Yesterday car started driving strange, very slow to respond when pulling away but would then pick up power a bit like when egr is blocked, ive taked that off and cleaned it.
car is still broke.

it revs in nutrel but if i select forward or reverse throttle is un responsive but will move around the drive on tick over.

only code i had yesterday was p2009 flow shutter valve but my car don't appear to have swirl flaps, i cleared code and it hasn't come back.

could it be some thing simple like a blocked fuel filter? ( forgot to change it at last service)
or some thing more serious, dead turbo would be like this would it?

i did a graph for fuel if it helps?

car is a 1.9 16v diesel



"Time" "Total fuel quantity" "Desired fuel quantity" "TAG"
"sec" "mm³/i" "mm³/i" " "
0.00 10.8720 8.7630 ""
0.45 10.8630 9.9090 ""
0.91 10.8420 11.1330 ""
1.38 19.3650 19.1730 ""
1.82 10.6020 13.2630 ""
2.29 11.6550 14.1900 ""
2.74 12.0990 15.5370 ""
3.18 12.4200 11.8260 ""
3.63 10.9320 10.3890 ""
4.08 16.6410 14.2290 ""
4.55 15.7380 13.4640 ""
4.99 16.7430 15.3360 ""
5.44 16.8630 15.2040 ""
5.89 14.6910 19.4040 ""
6.35 15.6750 15.2730 ""
6.80 16.5210 12.4590 ""
7.27 10.7910 18.8730 ""
7.71 11.3640 11.9370 ""
8.16 11.9280 15.2430 ""
8.61 12.4110 15.1830 ""
9.07 12.8430 15.5070 ""
9.54 13.3260 19.8960 ""
9.99 19.4460 14.1990 ""
10.43 16.7520 15.2040 ""
10.90 18.3900 14.8320 ""
11.35 17.4450 14.4090 ""
11.80 16.6710 14.7420 ""
12.26 14.4090 11.4960 ""
12.75 17.1450 13.2750 ""
13.20 16.4700 11.6070 ""
13.65 11.9790 16.0380 ""
14.12 12.0180 10.0380 ""
14.56 12.6810 14.4000 ""
15.01 12.9720 14.8620 ""
15.48 13.2840 14.6820 ""
15.92 13.5750 20.1990 ""
16.37 13.9890 21.0120 ""
16.84 12.4290 11.3760 ""
17.28 15.5670 15.5070 ""
17.75 16.9020 16.3890 ""
18.20 19.1130 17.3640 ""
18.65 19.1430 22.4790 ""
19.11 17.4750 18.9630 ""
19.56 19.4850 15.7860 ""
20.02 19.7070 22.5390 ""
20.47 17.4450 17.2440 ""
20.92 18.6420 15.1230 ""
21.38 15.8760 16.0380 ""
21.83 15.8280 15.2940 ""
22.28 15.8580 20.6820 ""
22.74 15.8760 13.0020 ""
23.19 16.1280 13.7970 ""
23.65 19.5450 10.6110 ""
24.13 17.1750 16.7730 ""
24.58 19.5960 13.5450 ""
25.03 14.5920 12.3390 ""
25.49 17.3040 13.8180 ""
25.96 12.8940 11.7060 ""
26.41 13.3860 13.9890 ""
26.87 13.5750 13.9680 ""
27.33 13.7670 20.2890 ""
27.78 13.9590 10.5300 ""
28.23 14.0580 12.9630 ""
28.68 18.0480 11.1150 ""
29.13 19.5870 16.8510 ""
29.58 12.1800 11.2950 ""
30.04 20.2500 13.6860 ""
30.49 15.8460 14.7210 ""
30.94 14.5200 21.3150 ""
31.40 16.4010 14.2200 ""
31.85 14.0490 17.7060 ""
32.30 14.1180 16.2000 ""
32.76 14.4600 20.0070 ""
33.22 14.5410 14.6220 ""
33.67 14.6010 13.4340 ""
34.12 12.8610 17.6460 ""
34.59 14.4390 13.8270 ""
35.03 17.9580 23.4660 ""
35.50 16.6500 17.1450 ""
35.96 16.7220 15.9570 ""
36.41 15.8370 14.2290 ""
36.86 14.3010 11.4540 ""
37.32 16.0770 15.3150 ""
37.77 16.4700 20.2680 ""
38.22 14.5200 11.2650 ""
38.68 16.8720 14.7420 ""
39.16 12.3600 13.5570 ""
39.61 13.0320 14.2680 ""
40.07 13.2240 19.6170 ""
40.54 13.4340 11.0220 ""
40.99 13.7970 11.7960 ""
41.44 13.9170 14.3610 ""
41.88 14.0370 14.1690 ""
42.33 14.2080 14.5200 ""
42.82 18.7710 15.2550 ""
43.28 16.0470 14.3490 ""
43.74 15.0240 12.1290 ""
