The Panda Cross has been giving me an engine management light, usually on a semi-warmed up engine when pushed to 3,000 rpm or thereabouts. Then into limp-home mode. After a few hours the warning cancels and the car runs normally.
I'm a bit stuck for repairs as I'm away from home in Somerset. Local Fiat dealer have run diagnostics and say turbo failure. I find this hard to believe on a 37,000 mile car, driven sensibly, neither thrashed nor molly-coddled, and regular oil changes with the correct oil, often well before 12,000 miles.
Any comments. I plan not to have turbo replaced but run back up to Sunderland when I am due back. Don't really need the car until then. Any body know of a reliable diesel/turbo specialist in Somerset or the North-East for a second opinion and repair?
Thanks, Chris.

I need to add to my initial post that I do not think for a minute that the turbo fault is with the bearing or blades, if I did I would get it replaced at once. The car has travelled around 500 miles since this fault first came up. I suspect something along the lines of boost solenoid or boost valve problems.
I just don't want to sanction replacement of the entire turbo, at dealer prices, when there may be a simpler solution.

The wastegate actuator is well known for sticking on these. Awkward to get at but simple freeing off often cures the issue.

Yeah, I reckon it's BS as well. I mean it can happen for sure, but unlikely....

A garage once said the turbo was gone on the wifes Subaru, problem was they hadn't reset the ECU after replacing a faulty sensor. Problem? Car wasn't starting, how the **** does a faulty turbo on a car which still gives boost, cause it to be hard to start?

Ask for the actual fault codes. If it's the usual wastegate issue it'll come up as overboost. The vast bulk of the time it'll be the actuator that's stuck. Such a fault will cause limp mode which will clear after 4 starts until it occurs again, usually when giving it some for several seconds in a higher gear.

How long are you in Somerset for and where abouts is the car?

Which dealer did you visit, Huttons?

It was Hutton's, yes. I'm in Weston and my car will be down here for just under 2 weeks, but I will be in Crete for a week from Saturday. If there's someone I could trust to fix the car it could be left with them whilst I'm away.
Also thanks for the comments from others, Popshot, I've seen your comments on the EGR thread and will follow that line of thinking up.

I use a small independent guy, Tommy who may be able to assist you.

Ring him on 07954 218171 I've warned that you may be calling, he's in Somerset btw.

Popshot said:

The wastegate actuator is well known for sticking on these. Awkward to get at but simple freeing off often cures the issue.

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The symptons you describe are exactly the same as on my wife's diesel Panda. This was diagnosed as a sticking wastegate valve. It was freed off, and the problem cured. The problem is that my wife drives very gently, and it really needs a bit of welly regularly to stop the valve sticking. I just make sure I use it once or twice a month, and make sure the turbo gets a bit of excercise! This happened in February, and 6,000 miles later, the car is still going well. Incidentally, we were also told that a new turbo was required.

Colin

Huttons in Weston came up with the, to me unlikely, diagnosis of the variable angle vanes in the turbo sticking in one position!
However, they did not make a charge for this diagnosis.
Thanks, Coolcarbon, I will follow up on your suggestion.

doctorchris said:

Huttons in Weston came up with the, to me unlikely, diagnosis of the variable angle vanes in the turbo sticking in one position!

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They'll be stuck in one position because they're moved (or not in this case) by the seized actuator. So they're on the right track.

To be fair to them, the actuator's aren't available seperately (the turbo's come complete and preset from Fiat), but they should have at least tried free-ing off the actuator before going down the route of a replacement turbo.

Incidently, did the Cross come with the higher-bhp multijet with variable geometry vanes, or the 75bhp version with a conventional wastegate? I only ask because it's usually the smaller turbo that has the issue (without vanes).

D4nny8oy said:

They'll be stuck in one position because they're moved (or not in this case) by the seized actuator. So they're on the right track.

To be fair to them, the actuator's aren't available seperately (the turbo's come complete and preset from Fiat), but they should have at least tried free-ing off the actuator before going down the route of a replacement turbo.

Incidently, did the Cross come with the higher-bhp multijet with variable geometry vanes, or the 75bhp version with a conventional wastegate? I only ask because it's usually the smaller turbo that has the issue (without vanes).

