Hi

[IvaFiatNightmare]

How do you upload a post, I have typed a really good one and it has failed twice
I will start agian.
I think you have a very short login time????

 

[IvaFiatNightmare]

Re: Australian Fiat Ducato water ingress unsealed engine and rust

Hi to all the Fiat Ducato owners across the world .
It feels strange yet empowering to be able to communicate from here to so many so far away all at once.
As you will have gathered I live in the best country in the world Australia,
Especially if you love the Motor Home experience. Which I do.
There is an endless supply of larrikin characters, space views and World Heritage sites to last anyone a lifetime.
I truly :worship:love a sunburnt country,
A land of sweeping plains,
Of ragged mountain ranges,
Of drought and flooding rains,
I love her far horizons,
I love her jewel sea,
Her beauty and her terror -
The wide brown land for me.
Sorry to digress, dreaming that the great part.
All is Ok until you get a poke in the eye with a blunt stick as they say.

I currently own a 23 foot Fiat Ducato/Jayco combination
This is my second Motor Home of the same type however the Fiat component is now the upgraded new Model 160 multijet 3 litre turbo.

My story begins with the first Fiat/Jayco Motor Home I purchased (from Jayco dealer), which was supposedly Brand New or so I thought. There were no Kilometre on the 'clock' and all the advertising stickers banners alluded to it being Brand New.
I asked all the right questions, the sales person couldn't liecould he?
I found out he can and did when it was accidentally admitted to me that my specially coded Fiat entry key was lost at Australias largest Motor Home, caravan 4wd leisure show that boasted attendance of more than 80,000.
This made sense as their was unexplained damage to the interior, windows etc that was indicative of over use, yet there were no recorded Kilometres.
When I finally challenged the Jayco dealer it was admitted in writing that my Motor Home had been used for viewing at the said show.

In Australia we have legislation to provide protection for customers- Fair Trading Dept ending with the Consumers Trade and Tenancy Tribunal (CTTT). When threatened with this the Jayco dealer submitted securing me a replacement Brand New Motor Home.
I thought that would be the end of it. I was excited, the new 'Born to be a Motor Home' Fiat Ducato 160 Multijet 3 Litre Turbo Diesel sounded 'flash, very swanky' but so does Myocardial Infarct of Cerebral Vascular Attack which is what I had when I popped the bonnet at 600kms.
OMG OMG what I saw defies belief especially on a brand new Motor Home only a few months old.
My engine compartment looked like it had been submerged under water for 50 years (ofcourse it wasn't). The metal engine block was white with corrosion, the injector well was full of water, needless to say the injectors were badly rusted as were other metal parts, the bonnet insulation was wet and mouldy and I had already had other problems dealt with.
Horrified and suffering another check engine light problem I returned to the Fiat service yard.
Yes I was another victim of the Fiat Water Ingress that is so widely reported on your European sites.
However I learnt of a Fiat Negligence that I have not yet seen reported which was the obvious reason that my engine looked as it did.
Three individual Fiat Reps told me "Fiat forgot to seal the engines at the Factory"and "thats what the recall is for" :devil::devil::devil:'s
In Australia we were delivered a recall notice stating it may be necessary to 'apply a sealing coating to the injectors area'.
This was an absolute lie and a trap to lure customers into the service yards.
This was what was really intended admitted or explained to me by the Fiat service rep;
1 Use a high pressure air blower to blow the rust and corrosion from the entire top surface of the engine compartment throughout the rest of the engine compartment.
2 Spray a corrosive rust and corrosion convertor over all surfaces including rubber seals hoses and fabric injector cables leave for 4 hours,
3 Use the high pressure air blower to blow away the powder that developes from the converted rust,
4 Apply sticky yellow goo over most surfaces that will never be able to be cleaned or look new.
5 Place a plastic cover over the injector well so as not to see the water- a bandaid not a fix according to the experts

I gave strict instructions to the Fiat service man not to carry out this recall until I take photos as evidence. I wanted clarification of the recall also as it was only the Injectors mentioned nothing like the above.
The service repairer went against my instruction, began the lengthy process, which I caught him in the middle of. :bang:
I rang and complained to Fiat they said I have to go through with it and accused me of not attending to the problem sooner.
I was . My Motor Home was only months old and lets face I didn't forget to seal the metal engine housing at the factory. How dare they blame others let alone have no empathy for those who have financially supported their brand and given them on going jobs.
The recall had to be completed however during the process the Fiat service rep damaged the plastic grill and parts.
I challenged him on all accounts he did not like this chased me from the building wont discuss or talk to me, wont order parts etc etc.
In Australia we are told to return to the dealer -Jayco in this case.

