Seeing as I can't live with the pogo effect (or is it a see-saw? I can't quite decide!), I am going to replace the standard suspension set up with immediate effect. After trawling every thread I could find on this site and the Italian 100hp forum, the Koni dampers and Eibach springs seem a popular choice. The best price I've found is £613 delivered from Larkspeed in Leeds.

Firstly, can anyone point me towards any company who can supply these parts cheaper?

Secondly, at £613, I'm not far off the price of the KW Coilovers at around £785. Should I fork out the extra or would I end up paying more for less?

Is this worth 700quid?

Fiatseicento2002 said:

Is this worth 700quid?

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If it improves the crap ride, then yes.

It does seem expensive, though the ride is indeed not ideal. Back in August we hired a 1.2 base Panda for a week in Northern Spain - lots of hills. Basically drove 1000+ miles thrashing it to pieces up and down the mountains and round the bends.

Anyhoo, it wore deep, skinny 155 tyres and had soft suspension. Loved it even though it was roly-poly and squealed like a cornered pig. That said, Spanish roads are empty and very smooth...........ideal for a 100hp.

So, that's why I was pondering the thought of maybe putting the softer rear springs on the back - I can put up with a little roll for want of making my spinal discs last longer.

Have you thought of maybe just doing the rear suspension first at least? Or even waiting a few months and slowly getting used to it?

They fit the 1.4 engine in the 500 lounge and Sport - I had a Sport for 3 years - similar deal with suspension though I've hired a 1.4 lounge before and they are more gentle - that's the kinda compromise that's needed.

AB100 said:

Have you thought of maybe just doing the rear suspension first at least? Or even waiting a few months and slowly getting used to it?

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I'm definitely not keen on the idea of fitting softer springs. I have got no problem with how stiff the 100hp's springs are. In fact, I'd say compared to other cars that I've had (in particular the Civic Type R and VX220 come to mind), the springs are really quite soft.

I did consider buying the rear Koni's first. However, although the pogo effect is less evident at the front (maybe because of the weight of the engine providing it's own rebound damping effect), it's still quite clearly there. I don't think there is much point in doing half a job. Obviously I'm only talking about my car, can't comment on any other 100hp as I haven't been in anyone elses.

With regards to cost, if I just buy the Koni dampers, that is £470. I'd like to keep the car for a couple of years and during that time I'll probably clock up 20,000 miles. Before I sell the car, I will remove the Koni dampers and will probably be able to sell them for around £250. So over 20k miles / 2 years the cost will be £220, equivelant to the cost of around 170 litres of petrol or, if you like, 0.0085 additional litres/mile travelled or 1.1p/mile. Personally I think that is a small price to pay to ensure I actually enjoy owning this car; other's might think not, but of course no one is being forced to buy uprated dampers

So, although I'm not happy that I feel I have no choice but to change the suspension on a car I've only just bought, I am comfortable that I can afford it and that it provides reasonable value over the duration of my ownership.

The purpose of this thread was to find out a) Where I would get the best deal from as there is no point in spending more than the lowest price possible and b) if I am going to the expense of fitting the Koni option, should I spend a little more and get the KW coilovers that I've read about other people using?

If no one has any advice or opinions on either of these, then that's not a problem, I shall just go with the best price I've found on the Konis. But given that there are people with experience of both of these set ups on this forum I thought it would be useful for me to ask before spending.

You make a compelling point - there are often times on some roads where the suspension acts as a speed deterrent. And road bumps in Chesterfield are most unpleasant.

Like you, my peripheral senses tell me the back-end is most problematic. My suggestion was simply that if you did the rear ones first, then took it for a spin, you'd know quickly whether there was a significant change in behaviour. It would only take the magical and most-promised 30 minutes to fit them and you'd know. If it's still bad after tht, spend the extra on fronts.

I'm obviously only asking as I have a vested interest. The Evo magazine tried some setup that was no good if I recall. In any event, I suspect many would appreciate your honest feedback whichever way you go.

Assume you have some nice test roads lined up, but happy to suggest the Derbyshire spine-numbers if need be.

AB100 said:

Like you, my peripheral senses tell me the back-end is most problematic. My suggestion was simply that if you did the rear ones first, then took it for a spin, you'd know quickly whether there was a significant change in behaviour. It would only take the magical and most-promised 30 minutes to fit them and you'd know. If it's still bad after tht, spend the extra on fronts.

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I'm too impatient for that and I know I'd be annoyed if I then had the front skipping all over the place and the back fine. It's a good suggestion, but I'm probably more inclined to buy all the dampers to start with but leave the springs until later. That's my concession to being sensible/frugal.

AB100 said:

I'm obviously only asking as I have a vested interest. The Evo magazine tried some setup that was no good if I recall.

