Technical brava 1.2 clutch replacement

[flying clutchman]

If you have'nt got 1 19mm socket I think you need a new tool kit! Yes there are three bolts on the starter motor. Two gearbox side one engine side. Changing a clutch on a punto is one of the easier modern cars. just behind a fiesta and P106, certainly easier than a moder vauxhall. They got rid of that removable plate idea about 17 years ago. far too easy!

 

[beau]

you dont need to undo the drive shafts from the hubs, you can just pull the shafts from the gearbox and leave them hanging in the hubs, just make sure if you tie them up so they arnt left hanging

even though i have a 32mm socket i do it this way, much easier.

 

[smokeymacpot]

ok so iwill get hold of a t40 and a 19mm 1/2 drive, as my 1/4 drive one will not work with the breaker bar.
so 3 bolts on the starter... the 3rd isnt tucked at the back/underneath its there near one of the gearbox to engine bolts? must have missed that.

yeh that ball bearing i have no idea where it came from, the rod and slave are working ok. its possible its been sat ontop of my gearbox for months. i dropped it and lost it, so no picture

clutchman, my vauxhall has that plate, not that i need it, its clutch isnt made from chocolate like this fiats
it managed 74000miles, its not slipping, its just disintergrating, cant wait to see how minced up it is when i remove it after the terrible sounds its made so far.

 

[flying clutchman]

You're right about the vauxhall clutches lasting a bit longer,it's often the bearing that gives out on them though which means you can't get it out through the bottom! Sorry I described your car as a punto, I meant Brava, the punto does'nt have that awkward rear mounting like the Brava. On the subject of hydraulics, the resevoir has seperate chambers on a Brava so losing fluid won't affect the brakes. Many people seem to be under this false impression! Hope the weather stays fine for you!

 

[smokeymacpot]

after 3hours of trying to undo very very very tight bolts in awkward places, i got the box off and found everything is minced up. bearing disintergrated, the thing what pushes the back of the bearing is minced and melted, some of the fingers on the clutch are worn through and some broken. shards of metal everywhere. and now i know where that ball bearing came from!
the new bearing i have, well i cant see what it would clip onto, if there was something, its now melted away

where can i get a new arm thing that the bearing sits on? whats it called? what would it cost me?

sods law that after spending LOADS to mot it, 3weeks later this happens and im so pissed off with that car that i so badly want to set fire to it

 

[smokeymacpot]

^^ that bearing is not in one piece, i just sat the middle bit back.

 

[flying clutchman]

This is what usually happens. The clutch fork is only available from main agents but is surprisingly a lot cheaper than the same part for other makes. (i.e. peugeot 106 £80) I often spend half an hour filing the fork back into shape but I think yours has gone a bit too far. To take it out you need to remove the bronze bush at the top. They usualy tap out easily but I have had them seized solid and they break very easily, in which case you'd need to renew it. The broken pressure plate's not a problem 'cos you get a new one in the kit anyway.

 

[smokeymacpot]

so after removing the arm what moves when pressing the clutch(i have no bloody circlip pliers for it either!!), i have to tap/lever out a bush at the bottom(left hand side of my picture)??
ive found this on ebay http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/CLUTCH-ARM-BUSHES-FIAT-PUNTO-BRAVO-SEICENTO-BRAVA_W0QQitemZ370289775365QQcmdZViewItemQQptZUK_CarsParts_Vehicles_CarParts_SM?hash=item5636fd9305
£30 :/

 

[flying clutchman]

You can get the circlip off with a small screwdriver it's not a very strong spring on it, but circlip pliers are easier. Tap the arm off. Now try and lever (gently!) the bronze bush directly under the arm out of the gearbox. Once it's out you can rotate and pull the arm up out of the bottom guide, pull it sideways and down out of the gearbox. Refitting is obviously the reverse, arm in first then bush tapped in, then arm slotted on (it only fits in one position) then circlip on.

 

[smokeymacpot]

im struggling to get the gearbox re-attached its really hard to wiggle the gearbox back and forth to get the spline in, any tips :/

 

[flying clutchman]

First and most obvious, maje sure clutch is aligned properly, secondly apply a minimal amount of grease to end of input shaft, lift up gearbox and ensure stud locates in hole at back,wiggle gently---the gearbox needs to be straight. If you're still having problems try supporting the box and push the flywhel teeth with a screwdiver a few times and try pushing the box in again. That's the best I can do I'm afraid.

 

[m20b25]

im struggling to get the gearbox re-attached its really hard to wiggle the gearbox back and forth to get the spline in, any tips :/

Ive just put a 6 speed box in my bravo and made the mistake of doing it at night. It would not go in no matter what I did. So I gave up till the next day, where I found out the release bearing had jumped out and was sitting crooked.... Clipped in and the box shot in

Other common errors include as the clutchman said, positioning ie the box has to be straight and the friction plate centred correctly or it will butt against the friction plate and potentially smash a new clutch if one is not careful. It might be worthwhile taking the box out again and see where its buttng against. Dont do what a local guy in a garage used to do and tighten the box in with the bolts, thats homocidal for the clutch....!!!!!