Unfortunately the Jayco section of my Motor Home is also unmerchantable -
well reported and documented including major manufacturing faults that involved full deconstruction of the Motor Home already due to a lack of roof sealing allowing water ingress into the nose cone or Luton Peak as well as major noises built in at manufacturing stage ( so much to report) and many other faults to numerous to name now.

:slayer:So with the definition of 'merchantable quality' according to the Dept of Fair Trading Australia I have taken my case to the CTTT.

To be merchantable it must be fit for the purpose for which it is intended giving special consideration to the price and all other considerations.
The Fiat bonnets design funnels water onto/into the engine housing well instead of the regular bonnet design being to provide protection from exterior elements. Fail.
The top section of the engine has a very deep water collection well, haven’t Fiat heard of a radiator for cooling LOL.Fail.
The Injectors are not supposed to be indefinitely fixed to the engine compartment through rust, they are intended to be removable in the future. Fail.
The overflow pipe that is supposed to take water from the windscreen wiper area to the outside instead of onto the motor is on the wrong side or designed for the European camber of the road ie we drive on the opposite side of the road so the water doesn't have the correct fall to drain away.Fail.
The last time I used one sided adhesive tape was not to join two large pieces of plastic together (pieces at the bottom of windscreen) causing a sponge like effect filtering the collected water into the engine compartment. Fail.

Fail Fail.

I tried one last attempt to work something out with Fiat so I rang Mr Dick Hull the Managing Director of the Fiat importer Ateco.
His answer to me was "so what we already have 60% of the
World wide market".
What a Hull of a D_ _ k Mr.


That brings me to my interest in your forum, not only do i want to share good experiences but some of your members have complained about some of the Fiat neglect aspects with comments like close your cheque books and storm the Leisure shows tell them its just not good enough.
Together we the customers are the only ones who can force a reslove of this issue. We deserve to be compensated for this:slayer:

I wanted the world to know even if I am the only one I am standing up to Fiat and in the famous words with a twist of an outgoing Prime Minister 'May God save the Fiat customers because nothing, nothing can save the Fiat Ducato' its a LEMON:slayer::slayer:

IvaFiatNightmare
:tempt:

 

[Ffoxy]

Contact the National TV & the local Press, tell them of your plight, then tell them about the response from both dealer & Fiat as a subject of Public interest & that you will park the offending vehicle that is so unfit for purpose across the entrance of the dealership, lock it up & abandon it (not on the highway though...) until you get good Customer Service.

 

[IvaFiatNightmare]

Re: Aussie Fiat Ducato water ingress engine unsealed and rust

Thanks so much for your response can I call you Foxy for short. I am happy that this worked and I have a response, I feel like Iam a part of a 'community' already. Thanks I have thought exactly about what you said, but I want to do more - I want unsuspecting customers to say NO and know their rights. This was the biggest and supposed best purchase I was to make, I have been devastated but I still live in this wonderful country so I am greatful. Your motorbike looks to die for which has to be a brighter note to end on.
Thanks again,
IvaFiatNightmare

 

[Ffoxy]

Well dig in Cobber, the ride could be rough... similar stuff happens here, dealers are so different in their attitude to Customers & their level of skill & knowledge, but a bad attitude stinks! The bike & I parted company a few years back now, I sold it to buy my Fiat Grande Punto 1.9 MJet, cracking little car, re-mapped to 194 Bhp & 260 ft lbs of torque, I moved that on at 72,000 relatively trouble free miles, but when I did have issues my dealership was excellent.

I now drive a car that is I believe popular in Oz... a Hyundai i30 1.6 petrol Premium, and I love it, not an exciting car but everything always works & its not an ugly car... but it does have all the toys!

 

[IvaFiatNightmare]

Hi Foxy,
Glad you didn't buy a Fiat anything,
This Fiat forum site shows that they continued to build faulty equipment and ship to Aussie fully knowing the circumstances. Premeditated RIP OFF MERCHANTS,
IvaFiatNightmare

 

[dave]

How do you upload a post, I have typed a really good one and it has failed twice
I will start agian.
I think you have a very short login time????

you need to click the remember me box when you long in, other wise if you write a long post you will be auto logged out before you finish it

 

[Ffoxy]

Hi Foxy,
Glad you didn't buy a Fiat anything,
This Fiat forum site shows that they continued to build faulty equipment and ship to Aussie fully knowing the circumstances. Premeditated RIP OFF MERCHANTS,
IvaFiatNightmare

I was very happy with my Fiat purchase to be honest. Because my dealer was a good one. I'd buy from them again if the product they had on offer suited my needs. Fiat products have their issues, but lets be clear, so do many other makes, the biggest difference being the responses to Customer complaints. The Ducato may have its problems, but for me the biggest problem you have is your dealers lack of interest & concern.

