endrop - for all your online needs

Technical 1.9 JTD smoke

Currently reading:
Technical 1.9 JTD smoke

OK, to conclude this (neverending) story.

Sluggish behaviour was caused by combination of EGR valve being stuck from time to time and dirty/faulty MAF sensor.

The power loss (loads of black smoke) below 2000-2200 RPM was definitely caused by faulty EGR valve as I got it cleaned at the service, and now that problem is gone (y)

Then, I was left with general sluggish behaviour, so I disconnected the MAF sensor again and I could notice the improvement again. The problem was, when I tried to determine the problem in the first place, during MAF connect/disconnect tries, EGR valve began to stuck, so I was completely confused.

And now, I tried to unscrew MAF sensor, only to realize that screw head is not the 'security torx 20' (torx with a small circle pin in the middle) but something similar, the 5-way star torx with a pin. There is no way I can find a bit like that, so i'll just have to force it with some kind of clamps.(n)

Again, thank you for your replies.
 
So I finally cleaned the MAF sensor (easy job once you get those odd screws out).

Small silver plates on it were covered with something black. I used pure 100% alcohol and cotton sticks, and then video-head cleaning spray. If someone is interessted, only spraying will not do, as spray could not dissolve that black layer. If using spray, please pay attention that it does not leave any residue (this should be written somewhere on the can).
It is not as sensitive as I tought, you could break it only if you drop it on hard surface or something like that.

So, I'll test the car during the next few days, and let you know what happened.
 
hello everyone,

i am newbie here and to a 1.9 JTD weekend. i am from malaysia and there are only a few weekend running around here. therefore, i think this forum will be the most resourcesfull for me to solve problem.

my 1.9 105 jtd seems like perform below spec. so maybe is MAF as what u all discuss about here. btw, what is MAF stands for? Mass Air Flowmeter?

however, my weekend doesn't split out black smoke. just that very slow acceleration even in 1st n 2nd gear. also, hardly can hear the turbo 'whistling' sound. some questions.

1. what would be the boost pressure like?
2. what should be the fuel line pressure for in and reture?
3. is the turbo activated by vacumm actuator or electronically?

it also got 'tut tut' noise coming from front n rear when going over bump or uneven road. some told me absorber is out and some told me could be the trailing arm bearing, link rod, rubber bushes, etc.

hope your all can help me up so that i don't have to waste my money for something is not true. parts here will cost a bomb!!!

thank you.
 
I would read back through the thread and try out the suggestions already listed. A dirty MAF (you're correct about what it means) is highly likely (low power, no black smoke suggests under fuelling) and can be tested easily by disconnecting it.

Regarding your questions, I can't comment directly onto the FIAT set up however the common rail engines I work with are 2 bar boost and 1700 Bar (24,000psi) fuel pressure.

The turbo wastegate is actuated purely by pressure (not vacuum) from the compressor outlet on the 2.4 JTD so there's a strong likelyhood that the 1.9 JTD is not controlled through electronic solenoids either.
 
RS,

thanks for your info. yeah...i have been reading alot in the forum related to overboost, black smoke, etc which related to 1.9 105 JTD.

i will try your suggestion. if i by pass MAF, how come the engine still can run if the ECU don't even detect airflow? Or it is detecting max air flow and pump in more diesel?

someone mentioned that there should be a whossing sounds when changing gear due to wastegate open. mine hardly (or no) can't here that. does that means no boost build up at all? anyone install a boost meter in a JTD? where should i connect the meter i i want to? right before manifold?

how about turbo timer? isn't it better if i put in a 3 minutes timer before shut off for cooling?

thank you....
 
You're not bypassing the MAF, you're actually disconnecting it. The engine management allows a little more fuelling than a dirty MAF in this condition but I wouldn't drive it like this for long.

To install a boost gauge, simply plumb up to the hose fixed to the wastegate actuator. Low boost doesn't necessaily show a turbo problem - If you're not getting the correct amount of fuel into the engine, the turbo basically won't spin as fast and generate as much pressure.

Turbo timers are handy little gadgets - I had one fitted to my Lancer Evolution. You don't often hear about them being fitted to diesels. If you're driving below say 50 kph for the last minute or so before parking the car, the temperature and speed of the turbo wouldn't need you to idle the engine before turning off. If you're coming straight off a motorway or a very fast road and then turning the engine straight off you could cause damage to the turbo. What you're trying to do before turning off the engine is getting the temperature and speed of the turbo down so that the oil doesn't carbonise onto its bearings.
 
looks like a turbo timing should be good for my case. my office is just beside a highway and less than 5 mins i already park it. with the timer, will it disturb the original alarm system and immobiliser?

i already list down all the possible causes and ready to DIY. hope i will restore the engine power. btw, u mention that i should connet the boost meter at the wastegate actuator. does that means it is a mechanical pressure release valve and not control by electronic?

is our JTD turbo always 'on' and not after certain rpm?

hope u can share more.

thanks.
 
RS Pilot,

I found that my 1.9 105JTD seems too noisy at idling. When the air con kicks it, the engine rpm will drops slightly and make a 'knocking' sound before back to 850rpm. this happens within 1sec. can't really tell it is coming from the internal engine or some parts in the engine bay is hitting something due to vibration.

by the way, how to check its injector ignition timing and the turbo boost? my JTD comes with variable geometry turbo? Seems like anything below 2,000rpm is very weak.

thank you.
 