 

[smokeymacpot]

i tried again and found that the bolt on the box hadnt gone through the hole in the engine block, eventually got that one bolt through, gave the box a wiggle and a push with my foot and it slid right in.
it seems to work fine. however i broke the speedo drive, i superglued the top back on, but its not right, it underreads and the needle kinda surges up and down.
can anyone tell me the exact engine rpm, for 30mph in 4th , 40mph in 4th, 50mph in 5th, 60mph in 5th and 70mph in 5th.
i dont need one of those money grabbing cameras to flash me

oh and i NEVER EVER EVER want to have to do this again

 

[m20b25]

i tried again and found that the bolt on the box hadnt gone through the hole in the engine block, eventually got that one bolt through, gave the box a wiggle and a push with my foot and it slid right in.
it seems to work fine. however i broke the speedo drive, i superglued the top back on, but its not right, it underreads and the needle kinda surges up and down.
can anyone tell me the exact engine rpm, for 30mph in 4th , 40mph in 4th, 50mph in 5th, 60mph in 5th and 70mph in 5th.
i dont need one of those money grabbing cameras to flash me

oh and i NEVER EVER EVER want to have to do this again

Best to get one from a scrappie should cost no more than a tenner as these never give trouble

I converted to a 6 speed box with completely different ratios and we have kms here not mph but:
30mph roughly 1600rpm in 4th, 1400 in 5th
40mph roughly 1700rpm in 5th
50mph roughly 2300rpm in 5th
60mph roughly 2900rpm in 5th
70mph roughly 3200rpm in 5th

If its any help 1st will go to 31mph, 2nd will go to 51 mph and 3rd will go to 75mph right to the redline :devil:

These cars are a bit awkward but generally easy. I worked on my 2 BMW 520i's I had a few years ago, one auto one manual, both needed the boxes out for different reasons now theyre awkward Never again.... :bang:

 

[smokeymacpot]

those gear speeds dont quite seem to match what i saw before? are those taken from a 6spd box and not a 5? or is it like a 5spd with another gear ontop? good mod if u get a tall 6th gear, 80 is about 4000rpm on my 5spd and its too revvy on the motorway. 80mph in my old car was about 3000rpm, hell of a difference. id like a taller gear on this car, but its crappy 1200cc hasnt got the power to get it up a hill in 4th and accelerate

back to the clutch.. while its working ok now, it seems to judder when setting off with not much throttle, however when you give it 1500-2000rpm, you do not feel it. i thought it might wear itself in abit, or will it take longer to do that?

 

[m20b25]

Ive just driven my dads Bravo (2001 1.2 16v) and:
30mph is 1400rpm in 5th
40mph is 1800 rpm in 5th
50mph is 2300 rpm in 5th

I don't drive this car very much!! I know for a fact that 4000rpm in top gear is 85mph, its the same for the 6 speed and 5 speed boxes. Next time I drive this car I'll be able to state all the speeds properly

 

[shamous]

Hello all and thanks for helping a clutch swap newbie like me.
Started mine today (1.2 Brava) and sorry to say I've had issues

It's been a nightmare day. Head rung on one of 3 rear mount 18mm bolts. Only had ring spanner as 18mm socket not in my set Now faced with cutting off bolt.

I was going to try shifting gearbox with mounting still attached to box but that didn't work. I thought drivers side shaft might have been causing problems so I tried removing that as well. Seized nuts on bottom of strut and drive shaft refuses to release from hub even with a 'ahem' gentle tap - grinder needed later methinks. In all the jigging about the shaft popped of transmission so needn't have botherer in the end.

Had enough for one day but will have another go tomorrow. I didn't remove exhaust down pipe and though this might have helped with access to stubborn bolt they way my luck was going......

Will give it another go tomorrow but if anyone has any more tips I'd be very greatful. Can shift box about 5mm at minute but refuses to budge further.

Cheers

Shamous

 

[Gregovic]

Just buy the socket mate, theyre not expensive! If you can avoid cutting, do so.

 

[shamous]

Thanks Gregovic. Had to cut in the end and when I finally removed bolt I could see why. Must have been crossed going in at some point in the past as thread of bolt contained alloy from gear box. 3 out of 4 bolts on for the minute but will have to try and source a slightly smaller diameter bolt and stick a nut on the end. Anyway, good news is she's back up and running. Thrust bearing was thoroughly chewed up and had nearly cut through springs. Friction plate not too bad though but all replaced.

Thanks all again.