They really can't.Obviously the guy is crazy enough to ask for money even without the proof. I think the workplace can take action against him, like issue a warning or something.
Do you have any advice for the OP now you've written a detailed exposition of what he shouldn't have done?And what was his reply to this ?
I have a feeling now you've opened Pandora's box and he's going to come after you for more money.
Do you really have peace of mind if you've paid him £60 and he's wanting more ?
A couple weeks down the road and he keeps putting on the pressure for more and more money are you going to keep paying it for 'Peace of mind?'
if it did end up in the hands of the insurance then you have now fully admitted liability where there was no reason to believe you were liable.
There should have been no discussion
"as far as I am aware I have not made contact with your car, plenty of cars will have come and gone through the course of the day before I came along and there is absolutely no marks or damage on my car that corresponds with yours, Sorry you feel I hit your car but it was not me!"
That would have been more than adequate to resolve things. You work in the same building presumably for the same company, it would be idiotic for him to then take revenge as the motive would be obvious.
I would go as far to say that what you have agreed is really stupid!
I might be wrong he might take his £60 and bugger off but given this
I think you've massively shot yourself in the foot.
I would love to see the "repair" they are going to effect for 60 quid.
Wouldn't even get chips away to your door nevermind anything at a proper body shop.
While not going as strong as Andy's language paying him anything could be seen as an admission of fault.
Lots of advice from many people who’d posted above, that was ignored.Do you have any advice for the OP now you've written a detailed exposition of what he shouldn't have done?
Hangman extortionist, really?Lots of advice from many people who’d posted above, that was ignored.
Looks like he’s paid the hangman now so may have to just accept the “peace of mind” they paying off an extortionist brings
Ok, excuse my ignorance/naivety, let's say I pay him the £60 cash.... how could he prove to an insurer that I have paid him that money - they'd be no evidence unless he's got some hidden bodycam on. And how would the following even look to an insurer - the guy happily admitting to taking £60 off me and then wanting to make an insurance claim on top. I am still open to telling him that he ain't getting the £60 as I cannot be sure I caused the damage, and that all the advice I have been given has been explicitly not to pay anything as there is no clear evidence that it was me. My colleagues and manager have my back which is reassuring. My manager doesn't like the guy that is accusing me at all, he hates the dude.
If anyone can expand on why paying him £60 could cause me problems further down the line - then please let me know what concerns I should have.
If I do go ahead with the payment and he asks for more money then I'd tell him he's lucky to be getting £60 and that he can take it or leave it. Based on how he was with me face-to-face I think he will actually just take the £60 and leave me alone. He said I was 'being reasonable with him'.
I blocked his number after sending my last message to him, I can't deal with the guy as he is making this more complicated than it needs to be. Like I said - I want this out of sight and out of mind, and not having texts saying 'phone me so we can arrange when to talk'. I said he can come and see me at work - that's all he needs to do.
Paying to repair a car you've not damaged after having met with a third party from a body shop stretches plausible deniability somewhat in terms of "Goodwill".Making a goodwill gesture, as OP is doing is not an admission of liability.
OK so you posted the below ..Ok, excuse my ignorance/naivety, let's say I pay him the £60 cash.... how could he prove to an insurer that I have paid him that money
I messaged him back telling him how there is no clear evidence I hit his car, not even any paint transfer to each other's cars, and mentioned the fact that he starts work 5 hours before me and there are 60+ people arriving to work before I even arrive to work, anyone could have parked there or attempted to park there before I arrived. Without directly saying so, I was essentially telling him that he's lucky to get £60 out of me. He can come and get the £60 - take it or leave it. My insurance company wouldn't pay him a penny as there is no CCTV evidence, I am not going to admit fault to my insurer, there is no photo evidence of my car parked touching his, there are no witnesses.
And how would the following even look to an insurer - the guy happily admitting to taking £60 off me and then wanting to make an insurance claim on top. I am still open to telling him that he ain't getting the £60 as I cannot be sure I caused the damage, and that all the advice I have been given has been explicitly not to pay anything as there is no clear evidence that it was me.
If anyone can expand on why paying him £60 could cause me problems further down the line - then please let me know what concerns I should have.
Now I'm kinda with you on this point, i'd hope that he pisses off and doesn't come back, but these days with people having cars on lease plans and PCP plans any minor damage could be very costly for them further down the road when they want to change or return the car. So he actually genuinely may want to get it repaired to avoid massive fees being due later down the road.If I do go ahead with the payment and he asks for more money then I'd tell him he's lucky to be getting £60 and that he can take it or leave it. Based on how he was with me face-to-face I think he will actually just take the £60 and leave me alone. He said I was 'being reasonable with him'.