44.19 14.1480 14.6820 ""
44.65 14.4300 14.0580 ""
45.12 14.4900 19.2150 ""
45.56 14.4090 10.4490 ""
46.01 14.5020 14.4090 ""
46.48 14.4600 13.6650 ""
46.92 14.5620 19.7160 ""
47.37 14.6220 19.9770 ""
47.84 14.7210 11.7360 ""
48.28 14.7720 10.4190 ""
48.73 16.4700 16.0380 ""
49.20 18.4800 19.7160 ""
49.66 15.0840 12.9720 ""
50.13 15.7860 15.9390 ""
50.59 16.2390 22.8210 ""
51.05 13.7160 10.7430 ""
51.50 13.9770 17.4150 ""
51.97 14.4210 13.8660 ""
52.43 14.5800 21.2340 ""
52.88 14.7720 12.0690 ""
53.33 14.4300 12.2190 ""
53.79 18.1080 13.1130 ""
54.24 17.6070 13.7580 ""
54.69 17.4060 16.6200 ""
55.13 14.9430 14.3490 ""
55.60 14.7330 13.6170 ""
56.05 14.9130 20.2800 ""
56.49 14.9520 10.9140 ""
56.96 14.8410 14.0880 ""
57.41 14.7930 13.1940 ""
57.85 14.5800 18.1290 ""
58.32 16.9020 13.2240 ""
58.77 20.0070 25.6860 ""
59.22 21.1950 17.6670 ""
59.66 19.3140 23.8260 ""
60.11 17.8980 13.1040 ""
60.58 13.9080 14.0880 ""
61.02 14.0580 13.5450 ""
61.48 14.1780 21.7170 ""
61.94 14.6100 10.8930 ""
62.38 14.5320 14.5200 ""
62.85 13.6980 8.4000 ""
63.31 17.6670 12.5610 ""
63.76 19.6560 14.8320 ""
64.22 16.8930 14.0580 ""
64.67 16.9230 14.6100 ""
65.12 13.7370 19.3260 ""
65.57 13.8180 11.1540 ""
66.02 14.0670 12.7710 ""
66.48 14.5110 16.4100 ""
66.93 14.6700 13.9980 ""
67.39 14.8320 13.4160 ""
67.84 15.2940 11.5860 ""
68.31 15.2250 15.0840 ""
68.75 15.3450 13.9770 ""
69.22 15.2940 20.8920 ""
69.67 15.4440 7.7460 ""
70.13 13.9680 13.6470 ""
70.58 18.1890 23.0130 ""
71.04 17.7360 13.6770 ""
71.51 18.5010 22.5210 ""
71.97 17.3250 18.3300 ""
72.42 15.3750 17.3640 ""
72.88 18.3090 16.8210 ""
73.33 18.9720 14.6610 ""
73.78 16.5420 22.0590 ""
74.24 14.9730 11.1840 ""
74.71 16.2480 13.7580 ""
75.16 16.3200 20.4900 ""
75.60 15.5370 15.5070 ""
76.07 16.9440 21.7350 ""
76.53 18.0180 11.3040 ""
77.00 13.5360 14.3700 ""
77.46 13.6860 20.1900 ""
77.91 13.8870 9.3960 ""
78.36 13.7580 13.6770 ""
78.80 13.8360 13.0620 ""
79.25 13.8570 13.8060 ""
79.70 14.1780 20.2200 ""
80.16 14.1690 10.1280 ""
80.61 14.2290 12.9930 ""
81.06 18.5220 17.4540 ""
81.52 16.2180 14.6820 ""
81.97 18.9720 18.8220 ""
82.42 14.1300 22.2390 ""
82.87 14.2800 10.4820 ""
83.33 14.3910 14.8020 ""
83.78 14.5500 16.7010 ""
84.25 14.9130 13.9680 ""
84.71 19.2540 16.6500 ""
85.16 13.9890 18.1980 ""
85.62 13.8570 15.7470 ""
86.09 14.3190 17.0430 ""
86.53 14.8020 20.7510 ""
86.98 14.9520 23.2140 ""
87.45 15.4650 10.5300 ""
87.91 15.1530 13.3860 ""
88.36 15.1140 19.1430 ""
88.81 14.0370 5.2230 ""
89.27 13.5960 16.6200 ""
89.72 19.4550 14.5800 ""
90.17 17.9670 15.3840 ""
90.63 18.0480 16.0770 ""
91.08 17.9580 12.7410 ""
91.57 19.4340 12.0480 ""
92.02 14.3100 10.2390 ""
92.47 14.2590 12.0690 ""
92.92 13.2750 10.0080 ""
93.40 13.0950 7.9770 ""
93.86 13.6350 14.1690 ""
94.33 13.6650 13.4040 ""
94.82 13.7670 11.2860 ""
95.27 14.0880 16.6620 ""
95.72 13.9170 13.3740 ""
96.17 14.1300 18.2190 ""
96.65 14.0490 13.6980 ""
97.10 14.0070 9.0750 ""
97.54 12.2910 12.2490 ""
98.01 11.7270 6.1290 ""
98.47 11.0220 6.3990 ""
98.92 10.4490 10.4190 ""
99.37 9.9870 4.7130 ""
99.83 9.5760 6.3900 ""
100.28 9.2130 6.5910 ""
100.73 8.9130 6.6630 ""
101.19 8.6310 9.8070 ""
101.64 8.4090 5.5470 ""

