Technical crank case ventilation valve 2.8JTD

[EBB and FLOW]

my 05 ducato 244 ,is leaking oil from the rocker cover and cam belt i am told ,could this be caused by the crank case presurising due to this valve malfunctioning .are these parts serviceable ,or a common replacement ,

 

[bugsymike]

my 05 ducato 244 ,is leaking oil from the rocker cover and cam belt i am told ,could this be caused by the crank case presurising due to this valve malfunctioning .are these parts serviceable ,or a common replacement ,

From memory the black plastic box with breather pipes and one leading to the sump area, may need taking off and cleaning to make sure it is not blocked. I think they had wire gauze mesh inside, but are sealed so you can only flush them to make sure clear.
It could be piston/cylinder bore wear at that mileage, depending on what life it has led
Try removing oil filler cap when engine idling and see how much fumes are blowing out.

 

[EBB and FLOW]

thanks heaps for your reply its good to know it can be cleaned along with the hoses ,the milage quoted is in KMs as im in australia ,so not excessive ,it had 89,000km on it when i got it about 5 years ago ,it runs fine otherwise ,

 

[bugsymike]

thanks heaps for your reply its good to know it can be cleaned along with the hoses ,the milage quoted is in KMs as im in australia ,so not excessive ,it had 89,000km on it when i got it about 5 years ago ,it runs fine otherwise ,

Yes 131,000 miles sounds better, though I have had those engines in Iveco Daily's at 230,000 miles running sweet with no oil issues and some quote half a million miles.
It's not the camshaft oil seal is it?
The reason I mentioned the life it has led, is frequent oil and filter changes with good quality parts and regular cambelt kits usually keep them running happy.
It is a solid heavy slow revving commercial style engine so needs to be warmed up well before any hard use and is what I have always done on the ones I had in the past.
I put one of those in a boat in place of a 3.75 litre V6 150 hp petrol engine and it weighed more than the original V6 Buick engine (known as a Volvo Penta 150) so a lot of metal to warm up. It was the pre JTD non ECU from 1997 from a Ducato Maxi van, after tweaking the pump and turbo it managed 26 knots compared with the 30 knots of the original V6 but at 4 gallons of diesel compared with 10 gallons of 5 star petrol of the original.
I used to run mine on Iveco 15/40 oil and never gave it hard use until temp gauge got up to the middle 90 degrees Centigrade approx.
An experienced mechanic can soon see by removing the oil filler cap and holding their hand over it if it is "blow by" from engine wear or not.

 

[Communicator]

Yes 131,000 miles sounds better, though I have had those engines in Iveco Daily's at 230,000 miles running sweet with no oil issues and some quote half a million miles.
It's not the camshaft oil seal is it?
The reason I mentioned the life it has led, is frequent oil and filter changes with good quality parts and regular cambelt kits usually keep them running happy.
It is a solid heavy slow revving commercial style engine so needs to be warmed up well before any hard use and is what I have always done on the ones I had in the past.
I put one of those in a boat in place of a 3.75 litre V6 150 hp petrol engine and it weighed more than the original V6 Buick engine (known as a Volvo Penta 150) so a lot of metal to warm up. It was the pre JTD non ECU from 1997 from a Ducato Maxi van, after tweaking the pump and turbo it managed 26 knots compared with the 30 knots of the original V6 but at 4 gallons of diesel compared with 10 gallons of 5 star petrol of the original.
I used to run mine on Iveco 15/40 oil and never gave it hard use until temp gauge got up to the middle 90 degrees Centigrade approx.
An experienced mechanic can soon see by removing the oil filler cap and holding their hand over it if it is "blow by" from engine wear or not.

May I add that on the Iveco Daily, the blowby vapours exiting the oil vapour separator were realeased to atmosphere (Iveco manual dated 2002). On the Fiat x244 the fumes are returned to the air filter outlet hose via a NRV. Perhaps this also could become blocked?

 

[bugsymike]

May I add that on the Iveco Daily, the blowby vapours exiting the oil vapour separator were realeased to atmosphere (Iveco manual dated 2002). On the Fiat x244 the fumes are returned to the air filter outlet hose via a NRV. Perhaps this also could become blocked?

It was many years ago on my Ivecos but I thought the breather ended up in the air cleaner on the older ones.
I just looked at an early 2.8iTD on eBay, on the plastic box it is bolted to the cylinder block to access a large hole in the block and has an O ring from memory, a lower pipe which drains any oil back towards the sump and the upper pipe goes to air cleaner so a simple form of reburning the fumes. The one nearest to the engine lifting chains, note none of mine were this dirty

 

[Communicator]

@bugsymike ,
See date (bottom RHS) onattached extract from Iveco Manual. Perhaps it had not not been fuly revised from 1st Edition. The italics are mine.

