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Old 3 Weeks Ago   #1
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105 Twinair stalling

Hi all
Hoping you guys can help, my wife's car has developed a stalling problem when cold, it's happened twice now, on both occasions the weather has been cold and damp. The car starts fine from cold then about 200 yards or so up the road (in slow traffic) it dies and will not restart, turning over ok but not firing.

On the first occasion she called out a breakdown guy who told her it was probably flooded and suggested changing the plugs. After a while she was able to restart the car and off she went with no more problems. Later that day I changed the plugs although the old ones looked fine to me.

Second occasion, same thing. After about 15 mins she was able to restart and continue.
It's a 2014 500 105 sport Twinair with about 25,000 on the clock
Any ideas?
Cheers
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Old 2 Weeks Ago   #2
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Re: 105 Twinair stalling

Hi, I have had almost exactly the same experience with my TA. On two occasions last week - starts OK but then as the engine begins to warm up firing becomes irregular and 'lumpy' then the engine dies and will not restart (turns over but no firing) Had to use jump leads. On the second occasion we left the car where it was and tried it again the next day - no joy - so had to jump it again then keep it revving until it got up to temp - then fine.
I have taken it into the garage and explained the situation so I'm hopeful that the fault will happen with them and they can fix it.
I will post again with an update from the garage.
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Old 2 Weeks Ago   #3
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Re: 105 Twinair stalling

Might I suggest battery problems?

Particularly if you've had to jump start the car twice, that's pretty much game over for the battery.
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Old 2 Weeks Ago   #4
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Re: 105 Twinair stalling

So I got a call from the garage this morning to say that the car was ready to pick up (it had been in for annual service 25k and for the stalling problem to be investigated). Did they find the problem? "low oil" I was told
I collected the car with assurances that it had been thoroughly tested and all was fine.
I have to say that I remember a time when you could talk to the mechanic and they would use their skill and knowledge to figure out what was wrong with your motor. It seems that nowadays I could drive in to the garage with flames pouring from the bonnet and they would plug it in to a computer and look for an error code
As for the suggestion that it could be battery related (thanks for the input) I'm not sure it is the battery as the auto stop/start still works. I think I'm right in thinking that when the battery is low this is automatically by-passed to save battery power. I will give it a charge this weekend just to rule it out but I still think it is some kind of temp sensor:- engine starts when cold but then as it begins to warm and presumably the mixture is changed to compensate for this it begins to falter, mis-fire and then stall. I will post again if the problem persists but it can only be tested when the car is completely cold.
apologies to the OP for hi-jacking this post but it does sound as though we are in the same boat!
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Last edited by FJT500; 2 Weeks Ago at 13:33.
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Old 2 Weeks Ago   #5
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Re: 105 Twinair stalling

How about disconnecting any temp sensors and see how it runs ? Don't rule out lambda either even though it may present as correctly working
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Old 2 Weeks Ago   #6
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Re: 105 Twinair stalling

Quote Originally Posted by John202020 View Post
How about disconnecting any temp sensors and see how it runs ? Don't rule out lambda either even though it may present as correctly working
I'm reluctant to start pulling things apart - it is way beyond my level of expertise.
I have read other threads on the forum where similar issues have plagued 105 owners. I am horrified to think that this is something that Fiat / Fiat garages are unable to resolve (if the computer says there is no fault - there is no fault).
Bottom line is that my wife needs a car that she can trust to get her to and from work. If the Fiat isn't up to the job (in the winter months at least) then we will flog it on and get something else
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Old 1 Week Ago   #7
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Re: 105 Twinair stalling

At times I think it's a bit unfair to criticise dealers when they attempt diagnostics, especially when confronted with intermittent issues.

Can you imagine the complaints if they spent a whole week stripping the car down, spending hours testing individual parts or replacing them in the hope of finding a failing part and then handing over a massive bill?

A check of the obvious and a test is no doubt the best place to start and though it might not seem like it's helpful to many at the time, handing it back in the hope it works ok, or hope that the parts fails completely might not be such a bad thing for everyone involved.