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Now, this is getting interesting as my Cross has the 75bhp engine which, you say, has fixed geometry vanes. Therefore Huttons really had no idea what they were dealing with when they blamed the problem on failure of variable geometry vanes. Quite lazy of them not to free off the actuator but typical of main dealers, not only Fiat, in my experience. Expensive replacement of components favoured over simple and cheap repairs.

wastegate is easy to free off however be careful not to break off the plastic pipe, main problems with these turbos are noise.

doctorchris said:

Now, this is getting interesting as my Cross has the 75bhp engine which, you say, has fixed geometry vanes. Therefore Huttons really had no idea what they were dealing with when they blamed the problem on failure of variable geometry vanes. Quite lazy of them not to free off the actuator but typical of main dealers, not only Fiat, in my experience. Expensive replacement of components favoured over simple and cheap repairs.

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There's no such thing as "fixed" vanes- it's either got variable geometry vanes operated by vacuum (90hp), or a conventional wastegate penny operated by boost pressure (75hp).

TBH, we always used to offer the customer the option of spending time trying to free it off (with the potential of the fault happening again), or turbo replacement. It's just an unfortunate side-effect of frugal driving and keeping it off-boost all the time, the actuator rod just seizes in place from corrosion.

Coolcarbon, I spoke to Tommy who was very helpful and sounded as if he knew what he was talking about. I concluded that Yeovil was a bit too far away at the moment.
My plan: Yesterday I put some Millers Ecomax in the tank (not entirely logical but it can't do any harm) then went for an Italian tune up. Couldn't get onto the motorway at Weston due to traffic so used the country roads towards Cheddar with lots of high revs.
Look at freeing off the wastegate actuator if that fails.
Put up with the fault if all that fails. Trading the Cross in for a Dacia Duster in December, petrol engine, I'm fed up with these fastidious turbodiesel engines!

Problem with diesels is they need to be worked like petrol engines, or they end up full of soot, blocked DPF, stuck EGR, or possibly, as above, stuck actuator on the turbo.

Which kind of defeats the point in having a diesel, because it kills the economy off. I can't see myself ever buying a diesel car, unless I start doing a long commute...

doctorchris said:

Coolcarbon, I spoke to Tommy who was very helpful and sounded as if he knew what he was talking about. I concluded that Yeovil was a bit too far away at the moment.
My plan: Yesterday I put some Millers Ecomax in the tank (not entirely logical but it can't do any harm) then went for an Italian tune up. Couldn't get onto the motorway at Weston due to traffic so used the country roads towards Cheddar with lots of high revs.
Look at freeing off the wastegate actuator if that fails.
Put up with the fault if all that fails. Trading the Cross in for a Dacia Duster in December, petrol engine, I'm fed up with these fastidious turbodiesel engines!

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Hope you sort it...

Personally, I wouldn't go back to petrol, My C4 Hdi (06 PLATE..105K), the Cross (10 Plate..21K) and T5 VW Transporter(60 Plate..66K) all run as they should, maybe I've been lucky (as he reaches for a piece of wood)

With the remap on the C4 and Cross, more than happy with their performance and economy, the C4 runs as sweet as day one.

An update.
Wastegate actuator was completely seized so a recon turbo was the only option.
Apparently removal was difficult as everything corroded in place.
As a result, a bill of £1000 at a turbo specialist and I think they were honest with me.
Secondary result, complete disillusionment with turbo diesels and Fiats with any high-tec components (I would still happily live with, for example, a Panda 1.1 Active!).
So, looking forward to delivery of my base model, petrol-engined, 4WD Dacia Duster in the new year.

doctorchris said:

As a result, a bill of £1000

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Ouch!

Sorry to hear of your woes

doctorchris said:

An update.
Wastegate actuator was completely seized so a recon turbo was the only option.
Apparently removal was difficult as everything corroded in place.
As a result, a bill of £1000 at a turbo specialist and I think they were honest with me.
Secondary result, complete disillusionment with turbo diesels and Fiats with any high-tec components (I would still happily live with, for example, a Panda 1.1 Active!).
So, looking forward to delivery of my base model, petrol-engined, 4WD Dacia Duster in the new year.

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