Technical Ducato power steering issue

[Russthepanda]

Hi all,
This is my first post so be gentle....
We have a self converted camper Ducato 2007 2.3 RHD van (50,000 miles), I have owned it for approx 2 years and about a year ago we had a new power steering pump fitted after driving without any assistance and making a groaning noise.
The new pump resolved the issue and it was a whole lot nicer to drive. In the year we have only done 2000 miles ish and used it a few weeks ago to do a 30 mile each way trip to a camp site, all was ok.
I got in it to shuffle the cars on the drive, started up and sat at idle for 2 mins, pulled forward 10 metres and reversed back. The groaning noise was back and most of the power steering fluid was pumped out of the overflow pipe on the fluid tank.

What's wrong? Air in the system from somewhere? Is there a favourite failure point to look for?
I have asked about a pump feed pipe No4 in attached but no longer made.

Update
I have been out and had a look, no fluid in the tank, all drained into the tray underneath.
Refill the tank a bit and almost instantly drips out of the bottom of the pump pulley, is that a dead pump?
So bloody difficult to get to without a pit or a lift....


Thanks for your input

Pete

 

[airwave]

You obviously have a leak somewhere , and before you can affect a repair , to state the obvious , you need to locate that leak . Up until last year , i knew what a power steering system was , and that was your lot . I finished a complete rebuild of my power steering system a month ago , overcoming multiple leaks , and a hose that's no longer available . Two leaks were pretty straight forward , but a third , on the actuator was far more troublesome . Now i will admit , both my bumper and inter-cooler were removed for other work , otherwise access would have been severely hampered .

Now you say pump , so i'm hoping you do actually mean pump . This will have two connections , one a direct feed from the reservoir to the pump which has no pressure at all , and a high pressure hose running from the pump to the actuator on the steering column , on my van , this is a mix of both steel pipe and rubber hose . It should be noted , the pressure these systems operate at , can be as high as 3500psi , so the connection on the pump is likely a banjo bolt similar to that of some braking systems . As you have already had a new pump fitted , you really need to eliminate this hose before going any further .
Fill the reservoir with some oil , but don't fill it right up . Leave for a couple of minutes , then in any way you can examine both connections very carefully . Use a light , mirror anything you need , but check this connection . Now a common mistake people make , is assuming a leak is directly above the pool of fluid on the ground , so i would also suggest , especially with a 2007 van , checking the hose as well . A failure may allow fluid to weep through , where it would run to the lowest point before beginning to drip , on my van , this is directly under the pump . If the rubber hose is lower than the steel , it's unlikely to run down the hose , as it would drip from any sharp edge at the lowest point , however if it's the other way round it almost certainly would . To be sure check these connections anyway . And finally , another little trick i've used in the past , is to slide a sheet of cardboard under the assumed leak area . This can help to localise the leak .

 

[Russthepanda]

You obviously have a leak somewhere , and before you can affect a repair , to state the obvious , you need to locate that leak . Up until last year , i knew what a power steering system was , and that was your lot . I finished a complete rebuild of my power steering system a month ago , overcoming multiple leaks , and a hose that's no longer available . Two leaks were pretty straight forward , but a third , on the actuator was far more troublesome . Now i will admit , both my bumper and inter-cooler were removed for other work , otherwise access would have been severely hampered .

Now you say pump , so i'm hoping you do actually mean pump . This will have two connections , one a direct feed from the reservoir to the pump which has no pressure at all , and a high pressure hose running from the pump to the actuator on the steering column , on my van , this is a mix of both steel pipe and rubber hose . It should be noted , the pressure these systems operate at , can be as high as 3500psi , so the connection on the pump is likely a banjo bolt similar to that of some braking systems . As you have already had a new pump fitted , you really need to eliminate this hose before going any further .
Fill the reservoir with some oil , but don't fill it right up . Leave for a couple of minutes , then in any way you can examine both connections very carefully . Use a light , mirror anything you need , but check this connection . Now a common mistake people make , is assuming a leak is directly above the pool of fluid on the ground , so i would also suggest , especially with a 2007 van , checking the hose as well . A failure may allow fluid to weep through , where it would run to the lowest point before beginning to drip , on my van , this is directly under the pump . If the rubber hose is lower than the steel , it's unlikely to run down the hose , as it would drip from any sharp edge at the lowest point , however if it's the other way round it almost certainly would . To be sure check these connections anyway . And finally , another little trick i've used in the past , is to slide a sheet of cardboard under the assumed leak area . This can help to localise the leak .

Hi,
Thanks for the response.
To update you.
I managed to get the van to a local garage who could put the van up on ramps, they have diagnosed the fault as leaking from the pump
shaft so it will be going back to the original garage for a replacement under warranty. There comment was that with the engine running there was a slight drop leak, with the engine stopped it ran straight out.

I will update when I know more.


Pete

 

[airwave]

Hi,
Thanks for the response.
To update you.
I managed to get the van to a local garage who could put the van up on ramps, they have diagnosed the fault as leaking from the pump
shaft so it will be going back to the original garage for a replacement under warranty. There comment was that with the engine running there was a slight drop leak, with the engine stopped it ran straight out.

I will update when I know more.


Pete

Well done for getting thing's moving my friend my friend . As you have probably already discovered the steering will work , it's just very heavy . It's also an mot failure issue as well .

Now you were asking about hose 4 . As you have described this is your primary feed from the reservoir . I actually managed to find one for 2.8 (year 2000) from Brownhill's in Newark , but steering hoses can be a problem . I've been there ! . You could try Brownhill's yourself or failing that , you're have to make one up . It's low pressure , which eases the problem . I failed to find a low pressure return hose for my van , so i tried to fit a reinforced hose , but couldn't get it to bend tightly . So after i discovered it was low pressure , i examined the original hose and found it didn't appear to be reinforced , i sourced a length of heater hose and used that . Your coolant system is also pressurised , but if i remember correctly to about i bar , which is something like 10psi . However when i was searching for a crush washer , i was told it's actually zero pressure , and that heater hose would be fine . It is even possible to bend it to a conformed shape , but i only discovered that after i had fitted the pipe . So i can't actually confirm that .