Technical 2015 1.2 clutch/slave cylinder issues

[snappy047]

Hey guys,


After some help trying to track down a issue with my sisters fiat 500, recently she broke down where she could no longer able to get the car in gear, she managed to pump the clutch pedal for a good 30 seconds and able to limp it home. thinking naturally the slave cylinder needed changing and went ahead today and did that all went fine. after bleeding i hooked back up the battery and started it and it won't select a single gear at all. if i have the car turned off it will happily select through the whole box normally and even with the no foot on the clutch pedal to it will go through all the gears.


I was thinking it may need bleeding again as i read a few issues about the coil in the pipes causing air bubbles to trap, but the pedal feels pretty firm and i can't feel a issue with that. Is there something more serious going on here with the clutch?


Cheers Alex

 

[John202020]

Hi did you take apart the quick connect or just remove the pipe from the slave?
First thing bleed the system again, does the pedal feel "normal"? Ie some resistance

 

[Ralf S.]

Yes.. it just needs more bleeding. If you have a pressure bleeding system then that's better.... .but analogue "pump the pedal" works eventually.

On mine I didn't bother closing the bleed screw each time before releasing the pedal... but you have to pump the pedal frequently enough for air not to be drawn back in.


Ralf S.

 

[snappy047]

Hi did you take apart the quick connect or just remove the pipe from the slave?
First thing bleed the system again, does the pedal feel "normal"? Ie some resistance

so ive bleed it again for some time and still no luck, Local garage who is use but can't look at it for a few weeks suggested to replace the pipe from the master to the slave they say they do this a lot and normally solves the issue. Have you heard of this before?

 

[snappy047]

Yes.. it just needs more bleeding. If you have a pressure bleeding system then that's better.... .but analogue "pump the pedal" works eventually.

On mine I didn't bother closing the bleed screw each time before releasing the pedal... but you have to pump the pedal frequently enough for air not to be drawn back in.


Ralf S.

Did bleed again using the the pump pedal method some air did come out in the first 5 pumps then nothing. think i may change this pipe ive mentioned below.

 

[koalar]

If someone presses the pedal down inside the car

How much does slave cylinder plunger move

 

[koalar]

Why can’t you select a gear. Is there a grinding noise

All gears ? Or just 1st

Does it go into gear with the engine off ?

 

[John202020]

so ive bleed it again for some time and still no luck, Local garage who is use but can't look at it for a few weeks suggested to replace the pipe from the master to the slave they say they do this a lot and normally solves the issue. Have you heard of this before?

Under near the passenger wheel is a connector if this is NOT leaking then the pipe is OK I'd suspect both slave and master which you can replace and use the old pipe?

 

[jrkitching]

Failure of either master or slave is more likely than pipe failure; the connector usually only leaks if it's disturbed. But once the connector is disturbed, the pipes often can't be reattached without leaking, and if one cylinder has failed, generally the other isn't far behind it. So (particularly if keeping the car for a few years) it could prove easier ond cheaper in the long run just to replace both now. If you buy OEM parts, whilst not the cheapest option, they'll come prefilled with fluid and with all the pipes and connector already attached, making installation as easy as possible - some say it's not even necessary to bleed it.

I'm not generally a fan of replacing more than is absolutely required, but dubious 500/Panda clutch hydraulics is one of my exceptions.

Continuing to drive with a dragging clutch is an excellent way to wreck the synchromesh cones in the gearbox, and replacing these isn't a cheap or easy job.

 

[koalar]

We need to confirm the hydraulics is actually the problem

There many other reasons for not being able to select gears

Release bearing gone through the fingers

Rust in the selector cables

And many more

I wouldn’t be changing anything until the cause of the problem had been confirmed

 

[jrkitching]

I wouldn’t be changing anything until the cause of the problem had been confirmed

Agreed, but

if i have the car turned off it will happily select through the whole box normally

probably rules out the cables and increases my suspicion of the clutch actuating mechanism, particularly the hydraulics.

As you've said, having an assistant press the clutch pedal whilst observing the slave cylinder response is a logical next step.

I certainly wouldn't be messing with the hydraulic pipework at this stage.

 

[koalar]

Agreed, but

probably rules out the cables and increases my suspicion of hydraulics.

As you've said, having an assistant press the clutch pedal whilst observing the slave cylinder response is a logical next step.

I certainly wouldn't be messing with the hydraulic pipework at this stage.

Correct

I missed the bit about working with the engine off

Yep plunger should be moving about 15mm when the pedal pressed

Carpet stuck under pedal is quite common

 

[jrkitching]

Carpet stuck under pedal is quite common

Many years ago I saw one where pedal travel had been seriously compromised; a brief inspection showed the cause to be an item of ladies footwear.

I thought the owner would be pleased to avoid a bill for a new clutch, but the reality is that they were more concerned about the condition of their shoe.