Technical 1.6 Multijet oil pick up seal

[cobby58]

Hi, I have a 2012 263 Doblo with 1.6 Multijet.
I read that there is a potential issue on these engines with a seal (I believe) on the oil strainer pick up.
Has anyone experienced this? And is it something that has been addressed in production? My car has 88k on it so far and I'm looking to keep it a fair bit longer, so planning ahead. Many thanks.

 

[varesecrazy]

Hi
that motor has seen a lot of use..
In many vans and mid. size Fiat /Alfa cars

Certainly not 'doomed to failure'

Members @AndyRKett &. @bugsymike have had good longterm experience of these I believe

 

[bugsymike]

My 2010 1.6 Doblo Maxi van has around 108k miles, mostly done before I bought it, so I cannot claim long term experience of it.
Faults I had to rectify were, oil cooler leaking oil into cooling system (this damaged any coolant seals it was in contact with causing them to swell, so if disturbed for any reason they had to be replaced) I would say to fit the oil cooler at the back of the engine was a pain, not helped by two faulty new oil filter housing assemblies. This problem meant as soon as engine started, oil would drip from the oil filter drain valve, the idea of which under normal conditions is that when changing oil a hose could be fitted to this spigot to avoid mess, so that after a few turns releasing the oil filter cap nut it should open this valve allowing the oil to drain from the hose, instead of which it leaked permanently.
At around that mileage the turbo bearings failed allowing oil into intercooler and inlet manifold (blue smoke), I fitted a replacement turbo cartridge which was pretty straight forward.
I also had a black smoke and limp mode errors etc. which turned out to need a replacement seal where EGR pipe joins inlet manifold to cure that, so could have been worse.
Another common fault on many Fiats was the top strut bearings seizing and needing replacement.
In fairness I bought the van cheaply after it had been standing for many months (which didn't help those top strut mount bearings) as I suspect the previous owner (double glazing company) thought the head gasket had gone due to the oil in the coolant tank.
I do have to look at 1st gear engagement which requires a positive push, more than usual.
Being retired I have a habit of buying vehicles with known faults, supposedly cheaply as a way of relieving boredom. As I never sell for a profit some would say I should find another hobby.
If you have had the vehicle for a long time and regularly serviced it, I would stay with it.
Personally my main complaint is for a alleged 105hp engine fitted to a van with a 1 tonne payload it's bottom end grunt when pulling away is much less than on my 1.6 diesel Citroen C3 that has over 220k miles on it.
I have just bought a 2010 Scudo 2litre with a light rattle and misfire etc. from around the top end, so some would say I never learn, including my children, so I tell them I am spending their inheritance .

 

[varesecrazy]

That's covered a fair bit of the wear items,

Thanks @bugsymike

 

[cobby58]

My 2010 1.6 Doblo Maxi van has around 108k miles, mostly done before I bought it, so I cannot claim long term experience of it.
Faults I had to rectify were, oil cooler leaking oil into cooling system (this damaged any coolant seals it was in contact with causing them to swell, so if disturbed for any reason they had to be replaced) I would say to fit the oil cooler at the back of the engine was a pain, not helped by two faulty new oil filter housing assemblies. This problem meant as soon as engine started, oil would drip from the oil filter drain valve, the idea of which under normal conditions is that when changing oil a hose could be fitted to this spigot to avoid mess, so that after a few turns releasing the oil filter cap nut it should open this valve allowing the oil to drain from the hose, instead of which it leaked permanently.
At around that mileage the turbo bearings failed allowing oil into intercooler and inlet manifold (blue smoke), I fitted a replacement turbo cartridge which was pretty straight forward.
I also had a black smoke and limp mode errors etc. which turned out to need a replacement seal where EGR pipe joins inlet manifold to cure that, so could have been worse.
Another common fault on many Fiats was the top strut bearings seizing and needing replacement.
In fairness I bought the van cheaply after it had been standing for many months (which didn't help those top strut mount bearings) as I suspect the previous owner (double glazing company) thought the head gasket had gone due to the oil in the coolant tank.
I do have to look at 1st gear engagement which requires a positive push, more than usual.
Being retired I have a habit of buying vehicles with known faults, supposedly cheaply as a way of relieving boredom. As I never sell for a profit some would say I should find another hobby.
If you have had the vehicle for a long time and regularly serviced it, I would stay with it.
Personally my main complaint is for a alleged 105hp engine fitted to a van with a 1 tonne payload it's bottom end grunt when pulling away is much less than on my 1.6 diesel Citroen C3 that has over 220k miles on it.
I have just bought a 2010 Scudo 2litre with a light rattle and misfire etc. from around the top end, so some would say I never learn, including my children, so I tell them I am spending their inheritance .