 

[bugsymike]

@bugsymike ,
See date (bottom RHS) onattached extract from Iveco Manual. Perhaps it had not not been fuly revised from 1st Edition. The italics are mine.

This engine was from a 1997 Ducato 2.8iDT 122hp Maxi van originally and it may just be possible to see the breather pipe where it joins the moulded rubber turbo inlet pipe just above the turbo actuator in photo.

 

[EBB and FLOW]

mine is a little diferent ,i have the outlet pipe going to the air intake after the filter ,one giong down to the lower block /sump area and also one going to the front of the block in the region of the timeing belt ,i read elsewhere that although the fiat and iveco JTDS look the same the block on the front drive vehicles has suttlce differences ,and are not interchangable ,thanks heaps for you replies ,the diesel mechanic i had it to yesterday to have those two heater hoses just above that box replaced as one was swelling ,said the oil was coming from the rocker cover ,and cam seal ,up high ,i have yet to remove the plastic covers to determine if this is so ,and try tighten the rocker cover bolts ,up till recently i have undertaken maintenance myself but finding it increasingly difficult as my hands arnt as strong and willing as they used to be ,aparently the injecters have to be removed to get the rocker cover off and a special tool is required to get them out ,so am comptemplating paying someone to do this job and posibly the cam belt and bearings while we are at it although they have some life left in them ,if the seal has to be replaced ,i mite as well get it all done ,tks john

 

[EBB and FLOW]

i took the plastic covers off this morning between showers ,and found that in fact there is no leakage from the rocker cover and all the 10mm nuts are tight , the injectors dont have to be removed to renew a gasket and the cam belt is dry as and no signs of oil anywhere ,seeems my local guy had looked up the wrong engine or was feeding me BS .i notice the breather box has jubilee clips on it so has been removed some time in the past ,this is my nxt port of call once the rain stops ,im thinking i will remove the starter and try access it from underneath ,instead of removeing the turbo hoses at the top ,these have the factory clamps ,douse anyone have a method for there removal except a hack saw !

 

[bugsymike]

i took the plastic covers off this morning between showers ,and found that in fact there is no leakage from the rocker cover and all the 10mm nuts are tight , the injectors dont have to be removed to renew a gasket and the cam belt is dry as and no signs of oil anywhere ,seeems my local guy had looked up the wrong engine or was feeding me BS .i notice the breather box has jubilee clips on it so has been removed some time in the past ,this is my nxt port of call once the rain stops ,im thinking i will remove the starter and try access it from underneath ,instead of removeing the turbo hoses at the top ,these have the factory clamps ,douse anyone have a method for there removal except a hack saw !

I was going to say what you have just discovered and that mechanic was incorrect.
Re the turbo clips, if it is the type of clip I am thinking of, this tool does it.One way around releases and the other reclips it. It may be an idea to wash off around the oil leak to locate better and I have seen those plastic boxes with splits as sometimes people try to wrench them off after undoing the bolt , but they hold firm on the large O ring where it sits in the engine block.

 

[Communicator]

I have two pairs of "Clik" pliers, one differing from the above only in the colour of the plastic handle covers. While of lighter construction I find the second "Laser" branded pair (Laser 4231) with swivel heads much easier to use, as you do not need to have the pliers at a right angle to the hose.

I have noticed that the "Ezyclik" clips are only used on the coolant and low pressure hoses . On my 2.8jtd they are not OEM fitment on the hoses between turbo, intercooler, and inlet manifold, are worm drive, or another different type near the intercooler, which I have recently replaced.

On inspection the small vapour inlet hose to the Oil Vapour Separator has worm drive clamps, while the outlet to the Oil Vapour Heater and NRV are of the Clik type.

@EBB and FLOW , perhaps the outlet hose of your Oil Vapour Separator has been removed because of an Oil Vapour Heater failure. Such failure blows fuse F11, and the noticeable immediate effect is that you lose the speedometer reading.

 

[EBB and FLOW]

Thanks heaps guys for your input ,i have just ordered a new filter / valve box of e bay ,should arive by the end of the mth out of poland ,i wasnt looking forward ti removeing the old one without a replacement ,as mentioned above 20 year old plastic in a hot enviroment can be inclined to fracture ,i would rather have the use of the van while waiting rather than haveing to wait 4 weeks to have one arive after i had destroyed the old one removeing it ,thanks for the heads up on the clamps ,it is posible then that these hoses havent been removed as thought ,PS i dont have drips of oil or leaving puddles on the driveway just some misting either end of the crank ,i am a lot mor confident now i know the cam belt hasnt been efected by oil ,as it is due for change in mid 26 or a further 160 000 km ,john

 

[Communicator]