i may have flaps?

sussexa said:

sorry about that, ive copied to imageshack
http://imageshack.com/a/img716/2935/mfiu.jpg
http://imageshack.com/a/img23/8610/2uhh.jpg
http://imageshack.com/a/img42/6760/zuqn.jpg

if its that type in the second pic all you would see from above is that thinish sandwich plate near the head
you still havnt said what model ,size engine is in your croma.

Click to expand...

without knowing what revs or load was on engine those figures don't help much for me anyway.
if you can do the same and add revs ,and log from a engine start and let idle would help more.
revs ,desired fuel quantity, actual fuel quantity, fuel rail regulator.
if those figures were at idle something is not right , I will dig out a cold start I logged in past, with engine warmish, lstart og then ign off and after a few seconds start up again to catch the start.

heres one ,eng on and off and start

heres the excel bit(couldn't get to upload excel file? so just screen shot)


ive seen people on net remove and clean egr but still end up with a problem, best if you can to physically blank to test.
if not heres some maf data with the egr in normal on / off / on / off cycle whilst idling

its from warm engine, with me trying to reverse and drive up and down the drive

ohh you replied while I was adding more data to last post again.
in the log data screen shot the values in the 30's in the middle is fuel pressure regulator
anything else you suspect and want an idea of normal value range let me know ill see if ive got it or I can log again to compare
regarding the fuel filter, I think mine states 60,000km in book but I do every couple of years as I don't do the milage, but id expect if was blocked it might show up by the fuel regulator being far from values near mine.

Disconnect plug on MAF/airflow meter and see if its makes any differnce, if its still the same my guess is its the boost control value is blocked/stuck, thats by the top of the radiator, under front top/slam panel. Take valve off and clean it before buying a new one, as it might just be blocked

runs a lot worse with maf unplugged

to rule out map do i do same as this bloke here https://www.fiatforum.com/stilo/333663-dufff-egr.html?p=3321911 ? and make sure my desired and actual boost pressure is the same? can i do that on the drive?

Hi Dave,
Just an idea but check for a small rubber hose that comes out of the top of the engine at the front middle and goes into the radiator somewhere (I think it says Vac Out or something).

Mine's a bit perished and had almost no power, similar to the egr failure but with more speed but less power if that makes sense - goes OKish but not great once it's going but pulling away was scary.

All I had to hand was some black insulating tape so I wrapped it around it and all was well again.

Quick check, just in case?