Yes, agreed, that's quite a comprehensive list of ailments there!
My 263 SWB MPV has been with me eight years now, having only 6k on it when I bought it. So far I have self serviced apart from having the tracking done and air con recharge on one occasion. The only gripe in general with the car would be the suspension, where as I have had two sets of rear shocks. Countless (maybe five?) Top strut bearings, a couple of front road springs, followed shortly after with front shock absorbers. After the last strip down of the front end, aI had to do it all again due to some seriously sh#t shock bellows...they perished and fell apart. This not only left the strut rods exposed, but the spring was making contact with the top bearing one side and making a racket on off load bends. I'm sort of glad it did that, as I wouldn't of regarded checking the bellows three months after fitment necessary!

 

[bugsymike]

That's covered a fair bit of the wear items,

Thanks @bugsymike

Just my luck to get almost a full house, you can see why I never sell my old vehicles for a profit.

 

[AndyRKett]

Mine was a one owner 165k miles (when I got it) punto with the 1.6 multijet

I did a further 10k miles, had it for 3 or so years and it never had any issues with any oil seals or oil strainers or coolers that I was aware of and I had every service ticket done by fiat from new by the previous owner he’d even included a receipt for body work where he pranged it they’re pretty well tried and tested in many work vans up and down the country so I’m not sure that you’d have to many issues if it was well looked after. Where did you hear there was a common problem with this ?

 

[cobby58]

Mine was a one owner 165k miles (when I got it) punto with the 1.6 multijet

I did a further 10k miles, had it for 3 or so years and it never had any issues with any oil seals or oil strainers or coolers that I was aware of and I had every service ticket done by fiat from new by the previous owner he’d even included a receipt for body work where he pranged it they’re pretty well tried and tested in many work vans up and down the country so I’m not sure that you’d have to many issues if it was well looked after. Where did you hear there was a common problem with this ?

Hi, I read about it some time ago. I also found modified parts on eBay too, so I thought there must be an issue. Oh, and I saw an add for a Doblo stating the seal had been replaced. Maybe I'm just a worrier?

 

[con95a]

My 2010 1.6 Doblo Maxi van has around 108k miles, mostly done before I bought it, so I cannot claim long term experience of it.
Faults I had to rectify were, oil cooler leaking oil into cooling system (this damaged any coolant seals it was in contact with causing them to swell, so if disturbed for any reason they had to be replaced) I would say to fit the oil cooler at the back of the engine was a pain, not helped by two faulty new oil filter housing assemblies.

Hi mate, I've asked you this before I'm sure but can't remember, when you say any seals in the coolant system that get disturbed need replacing (due to oil, failed cooler) how many seals did you have to replace? and where are they located on the coolant system? Is it seals inside the coolant connectors with metal retaining clips?
I'm finally planning to replace mine soon, but would prefer to have the seals on standby if they're needed. I know there's two o rings on the oil filter assembly, but they'd be for stopping oil leaks I'd imagine, no contact with coolant.

 

[bugsymike]

Hi mate, I've asked you this before I'm sure but can't remember, when you say any seals in the coolant system that get disturbed need replacing (due to oil, failed cooler) how many seals did you have to replace? and where are they located on the coolant system? Is it seals inside the coolant connectors with metal retaining clips?
I'm finally planning to replace mine soon, but would prefer to have the seals on standby if they're needed. I know there's two o rings on the oil filter assembly, but they'd be for stopping oil leaks I'd imagine, no contact with coolant.

