puntonew
New member
like in traffic, coming to a stop, do you just slip it into neutral, then apply the brakes when need to stop, or do you move down the gears like they taught you at driving school?
do you coast in neutral?
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do you coast in neutral?
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You are not in full control of the vehicle if you are rolling out of gear. Should you need to take evasive action the delay putting the car into gear could be the difference between avoiding a collision or hitting something or someone.
change down and brake then dip clutch at last second. I used to keep it in gear and dip the clutch to coast, but when I started to drive the Landy the brakes took a hammering and I chewed threw a set of pads in no time.... not to mention drinking diesel.
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The latter. As said above coasting is not encouraged as you are not in control.
Plus without some engine braking you are expecting more work from your brakes.
More work normally means they will wear quicker - OK probably marginal but none the less I it will make a difference.
Some of course may argue that using engine breaking encourages wear on that and other drive-train components but on balance I prefer to do it the way I was taught (In 1978!)
on some engines the car cuts fuel to the engine when in gear n just rolling apparently.
i vary depends how lazy i am
i vary depends how lazy i am
Neither.
Lets say you're doing 30mph in 3rd gear and need to stop at a red light.
Slow down using the brakes until your revs are just a bit above idle then press clutch down to stop.
Dom
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thats how i do it too
If im in say 4th and slowing down from 60mph, when the rev's are getting lower i select another gear - ie 2nd when the speed matches
the gear stay engaged till the point the car is about to hit idle speed and stall, then you dip the clutch
If im slowing down early - i remain in gear, and let the engine brake for me, untill the point i select another gear to increase the engine braking
When the engine is been dragged by the driveline, then you use hardly any fuel
if you dip the clutch, the ECU has to keep the engine running by pumping fuel in
So coasting is not only bad for "gas" but its not as safe incase you need to move out the way
ziggy
On over run (or coasting) the ECU pulses the injectors just enough to maintain ticker (it knows you are coasting from throttle. air flow, load parameters), example it will only use 1 injection instead of 4-7 injections so coasting will save fuel.
CZ motorbikes had a second neutral (between 3rd & 4th gears) for 'coasting' down hills.
CZ motorbikes had a second neutral (between 3rd & 4th gears) for 'coasting' down hills.
I was always taught to let the engine do the braking.
Approaching red lights, foot off the gas & the vehicle slows. As the speed drops, drop into 3rd - the revs should be just above normal to give you that extra bit of control should you need to accellerate.
With practice I often get to the lights without touching my brakes, still rolling along in 2nd & good to go as the lights change without having to worry about the most appropriate gear to be in.
At my last assessment, the young bloke insisted I was doing it all wrong & that I should stay in 4th right up to the lights & use the brakes to slow me, pressing the clutch just before the engine stalls - which was fine until he realised that the bus couldn't do 20mph in 4th without stalling!
So, my choice was, clutch & cruise (so, not in control of the vehicle) or drop down the gears which his manual doesn't recommend.
Same with going down hills. I've seen the end result of too many sitting on their brakes then finding out they have lost them & running out of road. Earlier this year I was in the lakes, going over wrynose (sp) pass, on the downhills I rarely touched the brakes, just dropped into 2nd and let the engine do the braking. It was quite happy to go down those hills at a steady, controllable speed without racing away.
Back to the assessment, the assessor also tried to persuade me to use block gear change - Hmmm
Pull out of a junction, across a road (for example) in 1st, you HAVE to hit 2nd before you get to the white lines in the middle. Go from 1st straight to 3rd and it stalls - it simply cannot move the weight, even trying 2nd to 4th doesn't work - it has no 'poke' and the engine simply 'pinks' and struggles.
The ONLY block changes I can do are 3rd to 5th or 4th to 6th
Approaching red lights, foot off the gas & the vehicle slows. As the speed drops, drop into 3rd - the revs should be just above normal to give you that extra bit of control should you need to accellerate.
With practice I often get to the lights without touching my brakes, still rolling along in 2nd & good to go as the lights change without having to worry about the most appropriate gear to be in.
At my last assessment, the young bloke insisted I was doing it all wrong & that I should stay in 4th right up to the lights & use the brakes to slow me, pressing the clutch just before the engine stalls - which was fine until he realised that the bus couldn't do 20mph in 4th without stalling!
So, my choice was, clutch & cruise (so, not in control of the vehicle) or drop down the gears which his manual doesn't recommend.
Same with going down hills. I've seen the end result of too many sitting on their brakes then finding out they have lost them & running out of road. Earlier this year I was in the lakes, going over wrynose (sp) pass, on the downhills I rarely touched the brakes, just dropped into 2nd and let the engine do the braking. It was quite happy to go down those hills at a steady, controllable speed without racing away.
Back to the assessment, the assessor also tried to persuade me to use block gear change - Hmmm
Pull out of a junction, across a road (for example) in 1st, you HAVE to hit 2nd before you get to the white lines in the middle. Go from 1st straight to 3rd and it stalls - it simply cannot move the weight, even trying 2nd to 4th doesn't work - it has no 'poke' and the engine simply 'pinks' and struggles.
The ONLY block changes I can do are 3rd to 5th or 4th to 6th
Best way to remember this:
Brakes to slow, gears to go.
Simples.
Dom
Brakes to slow, gears to go.
Simples.
Dom
As said above, coasting reduces control and is illegal. Although getting caught is unlikely.
The first "car" had no brakes. They strapped an engine onto a cart and with a fixed connection to the wheels pushed it to start and stalled the engine to stop. Once the idea seemed to have some future, a better way was needed. Until then, carts were stopped mainly by the horse. The brakes, a block of wood against the wheel, sometimes faced with leather, proved inadequate for the speeds of a motor car. It took many years to find a good solution, during which time the technique was to use the gears to slow the vehicle, and the brakes for the final stop only.
