General Blue 2 RIP or maybe not?

[fingers99]

OK, Blue 2 sits there with crumpled front inner wing and somewhat deranged rear slam panel and etc. The running gear is in the process of being sold. I already have another Cinq shell as the basis for project Fiyota (which may be renamed Toyfiat).

But, I wondered, given that the passenger space is pretty much OK, why not spaceframe the thing and pop in a bigger engine? Motors that come to mind are the ubiquitous K series (in 1800 guise): light, cheap (but would need total rebuild),lots of knowledge and tuning parts out there at sane prices, maybe 165bhp in fast road trim) or the 1.8 Turbo VAG lump (replace water pump, heavier lump, packaging an issue with the tub, what, 210bhp or so). Either should propel a Cinq pretty well.........

Here's the more difficult part of the planning (and blagging bits) stage: the project will not use the inner wings from the Cinq, hence it won't use McP struts -- it will use twin wishbones at the front which gives a lot more freedom in terms of where the engine goes and adjustability (essential if it is to handle at all well). Problem is, I need FWD hubs/uprights which will take wishbones -- it may be possible to adapt -- not by welding -- strut type uprights, but a wishbone set up would be a better place to start. Apart from the mini (and a few expensive Hondas and modern Alfas) Any ideas? Quite like the idea of a pushrod set up........

Goes without saying that this is (or will be, if it ever gets started) a very long term project -- there's Blue to finish, then Project Toyfiat, as well as regular work...........

 

[ycming]

why bother with the K-series, as the honda engine (B16 or even the D16 (single cam vtec)) is much more reliable and against is light~

Ming

 

[fingers99]

K series is a great engine, just needs building properly. Thing is, you can't trust one unless you've rebuilt it, but you can pick them up for £50 - 60 quid.

 

[fordcosworth]

considered a the slightly larger 2 litre rover 220 turbo engine? its a honda engine with some huge poke as standard?? to big??
sounds like a hell of a project this anyway

jason

 

[allanhelen]

I would gut it, get whatever you can for the bits and rebuild the Origional blue before it rusts away or just drop the working engine and drive train into blue and use it 'till your silly engine is ready

after all a man with two!!!! non roadworthy cinq's is not a real.......... i'll let you fill in the rest

 

[fordcosworth]

strip it, and fit an hayabusa 1300cc motorbike engine , a company called rotherham garage near me have two cinqs with them engines in, running 193bhp in both, may not have huge torque but god they must fly!
what about that for a conversion?

jason

 

[ycming]

strip it, and fit an hayabusa 1300cc motorbike engine , a company called rotherham garage near me have two cinqs with them engines in, running 193bhp in both, may not have huge torque but god they must fly!
what about that for a conversion?

jason

recon price is a factor for this project too mate

those engine are not cheap!!

Ming

 

[fordcosworth]

mager good point there
a friend has a westfiled with that engine, think he payed 1500 quid out of a crashed motorbike!

shame, must say though the guy bought the bike as a crashed example and after breaking it he almost covered the cost of the engine.

jason

 

[Slosei]

Honda b18c4 Engine and box only weight short of 150kgs i measured up and it could fit but i dont have the time or the know how to do it myself plus it will sit bit further forward giving not so good handling imo
the punto HGT 1800 twink is bit narrower than the honda lump and box
the novitec seicento HGT I been told handled like a drunk pig

 

[ycming]

Honda b18c4 Engine and box only weight short of 150kgs i measured up and it could fit but i dont have the time or the know how to do it myself plus it will sit bit further forward giving not so good handling imo
the punto HGT 1800 twink is bit narrower than the honda lump and box
the novitec seicento HGT I been told handled like a drunk pig

Honestly, the extra money you pay over the b16 to the b18c is pure daft! (really i doubt u will need that miuch power )

But anyway price is a factor here¬!!

Ming

 

[Slosei]

Iv got the engine box its in the civic of mine lol
lovely thing with it is JUST with a super sprint manifold and exhaust system they claim it makes an extra 16bhp
169hp up to 185hp. To add-
some pistons from the integra type r take C/R near 11.5-1 and full valve train from ek9 type r and be close to 200bhp from 1800cc lol off the shelf stuff so its easy(expensive?) so its boring having it in a honda i guess

 

[arc]

considered a the slightly larger 2 litre rover 220 turbo engine? its a honda engine with some huge poke as standard?? to big??
sounds like a hell of a project this anyway

jason

nah, the 220 turbo engine is a T series rover engine mated to a PG1 gearbox. and it weighs much much much

 

[randomizered]

A package like this would be great:

http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/Honda-Civic-T...14&_trkparms=72:1683|66:2|65:12|39:1|240:1318

Loads of parts you need without worrying about breaking the whole car. Would sound great screaming to 9K

Kristian

 

[ycming]

A package like this would be great:

http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/Honda-Civic-T...14&_trkparms=72:1683|66:2|65:12|39:1|240:1318

Loads of parts you need without worrying about breaking the whole car. Would sound great screaming to 9K

Kristian

total rip off of a price that , whole reason why they so expensive is because it is very rare! from the civic type R

Ming

 

[randomizered]

aye, i know its expensive, hence why i haven't bought it But it would be nice fitted DOes come with the box, lsd, shafts, ecus, looms etc though

 

[Slosei]

Im more concerned about the handling though, but will make a very fast cento and sound just as fast
evan if the aero deck(estate) folk are like WTF when i hit 6k rpm
half decent turbo cento has more torque though :slayer:
Zak

 

[fingers99]

Im more concerned about the handling though, but will make a very fast cento and sound just as fast
evan if the aero deck(estate) folk are like WTF when i hit 6k rpm
half decent turbo cento has more torque though :slayer:
Zak

Yep. Me too. Point is, K Series is light and cheap. Although it'll kick out 200bhp in race trim, that's really too much for a front engined Cinq. 160 or so should be enough to more than keep up with the 1.4 16v ones and give the smaller tubs a hard time. And cheaply. I have a simple rear engined Cinq project (ToyFiat) on the drawing board anyway....... 700bhp should be adequate..........

Biggest advantage the K has over the 1.4 16v (apart from price) is that it's such a well known quantity. Everything is available, most of it for cheap money. All the tricks -- including solid followers -- are documented.

Why not just put Blue on the road with Blue 2's old motor? Well, emotionally, I couldn't use Blue as an everyday car -- it'd mean putting it in the firing line of 18 year old students who think they're immortal a bit too often. Practically, Blue 2's engine needs a rebuild and Blue now has 15" wheels, which even a 1242 8v will find a struggle (and I still need to build an arch roller). Orange will soon serve as everyday transport.

Any ideas on the uprights?

 

[ycming]

aye, i know its expensive, hence why i haven't bought it But it would be nice fitted DOes come with the box, lsd, shafts, ecus, looms etc though

Relistically, you should do this as you can map it urself with the MS!!!!!!!!!!!

Ming

 

[chaos]

Any ideas on the uprights?

What about looking at the likes of Locost? I know they're mostly RWD but it could be adaptable?