As you see from earlier in the thread due to a faulty oil cooler oil got into the cooling system so coolant tank had oil in it for some time before I bought it as it had been left standing due to the previous owner thinking it was a head gasket job.
So originally for me it was the two oil O rings to fit the oil filter/cooler assembly to the engine block, however when I tried to refit the two water pipes to the oil cooler assembly which as you will know is right at the back of the engine so I was coming up from underneath on axle stands. I found it impossible to refit the two water hoses due to the O rings inside the push on clip fittings having expanded due to the oil contamination.
I later fitted a second hand radiator which also uses the same clips and had similar issues there.
When you buy a new expensive hose it will come with the O rings.
You can buy the O rings from Fiat but just the two for the oil cooler cost around £37 and came from China in a bag with Fiat logo on from the Fiat dealers after two weeks!!!
So fed up with that I bought an O ring kit from Loctite and made my own. It is a bit fiddly getting the correct measurements, but does work and is a considerable saving if you have to change a few O rings.
Going back to the original question, if you have no coolant oil contamination in the water system then you "should" have no problem apart from releasing the fiddly water hose clips to pull the pipes off.
You probably know to fit the oil cooler involves removing the whole oil filter assembly due to access problems, unless you could find an easier way.

 

[con95a]

As you see from earlier in the thread due to a faulty oil cooler oil got into the cooling system so coolant tank had oil in it for some time before I bought it as it had been left standing due to the previous owner thinking it was a head gasket job.
So originally for me it was the two oil O rings to fit the oil filter/cooler assembly to the engine block, however when I tried to refit the two water pipes to the oil cooler assembly which as you will know is right at the back of the engine so I was coming up from underneath on axle stands. I found it impossible to refit the two water hoses due to the O rings inside the push on clip fittings having expanded due to the oil contamination.
I later fitted a second hand radiator which also uses the same clips and had similar issues there.
When you buy a new expensive hose it will come with the O rings.
You can buy the O rings from Fiat but just the two for the oil cooler cost around £37 and came from China in a bag with Fiat logo on from the Fiat dealers after two weeks!!!
So fed up with that I bought an O ring kit from Loctite and made my own. It is a bit fiddly getting the correct measurements, but does work and is a considerable saving if you have to change a few O rings.
Going back to the original question, if you have no coolant oil contamination in the water system then you "should" have no problem apart from releasing the fiddly water hose clips to pull the pipes off.
You probably know to fit the oil cooler involves removing the whole oil filter assembly due to access problems, unless you could find an easier way.

Thank you I wouldn't have thought about the radiator connectors. So when you say you bought two o-rings from fiat, were they for the oil filter to engine block? like these:

Or were they for the coolant quick connectors? like this:

Oh and to remove the oil filter assembly + cooler from the engine, did you take out the drivers side driveshaft, or could you squeeze it out leaving the drive shaft in place?

 

[bugsymike]

Thank you I wouldn't have thought about the radiator connectors. So when you say you bought two o-rings from fiat, were they for the oil filter to engine block? like these:
View attachment 441198

Or were they for the coolant quick connectors? like this:

View attachment 441199


Oh and to remove the oil filter assembly + cooler from the engine, did you take out the drivers side driveshaft, or could you squeeze it out leaving the drive shaft in place?

The first photo is the ones I got from Fiat Dealer for around £37, note one is square section, Since then with my Loctite sealing O ring kit I have bought both round and square section lengths in a variety of sizes made I think of Nitrile rubber from eBay?
The O rings you showed in the last two photos of coolant pipes are the ones that had swollen up due to the oil in the coolant, so I made them using the kit .
I didn't take the drive shaft out, but it was a struggle and in fairness around two years ago, I may have put the cooler part on separately as space was very limited, but vehicle was parked right up against the of side to give me room to get past so I know the drive shaft stayed in place.