Thanks heaps guys for your input ,i have just ordered a new filter / valve box of e bay ,should arive by the end of the mth out of poland ,i wasnt looking forward ti removeing the old one without a replacement ,as mentioned above 20 year old plastic in a hot enviroment can be inclined to fracture ,i would rather have the use of the van while waiting rather than haveing to wait 4 weeks to have one arive after i had destroyed the old one removeing it ,thanks for the heads up on the clamps ,it is posible then that these hoses havent been removed as thought ,PS i dont have drips of oil or leaving puddles on the driveway just some misting either end of the crank ,i am a lot mor confident now i know the cam belt hasnt been efected by oil ,as it is due for change in mid 26 or a further 160 000 km ,john

I have not had cause to remove the oil vapour separator on my 2006 2.8jtd. Just looking looking at the engine it seems that access from the top would be improved by removing the intercooler hoses. As I have previously mentioned the hoses were fixed at the intercooler end by clips of to me unknown name. I have replaced these clips with stainless steel worm drive (Jubilee type) clips. With careful clip alignment the only tools that I need to remove the intercooler hoses is a 7mm 1/4" drive socket with extensions. You may wish to do likewise in preparation for removing the separator.

For your assessment of the improvement in access, I am attaching a photo, which I have posted on several occasions. The photo was originally supplied to me by former Australian member IceVovo, who the forum no longer seems to recognise.

In relation to the cracking of so csalled "plastic" materials, which is really a misnomer as plastic means flexible, may I add a statement made by my long dead father "I am afraid that we live in a world of cracked plastics." That statement is brought to mind all too frequently.

 

[bugsymike]

The only think I would add is once all hoses and securing bolt removed , it may help to spray something like WD40 between the plastic box and the engine block as I have found the large O ring that seals it tends to hold on and a small amount of twisting may be required.

 

[EBB and FLOW]

i installed the new box yesterday ,it had been weeping at the joint to the block but not too bad ,i put a lick of silicone make a gasket ,around were it meets the face of the block ,i removed the turbo hoses ,and the starter as i had a new one to replace it ,i had the battery checked after some lazy cold start issues .and was asured it was ok so ordered new starter ,only to have a no go sitation a couple of days ago removed battery and had it re checked 350 cranking amps ,out of 700 when new in 2017 ,time for a new one ,so the starter wasnt necessicary ,but replaced it anyway ,for peice of mind when traveling long distances ,the box that came off was clear so i will have to look at seals on the cam belt end for a start ,or some seal swell aditive ,which im not too keen on ,so see how it goes on my next long run in a couple of weeks ,to coffs harbour 2 and a half hours south on the freeeway at 110 Kph ,thanks heaps for your help guyes !

 

[bugsymike]

i installed the new box yesterday ,it had been weeping at the joint to the block but not too bad ,i put a lick of silicone make a gasket ,around were it meets the face of the block ,i removed the turbo hoses ,and the starter as i had a new one to replace it ,i had the battery checked after some lazy cold start issues .and was asured it was ok so ordered new starter ,only to have a no go sitation a couple of days ago removed battery and had it re checked 350 cranking amps ,out of 700 when new in 2017 ,time for a new one ,so the starter wasnt necessicary ,but replaced it anyway ,for peice of mind when traveling long distances ,the box that came off was clear so i will have to look at seals on the cam belt end for a start ,or some seal swell aditive ,which im not too keen on ,so see how it goes on my next long run in a couple of weeks ,to coffs harbour 2 and a half hours south on the freeeway at 110 Kph ,thanks heaps for your help guyes !

I have a battery tester like they used , you type in the details on battery and after the test it gives that % reading of battery health/cranking Amps, I have even tested new batteries and found them below 90% and slung them back to supplier.
If you have the space it may be an idea to take the old/good starter on your travels as sometimes more reliable than cheap modern replacements

 

[EBB and FLOW]

i was tempted to leave the o;d starter in and carry the new one ,but new starter did make a little difference in cranking speed with the new battery ,faster !.a couple of years ago i had ,am awful clatter on start up ,at Uluru Ayers Rock ,right in the middle of Australia ,in the middle of now where ,they had a mouce plague and one had gotten into the cam cover through a hole in the plastic cover ,managed to get under the belt at the crank shaft and sliped it a couple of teeth ,the motor still ran and the local mechanic managed to put it back a couple of teeth ,but found some radial cracking on the dynamic ballancer ,,he put it back together so we could procede to the camp ground were we were stuck for a week till a part was flown in via Alice springs ,.so i am a bit critical about maintanence and what could go wrong next ,fortunately we only had to pay for one night at the resort $350 as oposed to $40 at the camp ground ,trouble with a RV is you dont only loose your mobility whilst it is being repaired but also your bed .