When aircon starts, it is normal for rpm to drop for a split second, then back to normal. What you may be hearing is just more vibration due to lower RPM. Maybe engine mounts are gone? Mine went, and everything was vibrating, steering wheel, pedals etc.
Had it replaced and it cured the problem (but only for 3 months or so, it began vibrating again).

Also when starting it in cold mornings (before mount replacement) I could hear some clunking (realy loud) for a few seconds. I shut the engine off, start it again, and no odd sounds. As I said, the sypmtoms dissapeared when engine mount was replaced.
 
The knocking could be a number of things. Fbarcode is probably along the correct lines with a broken engine mount although it could be a problem with the aircon clutch. The JTD engines have pre injection to quieten down the combustion noise at low revs and this is controlled by the ECU. It could be (but unlikely) that this is not operating below say 800rpm.

Regarding measuring injection timing, this is all controlled electronically. The engine gets a signal from a tone wheel on the crank giving it engine speed and position data. Only by going into the ECU (electonically) can you read injection timing parameters.

For measuring boost pressure, you can plumb in a mechanical gauge to the pipe that runs to the turbo's actautor solenoid.

Going back to one of your earlier questions, the turbo is spinning all of the time as it's driven by exhaust gases, it just becomes a lot more effective as rpm increases. The later JTD's had VG turbo's which were supposed to reduce lag - ie the time for the turbo to 'spool up' and produce positive pressure into the air intake.
 
hello there,

thanks guys. after a detail checking, the noise is coming from the pully, crankshaft or tensioner area. when i tap the gas pedal slightly to bring the rpm up 1500 and let is down to 800rpm, at that faction of a second, i can hear harder knocking sound around that area. at this point, i can see the belt tensioner 'loosen' n vibrating badly. i suspect the sound comes from this vibrating tensioner with belt friction.

when idling, i notice that my belt tensioner is vibrating in 5mm movement. however, when i raise the rpm to 1500, it will turns steadily.

finally, i unplugged the MAF and wahla....much much more power. then decided to remove the MAF for the second time and clean again. this time, i unplug the battery to and let it off for 15mins. then reconnect the battery and start the engine. let is idling for 10mins and take it out for a spin. oh...that is what i called 200Nm of torque. i can pull to redline up to gear 4 which is never possible. i think reseting ECU might did the job!!! very happy now.

only trouble is noise sound at low rpm.... every one staring at me as like my engine going to drop or so. in malaysia, it is rare to have a diesel passanger car. by the way, how is the waste gate actuator located and looks like? can't really find it.

thks.
 
tazztham said:
when idling, i notice that my belt tensioner is vibrating in 5mm movement. however, when i raise the rpm to 1500, it will turns steadily.
Click to expand...

That really doesn't sound healthy. I suggest you have it dealt with or you won't have a diesel for much longer :( The waste gate as far as I remember from another thread on this topic is built onto the turbo
 
Good to read you have it putting out the proper power now. It's amazing the power difference between a dirty and clean MAF. This is the same theory that's used when you see these resistors being sold on ebay for instant power increases!

Regarding the clonking and belt flapping around, it sounds like your belt tensioner is on its way out. I think they use a Dayco tensioner which are only designed to last the length of the warranty period - then the bushes wear out.
 
guys,

ok..will get a check for a tensioner. mine most likely using dayco as my timing belt also dayco. hope after changing the tensioner will solve the noise and flapping belt.

will come back...
 
Hi RSPilot,

After checking with few mechanics, they all saying that the tensioner vibration is consider 'normal'. It vibrates more is the AC is on. Something to do with the load.

By the look at the tensioner, it seems working find and provide good tension. I am wondering if the V-belt is slipping and cause flapping. Can that be a reason? I am using Dayco 1830. From Dayco reference, I should be using 1836. Does that really matter? Who else make V-belt for JTD.

one more question, is the valve clearance can be adjusted? it is self adjusting design? appreciate your input.

thks.
 
tazztham said:
Hi RSPilot,
After checking with few mechanics, they all saying that the tensioner vibration is consider 'normal'. It vibrates more is the AC is on. Something to do with the load.
thks.
Click to expand...

Well, my tensioner died about 5000 km after it started vibrating for the first time, taking 1/3 of the belt width with it. Nice ball of rubber stripes on the bottom protective tray :) It does not vibrate after replacing.

Hope this helps.
 
thanks pal. looks llike need to replace it as soon as possible before it kills my belt. to replace the tensioner, i think the main crankshaft pulley need to be out too? looks like the pulley is blocking the tensioner mountling screw.

can u recall that? i am going to change it myself.
 
 
Well, I cleaned it twice, first time with video head cleaning spray, that would be #3 on your list, and 2nd time with plain alcohol and cotton sticks.
 
Ok well I had a go at it with the cotton sticks and the Isopropyl Alcohol. Certainly cleaned a lot of black gunk off the metal plates. Initial tests suggest an improvement in performance however the big test will be the hill test.

Currently only able to reach x mph by a certain point up a steepish hill where as my Marea and Bunny's Bravo can reach x+10mph. Will find out later how much the performance has been improved.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.

Similar threads

notna
Technical Fiat Marea 1.9 JTD problem starting the car
Replies
1
Views
851
bugsymike
B
B
Technical odo works, speedo not marea jtd
Replies
0
Views
589
babar69
B
F
Technical Fiat Marea 1.9 jtdi- won't start
Replies
1
Views
4K
varesecrazy
V
B
Technical My marea 2.4 jtd doesnt pull after 3k rpm
Replies
2
Views
3K
BabaLukba123
B
V
Technical Marea sw jtd..needs work..classifieds
Replies
6
Views
2K
varesecrazy
V
Back
Top