Hi Paul!
You never answered my question, why do you think your clutch works properly? You can't calibrate a malfunctioning clutch.
Try to release it as I suggested, if you can't, then replace it with a special MTA kit like I did, return when you have done that.
And BTW. I don't need to help you, I personally don't care if you spend the rest of your life making that car work, it's not my car.
BRs. Kjeld

Hi Kjeld, Sorry if I have got on you nerves, I did not mean to ignore what you are telling me, I do tend to go off in totally the wrong direction. This car has a new clutch kit fitted, not a cheap clutch. I know it is not the one you recommend but it was already fitted before you told me about it.
It Also has a new battery.
I have built this new test rig, but I have not tried the robot outside of the car yet.
The clutch arm seems fine, With the engine stopped trying to select a gear it sometimes it operates the clutch arm and sometimes it does not, Even if it does push the arm, I dont know if it pushes the arm far enough.
I cannot get this car to do a clutch self calibration or a production end of line service calibration,
So I am thinking this car does the same with 2 different robots
If I mount the robot on my test rig, and by the way my Robot does not have any cooling pipes attached to this system. I now have eliminated the gearbox and if I still cant do a clutch self calibration, I need to start looking at the electrics. Does this make sense?

Paul

I managed to get alfa obd working today, but still no go on the re-calibration

. I tried again to do a end of line reconciliation. and it comes back with failed, The ecu has detected that the request contains parameters with values outside allowable range ?. what is the allowable range?.


any idea's.


Paul

That was supposed to be re calibration.

Re: auto box my perameters






one engine off
one engine running


Paul

Re: auto box my perameters

Hi Paul, don't know about the specs nor which one is "out of" :-(

For information: keyboard combination "halt/prntscr" (halt/Fn/F11 on your Latitude) will put a copy of your active screen in the clipboard. Paste it in paint and you'll get a perfect sharable picture ! Snippingtool.exe is an interesting (free) laternative.

Cheers, Bernie

I am now quite certain I have an electrical problem, I put my Pico scope on the clutch Potentiometer, and when I change gear using the Joystick The potentiometrs are getting a lot of electrical noise and no movement registering. If I take off the pontentiometer and move it with my finger with the ignition on it works fine, a nice sweep on on the Pico scope. I will post the wave forms later if anyone is interested in seeing them.

I can select N and 1 st not Revers or 2nd, It tries to select Revers but will not go in. I have now got the complete robot on my test rig, not connected to the gearbox at all, so that eliminates the gearbox, I am using an extended Loom that I have made up, And it is doing the same thing will not select revers, I have now discovered that the clutch plunger is not operating when selecting a gear , But it will work using Multiscan actuator testing.

I have tested the wiring from the clutch potentiomer back to the ecu all good, The wiring has to be good on the clutch solenoid because the Multiscan can operate it in the actuator section. I have tested all the power and grounds on the g/box ecu and all good, My next step is to test the signals from the joystick.

Since moving the Robot out of the car, I have every thing connected apart from the Gearbox speed sensor, I am getting the faults and I have never had before.
P1819-87 Temperature ( from Can) Permanent On the Multiscan cold it shows 100 Deg and it defiantly did not when the robot was in the car.
U1701-87 Can network (nor-ncm) Permanent.
P1819-87 Engine torque (from Can) Intermittent.

So by taking the robot out of the car I have disturbed some wires maybe, I need time to reflect on what has happened .

I will never give up


Paul

Hi Bernie, Are you OK, haven't seen any posts in a while, I have been doing loads of tests , I will post details when I have some constructive results.

Can anyone give me what the clutch push rod measurement should read on the CFC328 ( clutch engaged position) should it be, !8.5mm and is there a tolerance ?.

Just an update
I have sorted all the u codes ( communication faults) that I had, My own fault, I now have the CFC328 Robot on my test rig and connected outside the car, I put the earth wire on the robot but that took away the earth from engine to chassis, so I had no communication with the engine ecu, all sorted now, So with it outside the car this now eliminates the gearbox. but I still keep getting error code P060C and not selecting any gears, I have tested all the signals coming from the gear stick and they are all fine. I also today took out a gearbox ecu from another car and still the same fault, so I connected up Multiscan. Cleared the fault and watched the screen as I tried to change gear, Ignition on, no fault, brake pedal pressed no fault, As soon as I try to change gear, Bang P060C Microprocessor fault, In the freeze frame data it says R requested gear 1 selected, So I am now thinking it is the robot itself, I am requesting gears and they are not moving, The ecu does not like what it is seeing so it throws the code P060C.

Any thoughts

Paul

Hi Paul, quite a pain to see you struggling with that robot !!
Seems that you've tried everything reasonable, how about going the hard way ?

Get the pump running, driven by the ECU ( to keep the right pressure in the system), but disconnect ALL valve solenoïds and feedback potis. Then, one by one, apply power to each valve and see what happens. Ideally you should feed them thru an adjustable PS, not 100% sure but at least one (the clutch) might be PWM driven so be cautious with the power (voltage X current) you push in !! You should be able to reed the feedback signal on the potis and from there, define if they work ok and maybe make a sketch of what happen when you do this or that...