It might seem a risky thing, but I'm sure they'll only release the car if there's a negligible risk of serious damage by doing this.

Though these checks and tests are now becoming a cash cow for some dealers, it's not unheard of for certain dealer to refuse to touch a car without a hefty "diagnostic fee" up front, even for stupid things like worn wiper blades that squeek and judder!

Your low oil level could well be your issue.
The valve arrangement on this engine uses oil under different pressures as a variable link to alter inlet valve lift.
It'll no doubt use different valve strategies between cold and warm running and if it can't actuate the valves as it should as it warms up, it's certain it'll not run correctly.

I seem to think this valve arrangement arrangment is "failsafe" so they fail in the closed position.

I am sure if the issue continues without any obvious part failure, the dealer will then turn their attention elsewhere using similar methods.
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Old 1 Week Ago   #8
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Re: 105 Twinair stalling

Maybe a bit random, but I remember something a while back about a page on Facebook called "Faulty Fiat Cars". It's a page set up by someone who had a dud it would seem.

The car featured there was also a TA, can't tell if it's an 85 or 105, but they had all sorts of cold starting issues.

I just looked at the page now, interesting that the pinned post there says that their initial diagnosis for the failure to start was down to high oil consumption. So not 100% the same as you necessarily, but possibly similar.

Anyway, maybe worth a look and possibly you might be able to find others in a similar boat?
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Old 1 Week Ago   #9
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Re: 105 Twinair stalling

My neighbour is friends with a Fiat tech and when I thought mine was running rough when it was new he had chat with him about it. He said the oil level and type on those engines is crucial. Didn't think anything of it. Then a few weeks ago I started it and the check engine light came on and SS was disabled. I topped up the oil there and then and all good again straight away and since.


Low oil may well have been your problem.
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Last edited by ronmanager; 1 Week Ago at 21:22.
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Old 1 Week Ago   #10
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Re: 105 Twinair stalling

Thanks for your comments, advice and suggestions. You may be right regarding the oil level. As I mentioned before, the car was due for a service anyway which as well as lubricating the door hinges and topping up the windscreen wash, the bill shows that oil was added / replaced and the plugs were replaced. On its return I tested the car every morning (about 5) and no problems! My wife has still to regain her trust in the car after being left stalled in the middle of the road twice but it seems as though either the oil or the plugs have fixed the issue - from what you say Goudrons it makes more sense to me now that it could have been low oil level.
Fingers crossed!
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Old 1 Week Ago   #11
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Re: 105 Twinair stalling

Quote Originally Posted by FJT500 View Post
Thanks for your comments, advice and suggestions. You may be right regarding the oil level. As I mentioned before, the car was due for a service anyway which as well as lubricating the door hinges and topping up the windscreen wash, the bill shows that oil was added / replaced and the plugs were replaced. On its return I tested the car every morning (about 5) and no problems! My wife has still to regain her trust in the car after being left stalled in the middle of the road twice but it seems as though either the oil or the plugs have fixed the issue - from what you say Goudrons it makes more sense to me now that it could have been low oil level.
Fingers crossed!
I realise some might find this onerous, but personally, I would get into the habit of checking your oil monthly. I'm not at all insinuating that you are one of these people, but I know plenty of folk that think lifting a car bonnet is something they only do when smoke or steam is pouring out from beneath. With any vehicle, but particularly the TA, it is vital you ensure that the correct oil level is maintained at all times. I guess we were lucky when we owned our TA, not once did I have to top up the oil between services.
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Old 1 Week Ago   #12
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Re: 105 Twinair stalling

Not just TA's our 1.2 has surprised me recently regards use of oil, moral to the story, check your oil! (more often)
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Old 6 Days Ago   #13
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Re: 105 Twinair stalling

I reckon our TA runs much smoother on fresh oil. When we picked it up last year it had done more then 16,000km (10,000mls) between service's and it was noticeably rough at idle when I got it home from Newcastle UK to Cork Ireland. So I changed the oil myself and she ran like a Swiss clock, now I change the oil every 10,000kms and check it at the start of every month or before any decent trip.
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