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I believe that was replacement springs only, whereas I'm convinced that it's the damping that is the problem. Assuming those replacement springs were stiffer than the standard ones, then it'd make sense if it made the bounciness worse.

AB100 said:

Assume you have some nice test roads lined up, but happy to suggest the Derbyshire spine-numbers if need be.

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The best run near me is the B6106 from the top of Woodhead Pass to Holmfirth and then up the A6024 Woodhead Road over Holm Moss. I also like the roads from Sheffield to Hathersage and then out towards Castleton etc. Please feel free to suggest your Derbyshire roads!

Agree with all the foregoing - I don't want to lower the car significantly (mostly because of the white road that leads to our place in Italy) and have had difficulty establishing whether the Eibach springs - which are common across the Panda range - lower all models by 30 mm or just the 1.1/1.2 and would lower the 100HP only by a further 5 mm over the normal 25 mm drop. I'm leaning towards switching to Koni adjustable all round with the standard springs and non-100HP bump stops.

OK - in Google Earth search, this road is the super-bouncy killer road. It's probably even bad in a Citroen C6, but quite incredible in the Panda 100Hp at 60mph:

53°12'30.26" N 1°32'40.17" W

Handy if you're out visiting Chatsworth as well. The other roads around there offer other suspension testing opportunities - undulations rather than potholes.

Agree with Babbo-umbro - no desire to drop the car lower, would just like dampers that damp. Seems the standard Panda ones don't have the balls to arrest the spring rebound.

It's a pity they don't cover this stuff on Top Gear like in the old days when it was more nerdy and before Clarkson became an overbearing tw@t with a Moxford accent. Paaaaaaaaaass be the S-Claaaaaaaaaaaaaaass. I bet James May would love to bench test a few dampers in hid shed.

I've had my 100hp about two and a half years now and im seriously thinking of changing the dampers for the koni sport adjustables has anyone tried them with the standard springs? I can't really afford to buy springs as well but as someone else stated the problem really does appear that the standard dampers are just not up to the job of keeping the bounce under control.

I'm excited!! :slayer:

Probably could have phrased that better is the improvement enough?

koni on standard springs is intresting arent the standard spring -20/25mm anyway??

AB100 said:

OK - in Google Earth search, this road is the super-bouncy killer road. It's probably even bad in a Citroen C6, but quite incredible in the Panda 100Hp at 60mph: 53°12'30.26" N 1°32'40.17" W

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Do you mean the small lanes or the A619? I know the area but I normall carry straight on towards Bakewell from the Calver cross roads

AB100 said:

I bet James May would love to bench test a few dampers in hid shed.

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Now that's a Top Gear spin off I'd actually like to see!

stationary traveller said:

I've had my 100hp about two and a half years now and im seriously thinking of changing the dampers for the koni sport adjustables has anyone tried them with the standard springs?

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I'm going to give it a try with just the Koni's first so will report back. Will get them ordered in the next couple of days.

Fiatseicento2002 said:

Probably could have phrased that better is the improvement enough?

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I won't know until I try, but the chap who posted a thread about putting Koni/Eibach on said it completely resolves the issue, so if it doesn't I'll just blame him

pdtrewern said:

I'm excited!!

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Me too

Yes - on those Google Earth coordinates I mean the road centre screen - the back road. Not far from Chatworth house.

It's a pretty straight road with good vision but has some wild undulations that are the perfect way of testing your spinal discs in a Panda 100. At 60mph (the road's limit) this road is uncomfortable in most cars. In the Panda it's verging on comical.

I think everyone's interested in your expensiment (my new portmanteau word for expensive experiment)...........it almost seems worthy of you conducting pre and post test scenarios. Let's do this thing properly:

Powerpoint
Conference call
Whiteboard
Functional/Technical specs
Test plan
Post-implementation review

Or just do the top gear bucket-of-water test before and after.........

IMO you want some good high speed corners in the 60-90mph region where you can really load up the suspension. That is when the effect of diagonal pitching becomes quite disconcerting.

AB100 said:

I think everyone's interested in your expensiment (my new portmanteau word for expensive experiment)...........it almost seems worthy of you conducting pre and post test scenarios. Let's do this thing properly:

Powerpoint
Conference call
Whiteboard
Functional/Technical specs
Test plan
Post-implementation review

Or just do the top gear bucket-of-water test before and after.........

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That sounds alarmingly close to my day job...just replace 'bucket of water' with 'spreadsheet'.

trackdayqueen said:

IMO you want some good high speed corners in the 60-90mph region where you can really load up the suspension. That is when the effect of diagonal pitching becomes quite disconcerting.

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This is true. I think I can check the before and after on this one using the well known 'brown underpants' test :yum: