General 5.3L/100km in my 1.4 Sport

[alexGS]

My 500 is all back together with its extra sound deadening, probably weighs about 50kg more than before, I'll update that other thread soon.

I was surprised to get suddenly very good fuel economy - over 40km an indicated 5.3L/100km, which is 53mpg. Average speed 84km/h. I'd usually got more like 6.8L/100km) so I brimmed the tank to check it was correct

Now I've been driving around town, the average has gone up to 6.3L/100km but this is still good considering all the short trips (average speed 37km/h). I'm rather happy with the sudden personality change it's had. Just goes to show that whatever engine you have in your 500, you can get great economy at least some of the time

-Alex

 

[ahmett]

Wow nice lowest i have got is 6.9 l /100 km over a full tank covering around 500 km's!
How were you driving, were you cruising in top gear most of the time?

 

[alexGS]

Wow nice lowest i have got is 6.9 l /100 km over a full tank covering around 500 km's!
How were you driving, were you cruising in top gear most of the time?

It was actually quite steep terrain between Raglan and Hamilton so wasn't often in 5th (top gear for Dualogic as you know) - had to work quite hard in 3rd and 4th, but obviously made up for it going down the other side

I often wonder what 6th would be like for hills. Sometimes I reckon it can hardly pull the skin off a rice pudding in 5th Generally I think the choice of gearing is very good, and the CO2 emissions are said to be fractionally less for the Dualogic, which suggests to me that 6th is actually unnecessary. Or that Italian specifications vary every few months!

I did eventually find the gear ratios at http://pub43.bravenet.com/faq/show.php?usernum=3629891555&catid=9902 The Dualogic for 1.2 or 1.4 has the same ratios as the 5-speed for 1.2. The 6-speed compared to the 5-speed is about what you would expect - has a higher first gear, same 2nd, 3rd, and 4th, a lower 5th, and a higher 6th. I imagine that high speed motorway cruising (140km/h?) might suit the 6th ratio but I suspect that for NZ's 100km/h speed limit, the 5-speed 5th is optimal.

-Alex

 

[ahmett]

It was actually quite steep terrain between Raglan and Hamilton so wasn't often in 5th (top gear for Dualogic as you know) - had to work quite hard in 3rd and 4th, but obviously made up for it going down the other side

I often wonder what 6th would be like for hills. I think I found somewhere that the first five ratios are the same (manual compared to Dualogic). Sometimes I reckon it can hardly pull the skin off a rice pudding in 5th Generally I think the choice of gearing is very good, and the CO2 emissions are said to be fractionally less for the Dualogic, which suggests to me that 6th is actually unnecessary. Or that Italian specifications vary every few months!

-Alex

I feel that 6th would help in cruising around 120-130 kmh help keep the consumption a bit lower. I think fiat didnt do it for cost reasons.

 

[alexGS]

I feel that 6th would help in cruising around 120-130 kmh help keep the consumption a bit lower. I think fiat didnt do it for cost reasons.

Yeah, same as I was thinking. Since official consumption/emissions tests top out at 120km/h, that's probably why the 5-speed seems to have the edge. If you get to go faster than that, then you'd want the 6-speed.

I had an Uno 60 1116cc once, which only had a 4-speed. Some versions (60S) had a 5-speed, where the first four ratios were the same, but interestingly there was no difference in the claimed 'steady 90km/h' fuel consumption (there was a small improvement in the 'steady 120km/h' consumption) and the top speed was actually higher in 4th than 5th. Eventually I went to the trouble of fitting a 5-speed transmission and it made no useful difference except a reduction in engine noise... This all seems to quantify what we're saying here, which is: the highest gear isn't always the best, it depends on the load placed on the engine.

I remember that eco: drive seems to only be happy when you've got into 5th by 20mph, and it doesn't even bother giving advice for the Dualogic at all, "since your car changes gear automatically". Sometimes I do drive in Auto mode, but generally I still think that I can do a better job of anticipating the conditions ahead than it can... which is essential for economical driving

-Alex

 

[ahmett]

Yeah, same as I was thinking. Since official consumption/emissions tests top out at 120km/h, that's probably why the 5-speed seems to have the edge. If you get to go faster than that, then you'd want the 6-speed.

I had an Uno 60 1116cc once, which only had a 4-speed. Some versions (60S) had a 5-speed, where the first four ratios were the same, but interestingly there was no difference in the claimed 'steady 90km/h' fuel consumption (there was a small improvement in the 'steady 120km/h' consumption) and the top speed was actually higher in 4th than 5th. This all seems to quantify what we're saying here, which is: the highest gear isn't always the best, it depends on the load placed on the engine.

I remember that eco: drive seems to only be happy when you've got into 5th by 20mph, and it doesn't even bother giving advice for the Dualogic at all, "since your car changes gear automatically". Sometimes I do drive in Auto mode, but generally I still think that I can do a better job of anticipating the conditions ahead... which is essential for economical driving

-Alex

I use auto if i am stuck in traffic or really lazy. A cool trick of auto is if you are cruising in 5th at like 30 mph and you want to take a corner you just dab the throttle hard and let go immediately and the car changes automatically into 2nd so i can take a sharp bend using the engine braking without having to press the brake or change gears myself, auto takes care of it for me! = )

 

[alexGS]

I use auto if i am stuck in traffic or really lazy. A cool trick of auto is if you are cruising in 5th at like 30 mph and you want to take a corner you just dab the throttle hard and let go immediately and the car changes automatically into 2nd so i can take a sharp bend using the engine braking without having to press the brake or change gears myself, auto takes care of it for me! = )

That sounds like Sport mode - or maybe not, since in Sport mode it won't go into 5th at 50km/h-30mph. I didn't know it would change all the way from 5th down to 2nd by itself, I probably haven't dabbed the throttle hard enough

I notice in Sport auto mode it changes down as soon as I brake.

I'm in Sport manual mode about 90% of the time and if I'm feeling a little aggressive, I double-click the left paddle as I approach a T-junction in 4th. This overrides its own 4th-3rd down-change, and gets me 2nd just when I need it - the system is very good at responding to driver inputs without also doing its own down-change (older Alfa Selespeed would sometimes end up in 1st...)

I use the 500's paddles more than the lever, because unfortunately FIAT decided to swap the lever's + and - positions compared to the older systems. If I get used to the 500's lever, when I get into my automatic Alfa 166 (Sportronic not Selespeed), I have sometimes moved the lever backward intending a nifty up-change and instead engaged 1st at 70km/h. I made a similar mistake in a Selespeed 147 the other week as well :slayer:

-Alex

 

[ahmett]

That sounds like Sport mode - or maybe not, since in Sport mode it won't go into 5th at 50km/h-30mph. I didn't know it would change all the way from 5th down to 2nd by itself, I probably haven't dabbed the throttle hard enough

I notice in Sport auto mode it changes down as soon as I brake.

I'm in Sport manual mode about 90% of the time and if I'm feeling a little aggressive, I double-click the left paddle as I approach a T-junction in 4th. This overrides its own 4th-3rd down-change, and gets me 2nd just when I need it - the system is very good at responding to driver inputs without also doing its own down-change (older Alfa Selespeed would sometimes end up in 1st...)

I use the 500's paddles more than the lever, because unfortunately FIAT decided to swap the lever's + and - positions compared to the older systems. If I get used to the 500's lever, when I get into my automatic Alfa 166 (Sportronic not Selespeed), I have sometimes moved the lever backward intending a nifty up-change and instead engaged 1st at 70km/h. I made a similar mistake in a Selespeed 147 the other week as well :slayer:

-Alex

Yes try it out on normal mode with the throttle hard and it will go down to 2nd! I prefer using the brakes after or at the same time as downshifts dont want to wear down my pads too easily!
I love the +/- position on the lever (i dont have the paddles), its just like a racing car.

 

[loveshandbags]

I feel that 6th would help in cruising around 120-130 kmh help keep the consumption a bit lower. I think fiat didnt do it for cost reasons.

The 5 speed gearbox might just be a tougher gearbox than the 6 speed plus with fewer gears there would be less jerking.

It was actually quite steep terrain between Raglan and Hamilton so wasn't often in 5th (top gear for Dualogic as you know) - had to work quite hard in 3rd and 4th, but obviously made up for it going down the other side

I often wonder what 6th would be like for hills. Sometimes I reckon it can hardly pull the skin off a rice pudding in 5th Generally I think the choice of gearing is very good, and the CO2 emissions are said to be fractionally less for the Dualogic, which suggests to me that 6th is actually unnecessary. Or that Italian specifications vary every few months!

I did eventually find the gear ratios at http://pub43.bravenet.com/faq/show.php?usernum=3629891555&catid=9902 The Dualogic for 1.2 or 1.4 has the same ratios as the 5-speed for 1.2. The 6-speed compared to the 5-speed is about what you would expect - has a higher first gear, same 2nd, 3rd, and 4th, a lower 5th, and a higher 6th. I imagine that high speed motorway cruising (140km/h?) might suit the 6th ratio but I suspect that for NZ's 100km/h speed limit, the 5-speed 5th is optimal.

-Alex

What's missing from that link is the final gearbox ratio. From memory it's the same on the TA, 1.2 & 1.4 but the MJ is different since it works at lower revs.

The problem with the 5 speed ratios in the Dualogic in the 1.4 is than 2nd gear needs to be reved to 7K to stay in the power band of 4K when you go into 3rd. That isn't needed on the manual 6 speed.

Great to see that you're getting good mpg out of your 1.4.