Technical 4x4 Gearbox internals.

[Dragon Man]

i am watching this thread with heightened interest. though i dont think i can offer you any help

i wanted to turn my 5th gear into an "over drive" gear for high speed roads. i had to change the gearbox in my sisley as it was mostly eaten up. however i did find out that you could get access to 5th while the box was still on the car (by taking the end cap off)

i'd still like to know if the cinqs 5th gear is a bit taller than the pandas.
i have saved what was left of my 5th gears to one day compare them to ones in a cinqs box (when i have the car on the road and i am able to go to the scrap yard)

see i didnt want to go down the route of messing around with the diff, i just wanted to change the final gear.

i still have a lot of my original gearbox in a pile in the back garden.. lol (saved the diff though, was in real good condition)

 

[totnesmonster]

Right, quick update but have now got the gearbox back in and all back together, and it seems to work pretty well so far, touch wood, much higher gearing than before (I now actually need to use 1st to pull away!). I am currently running with slightly larger than standard tyres though. 4x4 still works fine (though no crawler gear, 1st is OK though) gearchange is actually the best I've had on a Panda at the moment and all running nice and quiet, just hope it all stays that way!

I'll report back again soon, if I'm feeling keen I might even do a guide.....!

 

[pandamaniac]

If it works, just duplicate the box a few times and we'll all have one!
Direct exchange @ £50 a pop
I was charged £500 for a rebuild on my box and my only complaint has always been the ratios on the 4x4 are too low. ( Except in snow)
Dave

 

[Dragon Man]

i wonder if bits from the 6 speed could be fitted into the 5 speed 4x4 box... if that could be done could custom gears for 6th be made as an over drive?

i have never seen the 6 speed box though but i know its almost the same as the 5 speed but just a little longer. hmm i guess the selector would have to be changed too as on the 5 speed 5 and reverse share the same movement on a 6 speed i guess the reverse is a separate movement.

wonder if it could be done though......
thats one for the thought of the day thread.. heh

 

[AlfistaCy]

any update on this?

 

[olNick]

i wanted to turn my 5th gear into an "over drive" gear for high speed roads. i had to change the gearbox in my sisley as it was mostly eaten up. however i did find out that you could get access to 5th while the box was still on the car (by taking the end cap off).......

Hi,
Could you expand a bit on this please. Is the bearing also accessible for replacement here as I have a 5th gear whine, in an otherwise very good box. I saw similar references in one of the input shaft bearing threads but cant seem to find it now.
Vehicle is ca. 2000 Trekking, 1.1 SPI

regards,

nick

 

[Dragon Man]

Hi,
Could you expand a bit on this please. Is the bearing also accessible for replacement here as I have a 5th gear whine, in an otherwise very good box. I saw similar references in one of the input shaft bearing threads but cant seem to find it now.
Vehicle is ca. 2000 Trekking, 1.1 SPI

regards,

nick

hey Nick, yeah if you take off the wheel on the gearbox side you will see the end of the gearbox sticking out of the wheel arch. you can take this cap off and get assess to 5th as it is right at the end of the gearbox. you dont have to worry about emptying all the gearbox oil as that will be down in the diff and not up this high so none will spill out when you take the cover off.

you will probably find that your 5th has some chipped teeth causing the whine. take pictures as you do it though, show the word!
sadly i did not do any videos on the gearbox. i have a few but they do not show the bit i was referring to.

Check out videos 17,18 and 19. should help you.. maybe.


hope this helps. the chewed up gear i show you in video 18 is 5th!

 

[olNick]

Nope, the 4x4 take off is after the final drive, so the rear wheels will always go the same speed as the fronts regardless of the final drive ratio(I didn't realise this at first). The spiral bevel gear that takes drive to the propshaft hasn't been changed. Anyway the 3.78 final drive is now fitted to the 4x4 diff ok having drilled the holes at work, it's hardened steel so needed a carbide drill bit. Just need to get the rest back in now, a couple of new bearings and shove it in the car sometime.

Can someone explain this a bit clearer... I'm having trouble visualizing this.

regards,
Nick

 

[binhoker]

my 4x4 box is a bit rattly and i have a low milage 2wd box on the shelf. my ears are pricked. i do kinda like the extra low 1st but.

 

[totnesmonster]

Can someone explain this a bit clearer... I'm having trouble visualizing this.

regards,
Nick

Crikey, this thread's still going.....! The Panda is having a bit of a break currently but hopefully back in action in the next few months, a sill repair seems to have turned into a complete stripdown, rebuild and paint job...

From what I remember the takeoff for the rear propshaft is the same ratio as the rear axle, the gearing for the takeoff doesn't change in this mod, so the rears will always turn at the same speed as the front wheels.

It's only the gearing between the gearbox and the front diff that changes, so by raising overall ratio between engine and front wheels automatically raises the ratio between engine and back wheels too. Hope this makes some sense!

 

[willianallen]

Crikey, this thread's still going.....! The Panda is having a bit of a break currently but hopefully back in action in the next few months, a sill repair seems to have turned into a complete stripdown, rebuild and paint job...

From what I remember the takeoff for the rear propshaft is the same ratio as the rear axle, the gearing for the takeoff doesn't change in this mod, so the rears will always turn at the same speed as the front wheels.

It's only the gearing between the gearbox and the front diff that changes, so by raising overall ratio between engine and front wheels automatically raises the ratio between engine and back wheels too. Hope this makes some sense!

Hi, sorry to drag this up again, I am rebuilding a Sisley box , I have a 1.2 16v Punto engine and would like a higher ratio 5 gear, what gear did you use? Thanks in advance!!