hymerhobo
New member
- Joined
- Dec 8, 2006
- Messages
- 31
- Points
- 13
The title alone would have caused some people here to look twice, as I've read that at least one of you thinks that 1997 2.5 TDi's don't have an ECU. Mine has. I've seen it, and it appears to be causing problems.
Intermittent power loss, or stuttering, is perhaps the best way to describe it, a problem not unknown in the wacky world of ECU's. The problem comes and goes, and appears to be caused or worsened by vibration.
Over the years, I've taken the vehicle (a Hymer motorhome built on a 1997 8140.47R Ducato) to a number of mechanics, including a Fiat main agent in France, but no-one to date has found the root cause. I booked the van into the Fiat agent for a diagnostic test, but when I drove it in and one guy opened the bonnet, there was a stampede of mechanics all wanting to look in the engine bay. They'd never seen an arrangement like it. Although there _is_ an ECU, it only takes care of rudimentary duties as the fuel pump is of the old-fashioned sort that meters diesel to each cylinder. Although they looked for a diagnostic port, they couldn't find one.
Over the years, there have been a number of theories expounded, including fuel lines letting in air, the fuel filter mesh being too fine, the MAF sensor needing to be replaced, the fuel pump solenoid cable being suspect, and so on. I've had work done on a number of occasions, but nothing has worked to date.
One of my favourite theories (I've had a few) has been a loose connection, probably to a sensor. But no amount of wire-wiggling or connector-tapping has produced so much as a hint of a stutter. Admittedly these test have been carried out with the vehicle stationary and ticking over - I've yet to find a volunteer willing to stand on the bumper while I'm driving.
This year I contacted a number of independent ECU analysts, but none has my particular ECU model number (Bosch 0281 001 224) listed in their databases. I thought it possible that the motorhome builders might have fitted a custom ECU, so I contacted Hymer. But they affirmed that the ECU fitted definitely came from Fiat. So can I ask anyone here who happens to have a similar van whether they have the same ECU.
One of these ECU specialists declared that there _is_ a diagnostic port on my vehicle. He said it was a 2-pin port and situated under the bonnet near the battery. I thought it unlikely (data comms normally needs more wires after all), but lo and behold when I looked this morning, I found a strange object. Oblong, mounted on the bulkhead, pointing upwards, and with a rubber cap, what I saw has 3 wires connecting it. When I removed said cap, I saw a circular white plastic moulding with what appears to be 2 or 3 connectors recessed into it. It may well be a socket of some description, but it's not of a type I've ever seen before.
As you can see from the pic, I've held a mirror up against it so the top can be seen more clearly. Can anyone here confirm that this _is_ a diagnostic port, and if so, what sort of plug it takes.
If it isn't a port, WTH is it??
This afternoon I talked with a technician in Guest Trucks (the Fiat agent in Wolverhampton), and according to him the ECU doesn't control any engine function (he thought) other than opening and shutting the EGR valve (maybe, possibly, it's hard to say without seeing the vehicle). I asked about the diagnostic port, and he said it was probably an older type of connector. I asked what the name for it was, and he said he didn't know. I asked whether I could bring the vehicle in for a diagnostic test, and he said it was doubtful whether they'd be able to connect it up to their equipment. He informed me that his company send all their 'computers' back to Fiat on a regular basis, so they simply cannot connect to older vehicles. I asked whether he was saying in effect that the vehicle was unrepairable, and he promptly denied this, saying that I might well be able to get it seen to elsewhere.
But not, it appears, by the Fiat main agent in Wolverhampton!
So my third question (for now) is can anyone here confirm that the 1997 engine does in fact have an EGR valve. If so, it seems these little beasties can get clogged, remain open when they shouldn't, and generally mess up the engine's performance.
That's it for now I think. Thanks for reading, and even more thanks if you have any information to impart.
Intermittent power loss, or stuttering, is perhaps the best way to describe it, a problem not unknown in the wacky world of ECU's. The problem comes and goes, and appears to be caused or worsened by vibration.
Over the years, I've taken the vehicle (a Hymer motorhome built on a 1997 8140.47R Ducato) to a number of mechanics, including a Fiat main agent in France, but no-one to date has found the root cause. I booked the van into the Fiat agent for a diagnostic test, but when I drove it in and one guy opened the bonnet, there was a stampede of mechanics all wanting to look in the engine bay. They'd never seen an arrangement like it. Although there _is_ an ECU, it only takes care of rudimentary duties as the fuel pump is of the old-fashioned sort that meters diesel to each cylinder. Although they looked for a diagnostic port, they couldn't find one.
Over the years, there have been a number of theories expounded, including fuel lines letting in air, the fuel filter mesh being too fine, the MAF sensor needing to be replaced, the fuel pump solenoid cable being suspect, and so on. I've had work done on a number of occasions, but nothing has worked to date.
One of my favourite theories (I've had a few) has been a loose connection, probably to a sensor. But no amount of wire-wiggling or connector-tapping has produced so much as a hint of a stutter. Admittedly these test have been carried out with the vehicle stationary and ticking over - I've yet to find a volunteer willing to stand on the bumper while I'm driving.
This year I contacted a number of independent ECU analysts, but none has my particular ECU model number (Bosch 0281 001 224) listed in their databases. I thought it possible that the motorhome builders might have fitted a custom ECU, so I contacted Hymer. But they affirmed that the ECU fitted definitely came from Fiat. So can I ask anyone here who happens to have a similar van whether they have the same ECU.
One of these ECU specialists declared that there _is_ a diagnostic port on my vehicle. He said it was a 2-pin port and situated under the bonnet near the battery. I thought it unlikely (data comms normally needs more wires after all), but lo and behold when I looked this morning, I found a strange object. Oblong, mounted on the bulkhead, pointing upwards, and with a rubber cap, what I saw has 3 wires connecting it. When I removed said cap, I saw a circular white plastic moulding with what appears to be 2 or 3 connectors recessed into it. It may well be a socket of some description, but it's not of a type I've ever seen before.
As you can see from the pic, I've held a mirror up against it so the top can be seen more clearly. Can anyone here confirm that this _is_ a diagnostic port, and if so, what sort of plug it takes.
If it isn't a port, WTH is it??
This afternoon I talked with a technician in Guest Trucks (the Fiat agent in Wolverhampton), and according to him the ECU doesn't control any engine function (he thought) other than opening and shutting the EGR valve (maybe, possibly, it's hard to say without seeing the vehicle). I asked about the diagnostic port, and he said it was probably an older type of connector. I asked what the name for it was, and he said he didn't know. I asked whether I could bring the vehicle in for a diagnostic test, and he said it was doubtful whether they'd be able to connect it up to their equipment. He informed me that his company send all their 'computers' back to Fiat on a regular basis, so they simply cannot connect to older vehicles. I asked whether he was saying in effect that the vehicle was unrepairable, and he promptly denied this, saying that I might well be able to get it seen to elsewhere.
But not, it appears, by the Fiat main agent in Wolverhampton!
So my third question (for now) is can anyone here confirm that the 1997 engine does in fact have an EGR valve. If so, it seems these little beasties can get clogged, remain open when they shouldn't, and generally mess up the engine's performance.
That's it for now I think. Thanks for reading, and even more thanks if you have any information to impart.
