reference the return line; i.e. that running over-pressure. You can find the diagram I'm using here at: http://dieselcatalog.online/en/bosch/04450/0445010266.html

The pump in question is a 0 445 010 266 - different from that in the commonly-found diagram. The photograph is of the pump on my car - I've actually changed the fuel filter, and can confirm the white 'star' connector is indeed the supply from it.

A 'blank' does indeed seem to require removal to access the same strainer on the 'long' version of the pump - as per the other thread on the subject.

That seems to make more sense having a filter stopping the dirt before the high pressure side than that other one.

 

[Matt Quinn]

That seems to make more sense having a filter stopping the dirt before the high pressure side than that other one.

It does indeed... Quite where those guys in the videos had their pressure gauges tee-d in to the system isn't clear (is it really the return - or the feed?); and is there perhaps something more complex about the feed/return arrangements that makes that particular mode of measurement relevant? - We do seem to see some filters (for example) that are more complex than just 'in and out inline' - as the Qubo one is.

Anyway... at least a little more information has emerged from that discussion. Let's hope this actually is progress!

 

[bugsymike]

On the Merlin leak off at 400 rpm at the other end of data it mentions idle, is this because the cam driven pump is actually running at half engine speed, if so 9cc per minute would seem quite conservative but for a serviced/new injector may be what is expected?
When I tested a Ford Focus with the dodgy injector it was at engine cranking and was quite noticeable worse than the other three, but that engine wouldn't even start until new injector/exchange fitted.

 

[Matt Quinn]

On the Merlin leak off at 400 rpm at the other end of data it mentions idle, is this because the cam driven pump is actually running at half engine speed, if so 9cc per minute would seem quite conservative but for a serviced/new injector may be what is expected?
When I tested a Ford Focus with the dodgy injector it was at engine cranking and was quite noticeable worse than the other three, but that engine wouldn't even start until new injector/exchange fitted.

...That never occurred to me; I hadn't given any thought to the ratio between the crankshaft and camshaft speed - and was under the impression the HP pump was driven at engine speed; quite where I got that (obviously wrong) idea from I cannot remember. Still 9ml/min for a 'new' injector isn't light-years away from the worst one in the set. - So in terms of causing pressure collapse on the rail; still quite far away. If I get a chance tomorrow I might try and repeat the test less carelessly.

 

[Matt Quinn]

So... it seems that the 'correct' tool for the job is one of these things... A sort of 'slide hammer' arrangement with a kind of split sleeve arrangement at the end; two sizes 8mm and 10mm apparently. - Trouble is; it's sold by a somewhat obscure Italian company - I suspect it's not cheap either. Bosch do do a thing too - it seems to be even more obscure!

SRN.101.276

EXTRACTOR KIT FOR INLET AND RETURN CONNECTIONS OF COMMON RAIL CP1 / CP1H / CP1H3 / CP1K PUMP. NOTE: DIAM. 8MM, 10MM.

srn-mi.com

Somehow, this thing reminds me VERY much of the slide hammers used to extract the injectors from certain Jaguar/Land Rover engines. -At least we now know that the inlet is 'tapped' out, rather than twisted or levered. - Time for a think methinks; as to what more common items might be pressed into service. - Watch this space.

 

[bugsymike]

So... it seems that the 'correct' tool for the job is one of these things... A sort of 'slide hammer' arrangement with a kind of split sleeve arrangement at the end; two sizes 8mm and 10mm apparently. - Trouble is; it's sold by a somewhat obscure Italian company - I suspect it's not cheap either. Bosch do do a thing too - it seems to be even more obscure!

View attachment 437432

SRN.101.276

EXTRACTOR KIT FOR INLET AND RETURN CONNECTIONS OF COMMON RAIL CP1 / CP1H / CP1H3 / CP1K PUMP. NOTE: DIAM. 8MM, 10MM.

srn-mi.com

Somehow, this thing reminds me VERY much of the slide hammers used to extract the injectors from certain Jaguar/Land Rover engines. -At least we now know that the inlet is 'tapped' out, rather than twisted or levered. - Time for a think methinks; as to what more common items might be pressed into service. - Watch this space.

That tool design makes sense, do you have the facilities to drill a block of metal and saw it length ways to make a good fit over the pipe? It would still need to be clamped together tightly and fit a slide hammer as I think the shock of the slide hammer is probably more effective than a straight puller arrangement.
The other problem is accessibility, does it need the pump to be off the vehicle.
On a much bigger scale when working on Lada (Fiat 124 under license) the tool for removing rear half shaft bearings was a large tube with two split collets that went over the bearing, the large tube held it in place and then we used a press to remove the bearing.
It would help if possible to test either by flow or pressure, to see if the filter is blocked before going to the trouble. Also if so compared with the cost of a local Diesel Specialist with the correct tool doing the job, or a good s/h pump?
Another thought if your correct replacement pipe has arrived , can a local engineering shop make up a adaptor at a viable price.
If you have the correct name for the tool , there is always a slim chance that someone on eBay is selling a cheap chinese copy somewhere.