I would still take off and clean out the boost control valve, their is small filter in them that can easily get blocked. I would tap the valve gently and blow into the pipes on each side after cleaning out the filter compartment. Its an easy job. If the sponge filter is blocked, wash and dry it and put the valve back together. At the same time check the vacume pipes that go to and from it

I've done some more graphs, I've no idea if they show any thing good or bad?
I think its showing that map sensor is ok?

"Flow Shutter Valve"

This I think has nothing to do with Swirl Valves.

Modern diesel engines have an intake shutoff valve to strangle air intake.

A diesel engine does not require a timed spark ignition. All diesel engines, unless otherwise stopped will run untilled stalled or choked to death. Even though the fuel supply may be shut off a diesel engine can run on the small amounts of oil/vapour from crank fumes, be they coming pas the piston rings or via the crank case recirculation.

All combustion also requires air. So modern diesel engines have an intake shutoff valve to strangulate air intake.

From what you have described so far, including fault code, I'm thinking your intake shutoff valve (nothing to do with swirl valves) is malfunctioning and stuck in a partially closed position thus restricting air intake. Sufficient air for idle and manoeuvring but not enough for normal running.

s130 said:

From what you have described so far, including fault code, I'm thinking your intake shutoff valve (nothing to do with swirl valves) is malfunctioning and stuck in a partially closed position thus restricting air intake. Sufficient air for idle and manoeuvring but not enough for normal running.

Click to expand...

any idea where that is?

davidthelodge said:

I would still take off and clean out the boost control valve, their is small filter in them that can easily get blocked. I would tap the valve gently and blow into the pipes on each side after cleaning out the filter compartment. Its an easy job. If the sponge filter is blocked, wash and dry it and put the valve back together. At the same time check the vacume pipes that go to and from it

Click to expand...

I've taken it off the bit in the red circle looks like it will come off, not sure how to do it with out breaking anything :chin:

Dave, I think from memory the bottom prizes off (its a shallow round plastic cover you should be able to just about see the join in the plastic). Use a sharp narrow bladed knife or sharp small screwdriver.

whoops look like i forgot the pic


ah i got it off, it didn't look like that bit came off, i'll put more pics up later so others can see. wasn't sure what to clean sponge filter with, it didn't look dirty but i cleaned with washing up liquid and water and lots of black came out, I'm just waiting for it to dry

its back on car still the same, worse even wont rev properly standing still now, that maybe because its cold though.

going to try and test the actuator on the turbo with mes now if grandson stays asleep

dave said:

going to try and test the actuator on the turbo with mes now if grandson stays asleep

Click to expand...

couldn't find that in mes

doing other tests i try fuel pressure regulator and test fails

i found a shutter valve test and i can here some thing working. not sure exactly were sound is coming from though

boost control valve pics if anyone else needs them.

on fes or now mes some of the tests can be done running some have to be done just ign on engine off.
I think the vnt solenoid test is engine off, you will be lucky to see it actuate once or possibly twice before the stored vacuum is depleated.
basically you can do the same test by starting and stopping the engine and observing the vnt actuator at the turbo(watch for approx. 10mm rod travel, sucks in on start up, lets back out on shut down) or even pulling the silicone pipe off the turbo actuator will do the same but with engine running you can pull the pipe off watch the actuator move and actually hear the turbo sound change , exhaust tone changes also.
that sponge I think is the vnt solenoid breather outlet to relieve vacuum and vent air in/out , if it was wet or damp when it went back in that's probably why it went worse, its blinded and cant breath.
looking at a few of your graphs the boost pressure actual looks high compared to desired, might be worth a clean out of the map sensor on the manifold just to be sure.
and also on the swirl flap issue , if during the test you can hear something but definitely not see the inlet antishudder valve opening or closing try a long screwdriver or similar and rest on the inlet manifold whilst you or someone else does the swirl flap test, if you can hear something in there you may have that other type of manifold.
also next time your logging can you log
actual maf and desired maf and revs and let idle and rev up and idle etc,
also as another log can you log actual maf and actual boost and revs(on a drive would be better under load, but whaever you can manage)
and as another log total fuel qty desired fuel qty and fuel regulator at idle when warmish, at idle rev up and idle again.
and actual maf airflow ,desired maf airflow, egr % ,