 

[IvaFiatNightmare]

Hi Foxy,
Sorry if I offended your love of Fiats. Thats not my intention. You see its a matter of principle to me. If Fiat had not built a faulty defectively designed engine and surrounds I wouldn't have suffered the mistreatment and have a considerablly devalued product through no fault of my own. I am not like others who upgrade every 3 years I expected to be driving this fault free for the next ten years. The last vehicle I owned was a Holden Jackeroo that lasted 20 years and wasn't new when I purchased it. Why should I feel unsafe, insecure not knowing the potential disasters caused by faults,corrosion etc that may occur throughout the life of this Fiat. I have already had the airconditioner replaced throttle body replaced twice,and several other repairs. I paid big money as it is more expensive with our taxes to purchase these motors. I will never accept even if others do that this is FAIR TRADING.
I believe the customers should unite in a World Class Action Suit and stop future sales until total rectifaction of the problems.
I believe all current owners should be compensated.
I believe we should be given full TEN YEAR WARRANTIES WITH ROADSIDE ASSISTANCE.
You see Foxy my case in the CTTT is for a replacement motor home and I am worried about getting another Fiat.
Oh yes forgot Fiat service man ASSUAULTED ME leaving my chest bruised after poking and pushing me in the chest trying to get me to leave.
IvaFiatNightmare

 

[Ffoxy]

I think your anger is blinkering you, not good if you are going for a Law suit. Plus I dont think a Forum like this is likely to be a great place for you to rally support on.

I wonder why you didnt buy another good Holden if it was such a stirling product? I'm not defending Fiat, just providing a valid balanced view. The vast majority of Fiat owners are totally happy with what they bought. I research my major purchases well before I commit to buy, I knew what could happen to my Fiat. Did you do likewise? I believe the Ducato had these problems from the start, and that they were well documented, personally I wouldnt have touched one with a barge-pole. Having said that, before I had my Fiat, we bought a Stilo for Mrs Ffoxy. I definitely wouldnt have if I had researched it prior to purchase, Stilo was never blessed with a great reputation, as it turned out our 1.2 Stilo was an amazing car... Common denominator?

The dealership we bought both Fiats from... very good.

From 2007... http://www.fiat.co.uk/Community/forums/thread/573.aspx

 

[T14086]

This is already in it's (correct) proper section, Ducato with explanation on how to stay logged in

 

[IvaFiatNightmare]

hi foxy,
Just to reiterate my current motor home was a replacement motor home so I had no choice it came on this Fiat model. My original was the preceding model which was so much better.When I purchased it originally I did all my homework but couldn't have anticipated any of this. There were no forums cos it hadn't begun yet, and there are still very few Aussie ones.
If noone wrote then noone would know and we'd all be in the dark you included.
I thought the rest of the world would like to know its happening in Aussie as well.
I also thought it relevant as they are still building the Fiat the same and for at least another six years,
No I wouldnt have touched it with a barge poll either if I had known.
IvaFiatNightmare

 

[IvaFiatNightmare]

This is already in it's (correct) proper section, Ducato with explanation on how to stay logged in

hi moderator
I dont get your last message, all is working fine thanks.
Do you own a Fiat with this prob or have you been working on them as you seem to be commenting on injectos which I am interested in.
IvaFiatNightmare

 

[Ffoxy]

I think Ben, the Forum owner, has a Ducato....

https://www.fiatforum.com/ducato/276307-issues-second-gear.html

 

[IvaFiatNightmare]

Hi Foxy
Thats what I thought he must have meant.
I was interested in the New 2011 Fiat Ducato and how they have been fixed or not.
In Australia we always get any model of anything after Europe does, so wondered if the complaints now are the same as when the Ducato was first introduced 2007.
My 'car' was a Holden but when it died I purchased my Motor Home (Jayco Conquest LOL cos its certainly isn't a conquest) which was based on a Fiat Ducato.
I am supposed to be travelling Australia but can't rely on either the Fiat Ducato or Jayco counterparts.

If I Knew what I knew today...........
IvaFiatandaJaycoNightmare