 

[Matt Quinn]

It would help if possible to test either by flow or pressure, to see if the filter is blocked before going to the trouble. Also if so compared with the cost of a local Diesel Specialist with the correct tool doing the job, or a good s/h pump?

The filter/strainer in question is (according to the diagram) directly behind that inlet pipe... flow up to the pump is via a new lift pump and filter; so the only way to 'test' that strainer is to remove it - and either replace it or (as some in those videos seem to do) omit it. - The only other indicator/clues as to input flow are the pressure figures on the rail (which I've questioned elsewhere) the very similar symptoms reported elsewhere (again, examined in other threads) and the 'history/mode of failure of the problem.

As you imply Mike - it would be good to 'prove' the nature of the fault before proceeding any further; I do have some thoughts on this which I'll explore over the next day or two, and perhaps report back on the original threads in the model-specific section.

A better design (what Bosch have done here is either devious or incompetent - it's a terrible design) in my view would have made access to that service part simpler with common tools - i.e. they should have threaded the inlet. I'm giving thought as to whether its coming replacement should be left out; and a simple generic 'inline' filter cut into the fuel pipe...

Yes - to get 'back on the road' a second hand (or at least substitute) pump might be the more viable option.

Back to the removal - and the bay of fleas do have adaptors for the Jaguar/Land Rover injector;

...One of these might be ideal for the job - or completely useless!

I was rather hoping someone else out there had already discovered such a thing and could say one way or another. However finding out what the tool actually is (along with the method of removal) has set me thinking.

 

[bugsymike]

The tool in your photo appears to be for V8 Petrol engine Jags injector removal, I couldn't find the dimensions of the collet end so probably best ignored.
Maybe a silly suggestion, but any chance of back flushing through pump from the return to tank end of low pressure side of pump, so fuel runs out of that inlet pipe, maybe with a very gentle "twizzle" with a cotton bud to see if any particles dislodged could be examined, as you would be directing any debris out of the pump inlet side by that reverse action.
I wouldn't be tempted to leave the filter out as any debris must be very fine if it has already gone through a proper diesel fuel filter element on bulkhead.
When Ford Transits started appearing at auctions some years ago with common rail high pressure pump failure requiring new pumps etc. the concensus in the trade at the time was dodgy low pressure pump in the tank having bearing failure, working it's way into the system damaging high pressure pump and injectors so traders tended to give them a wide birth as I understand. I was not involved in it, as not a trader and given their habits of trying to discourage other bidders by any means, much of what they said was taken with a pinch of salt.

 

[Matt Quinn]

Maybe a silly suggestion, but any chance of back flushing through pump from the return to tank end of low pressure side of pump, so fuel runs out of that inlet pipe, maybe with a very gentle "twizzle" with a cotton bud to see if any particles dislodged could be examined, as you would be directing any debris out of the pump inlet side by that reverse action.
I wouldn't be tempted to leave the filter out as any debris must be very fine if it has already gone through a proper diesel fuel filter element on bulkhead.

We're both silly then... that's much along the lines was thinking; although a different strategy.

My thoughts at the moment in that regard are gravitating towards taking a syringe fitted with some fine pipe (and/or a wide bore needle) and trying to extract the 'contents' of the strainer. I would also like a sample from the inside of the strainer to examine. So I plan on:

1: Extracting whatever (if any) fluid I can from the pipe/strainer
2: Taking a sample swab from inside the strainer in situ
3: Flushing out the area with some clean diesel - syringe, needle, rinse it out so the crud flushes out through the to end of the inlet pipe.

I wouldn't use a cotton bud - from experience of other systems this is something to be avoided as stray cotton fibres can cause havoc where things on the micro scale are concerned...

(For example - in the old days you 'might' clean the heads of a domestic VHS recorder with a cotton bud and alcohol, and would get away with it if you were good/careful knew what you were doing etc; but it was advised against. If you were dealing with something like an Mii machine which cost the price of a house (no, I'm not kidding!) in a broadcast environment, which had much finer tolerances you would only ever use the correct chamois cleaning sticks - for that reason! Post-mortem traces of cotton bud would be getting somebody their jotters! )

...Anyway; I digress.

Yes, 'whatever' that element is filtering, it must be very fine indeed. The new one just arrived. Overall it's just 20mm long, 5mm in diameter with the active 'screen' area being just 15mm, sealed at the end. I'm probably over-estimating the internal diameter as 4mm.

The overall internal volume of the filter is (at a generous estimate) <0.19ml - You can easily imagine that it wouldn't need to fill up with very much 'crud' to reduce that capacity dramatically! - You wouldn't actually get a cotton bud in there!

However... for various reasons (working on an assortment of very fine-scale mechanisms) I do have a supply of the soft disposable sampling swabs; of exactly the same kind you might recall were included as part of the COVID testing kits - Not only a safer bet but about the correct diameter and length to get down the inlet pipe and into the filter!

I might get a chance to do that this afternoon.