I'm curious to read your findings ;-)

BRs, Bernie

Hi Bernie, Nice to hear from you, I have now tested the solenoids as you suggested, they are working but nothing happening gear selection wise, I have checked every solenoid feed and earth wire. all the position sensors are working. powers and earths to the ecu ect, Today when moving the shift lever it tries to select gears but throws the P060C -85 Control unit faulty(microprocessor) fault, it has to be the robot jamming up, surely it cant be anything else, I just have to decide now whether to send it away and have it reconditioned or take it apart myself, I am tempted to have it done by a specialist just to prove it was the robot all the time. But it would be great to strip it down and get this thing working myself. It is not leaking any oil, the pump is working fine. I am going to think about it over the next few days to get my next plan of action.

I will get to the problem, but if I send it to a specialist and they fix it would they tell what the problem was?. I could also strip it down myself and not find anything noticeably wrong as dont know what to look for, A difficult decision.



Paul

Hi Paul, what do you mean exactly by "they (the solenoïds) are working fine" ?
If they were working ok, something should move, at least for some of them !! Coil continuity/no short-cut test is not enough to tell a valve is good or not: it has to physically move (open) the plunger. The robot might be internally jammed, but I strongly doubt EVERY motion would be frozen ! Anyway the more sensitive part (IMO) would be the rotating/sliding "S" grooved shaft, if that one is seized not much will work and as you said the ECU would probably throw an error because missing expected feedback ...

I'd go ahead and open my tool box, it's not rocket science, just be carefull not to mix valves and take a LOT of pictures !!

BRs, Bernie

Hi Bernie, I took each solenoid out one at a time, Ohms tested it and very momentary put a live and earth feed, and I mead a split second and they all moved fine, If I drain the pressure it does it by pumping the clutch push rod, and that all works fine, I can bleed the system fine, I cannot re calibrate the system of any of the other functions on Multiscan. I can operate odd and even gears, using multiscan. I select R and 1st you can hear trying to do something, If I manage to get in to first, and then select R, the scan tool says R requested gear engage 1 , and will not move off, I can never get it to engage R only request it.



Paul

I understood you got TWO robots ?

If so, remove ALL solenoids from robot II and connect them on robot I harness (leave the valves on robot I to avoid leaks) and see if the solenoids are activated by the ECU. O-C since you won't have feedback an errow will be trown ! If the valves seem to respond nicely, I'd suspect a mechanical issue in the robot I, can't it be separated in two main parts, one being the hydraulic actuator and the other the mechanical part (with "S" shaft etc ??

BRs, Bernard

Hi Bernie, Thats a good shout, I will try that next week, as I am away tomorrow until Monday, I was planning on starting to strip the robot down next week but I will try that first, I am going to try and video the procedure or if not take shed loads op pictures, Thanks again for your input.


Paul

I have decide to take the cfc328 robot apart, I have ordered a suitable decreasing agent and some lithium grease for reassembly , I have also been reading over all the information that I have collected since starting this problem a very long time ago, one thing I think I need to check is the gear selection positions, in the Russian Akkpro .ru. Magazine article , the part on gear selection parameters , I am not quite sure of what the chart is relating to, it gives 2 numbers for each gear selection, position of activation, and position for selecting , can someone explain what these 2 numbers relate to on the scan tool please,

Paul. “””again”””

I now have a fiat Panda 1.2 2008, I thought these where the same as my Punto, But when I connect the scan tool it is a CFC228F, It looks the same as the CFC328, Can anyone tell me the difference please.

Paul

I have put Multiscan on the new panda, and the clutch engaged position was 19.5mm, On my punto it was 14.85 or there abouts, So going back on the Punto I could never run a clutch calibration, I have tried many times, no faults, So I decided to make an adjustable clutch push rod to get my clutch engage position the same as the panda, I set it up the same, Did a clutch bleed several times and then set up the clutch calibration procedure, The instructions say get the engine over 80 deg click execute and start the engine, Things started to happen, then all of a sudden it shot in to revers and thankfully stalled, It was now jammed in reverse and would not come out. So I thought maybe the scanner thinks it is in reverse when it is not not, so removed the unit and it was in revers, I pushed the finger back in to the neutral position, The fault code that came up was P1818-73 Gearchange Control, So because I have fooled the robot in to thinking the cluch is ok it was allowing the clutch calibration to run thinking the clutch was engaged when clearly it was not, So now a new direction possibly a bent clutch fork and a clutch problem, My brother has put a new clutch it it but would not have looked at the fork. Today I am going to put the Panda known good robot on and just see what happens, Nothing to lose at this point.
I will be back

Have a look at this link, You have probably seen it before, I can not select Reverse or second engine off on any of the 3 robots I have put on the Punto.


Correct me if I am wrong but ignition on engine off I should be able to select 1st 2nd N and Reverse?. I can only select 1st and Neutral . The gear stick calls for Reverse but it will not select, but it never calls for second on the display or the scan tool.

Paul