Since the 1930s, brakes have moved from ok, to adequate, through to good and are getting better all the time. Since at least the 1950s using the gearbox to slow has not been necessary. As EvoStevo says above, brakes are cheaper than gearboxes.
The Institute of Advanced Motorists, RoSPA and the Police drivers' handbook Roadcraft all recommend "Gears to Go, Brakes to Slow".
It took a while for the Driving Standards Agency to catch up. Until the end of 1996, they still expected candidates to change down through the gears on approach to junctions, although using brakes and block changing did not cause me to fail my test in 1972. The way all learners should be taught today is to use the brakes to slow, depressing the clutch just before the stall point, at which time they select the gear they think they will need next, depending on circumstances. This will often mean 5-1, 4-2, etc. Each time the clutch is depressed and the gear lever moved, there is a slight loss of control which increase risk. It is also more physical work to do. With the clutch depressed it will also take marginally longer to stop, and steering control is less effective.
Block changing can be an effective tool, but only when the circumstances are right. If the car won't take it, don't. Sludgeguts, it would appear that your last assessor was trying to apply a basic rule to all situations. If he reads Roadcraft properly, it will tell him that everything should be considered, and choose what fits at the time. There are few hard and fast rules. Perhaps he needs a bit more experience. As you said, block changing up is mostly 3-5 or 4-6. 1-3 may work downhill.
Using engine braking on downhills is still a useful tool. The recommendation is to reduce the speed using the brakes, then select the gear to hold the speed, rather than using the gears to slow the vehicle. Of course, using the gears to give a gentle approach to junctions or other hazards is also useful, as long as the driver is aware of the effect on following traffic. Brake lights are a useful warning to sleepy drivers behind. (Automatic cars are involved in fewer rear-end collisions, because they brake more)
Then in ice and snow, gears to slow will often give better control.
So there are no fixed answers, only lots of possibilities and decisions made to fit the situation.
The first "car" had no brakes. They strapped an engine onto a cart and with a fixed connection to the wheels pushed it to start and stalled the engine to stop. Once the idea seemed to have some future, a better way was needed. Until then, carts were stopped mainly by the horse. The brakes, a block of wood against the wheel, sometimes faced with leather, proved inadequate for the speeds of a motor car. It took many years to find a good solution, during which time the technique was to use the gears to slow the vehicle, and the brakes for the final stop only.
Since the 1930s, brakes have moved from ok, to adequate, through to good and are getting better all the time. Since at least the 1950s using the gearbox to slow has not been necessary. As EvoStevo says above, brakes are cheaper than gearboxes.
The Institute of Advanced Motorists, RoSPA and the Police drivers' handbook Roadcraft all recommend "Gears to Go, Brakes to Slow".
It took a while for the Driving Standards Agency to catch up. Until the end of 1996, they still expected candidates to change down through the gears on approach to junctions, although using brakes and block changing did not cause me to fail my test in 1972. The way all learners should be taught today is to use the brakes to slow, depressing the clutch just before the stall point, at which time they select the gear they think they will need next, depending on circumstances. This will often mean 5-1, 4-2, etc. Each time the clutch is depressed and the gear lever moved, there is a slight loss of control which increase risk. It is also more physical work to do. With the clutch depressed it will also take marginally longer to stop, and steering control is less effective.
Block changing can be an effective tool, but only when the circumstances are right. If the car won't take it, don't. Sludgeguts, it would appear that your last assessor was trying to apply a basic rule to all situations. If he reads Roadcraft properly, it will tell him that everything should be considered, and choose what fits at the time. There are few hard and fast rules. Perhaps he needs a bit more experience. As you said, block changing up is mostly 3-5 or 4-6. 1-3 may work downhill.
Using engine braking on downhills is still a useful tool. The recommendation is to reduce the speed using the brakes, then select the gear to hold the speed, rather than using the gears to slow the vehicle. Of course, using the gears to give a gentle approach to junctions or other hazards is also useful, as long as the driver is aware of the effect on following traffic. Brake lights are a useful warning to sleepy drivers behind. (Automatic cars are involved in fewer rear-end collisions, because they brake more)
Then in ice and snow, gears to slow will often give better control.
So there are no fixed answers, only lots of possibilities and decisions made to fit the situation.
OP
OP
puntonew
New member
yes i too would rather wear brake pads discs than clutch or gearbox........im talking in traffic, 20-25 mph max, when you know your coming to a stop as you read the road ahead.......yes i know the official line is not in gear not in control, but you have your brakes and steering, and have no need to accelerate in the next 10-100 yards, so how is that not under control.....
OP
OP
puntonew
New member
yes, and maybe brakes to slow, then clutch to floor just before stopping is the best all around comprimise.
the beauty of slip it into neutral is that it eliminates the need to add more gas before stopping, whereas staying in gear with clutch down at last minute, may need more gas b4 stop line
Because in effect you're letting the car run. If you have a sudden need to accellerate (Not because you've seen a tunnel.. More likely because something with blue lights is behind you) then you need to move out of it's way quickly.**
**I will add do this legally! Watch this for moving out of emergency vehicles way:
Dom
When you put the clutch down, select the gear you think you will need next, the if circumstances change, you are ready to go.
Do not go through a red light to allow an emergency vehicle to pass. They can, you can't. Wait for the green. There have been successful prosecutions.
What are 'brakes'?
OP
OP
puntonew
New member
cant you just put in back in gear and accelerate out of the way?
must take all of 2 seconds.....
Middle pedal in a manual car. Stamp on it and see what happens.
Dom
Mate there are only three things needed to drive a car:
Clutch
Accelerator
Handbrake
Anything else is surplus imo.