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^1000000% this ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^Paying to repair a car you've not damaged after having met with a third party from a body shop stretches plausible deniability somewhat in terms of "Goodwill".
Person A accuses Person B of damaging their property. Person B agrees to pay person A and amount in reparation for the damage caused. The very nature of saying it is a Goodwill gesture is to say that there is some liability on part of Person B that has compelled them to make such a gesture.@StevenRB45
OP isn't meeting with any third party as far as I can see. OP made what is clearly a goodwill gesture to a fellow employee in line with what was requested and agreed. If the other party doesn't now want to accept then the OP has made it clear that the other party has provided no evidence that it was caused either at the time alleged, or that he caused it and he would make no further offer.
I don't think he has boxed himself in in any way, he sounds like a decent individual trying, as he says, to move on and avoid any issues in work.
No it doesn't. I can't say it more simply than that.Person A accuses Person B of damaging their property. Person B agrees to pay person A and amount in reparation for the damage caused. The very nature of saying it is a Goodwill gesture is to say that there is some liability on part of Person B that has compelled them to make such a gesture.
At this stages it seems that Person A hasn't fully agreed to the amount offered and is seeking advice on the possible full cost of repair.
But Person B has made an opening offer in negotiation of the repair, a willingness to pay for the damages.......and in doing so admitted liability.
Lots of advice from many people who’d posted above, that was ignored.
Looks like he’s paid the hangman now so may have to just accept the “peace of mind” they paying off an extortionist brings
A payment of goodwill can be made in a business transaction, normally there would be some written agreement or contract that Person B (as per my example above) is willing to make a payment of goodwill and without prejudice in the amount of ..... but you see that needs some sort of written contract, and depending on the situation does not absolve person B of all liability. But it may mean in a business setting that both parties walk a way a little out of pocket but not as bad as they would if the solicitors got involved. When they write this up in their contract it will say something like "without prejudice" on the contract that both parties sign and agree to.No it doesn't. I can't say it more simply than that.
Goodwill offers and payments are made every day of the week without admission of liability. The OP has made an offer after discussing it with the other party.
The OP has explained his motivation very clearly here and to colleagues.
if now the other party is not accepting of that, then they will have to take it forward by other means, but they will need to provide evidence, which they cannot.
You're wrong. A goodwill gesture may be made in any walk of life.A payment of goodwill can be made in a business transaction, normally there would be some written agreement or contract that Person B (as per my example above) is willing to make a payment of goodwill and without prejudice in the amount of ..... but you see that needs some sort of written contract, and depending on the situation does not absolve person B of all liability. But it may mean in a business setting that both parties walk a way a little out of pocket but not as bad as they would if the solicitors got involved. When they write this up in their contract it will say something like "without prejudice" on the contract that both parties sign and agree to.
In this instance there is no business between the two parties so no reasonable explanation for the OP to be making a "goodwill" gesture, unless they believe that they did hit the other party's car, in which case that offer of payment is not seen as "goodwill" its seen as an admission of liability.
It seems currently the OP has offered to pay £60 towards the repair of the car.
The other party however does not seem convinced that this is sufficient to repair the car, and therefore it doesn't appear any agreement has been made.
To an insurance company it could look like the OP is bullying the other person into accepting the £60 "take it or leave it" and that he is admitting that he did damage the other persons car.
He has also repeatedly stated that he is not sure if he damaged it or not. If the other party said he did and the OP says he didn't then the onus is on the other party to prove he did damage..
But the OP keeps saying he is not sure if he did damage it or not. Therefore the Onus is no longer on the other party to prove he did. The other party said he did. and the OP can't say he didn't, he's offered to pay, basically he has accepted full liability for the cost of any repairs.
If there's any way of tracking it back to you then the fact you've paid him would be seen as an admission you accepted fault.
Simple as that, if he's then talking about bringing in 3rd parties to talk to you as well...well the more people involved the more text messages back and forth the more likely it becomes it could be linked back to you.
So given he seems to be an absolute arse...make sure you don't refer to the money or what it's for in any text message etc.
However this also leaves you open to him turning round and saying "what money?"..
It's not a great situation all around... hopefully he'll be ok.
Things do not have to be written down in order to be used.You haven't even explained why paying the £60 and therefore 'admission of guilt' matters. As far as I am aware - it's irrelevant, as I have not stated that I'd give him any money in any digital communication with him. All my texts to him have stated that there is not enough evidence to determine I caused the damage.
If he wants to tell an insurer that I paid him some cash and therefore 'admitted guilt', then that's going to be another 'he said - she said' situation. The same situation as him claiming I pranged his car and me denying it. There will be no evidence. Do you really think I'd tell an insurer I paid him some money.
Even stating that you "don't know" if you hit him, puts you in a weaker place than saying you definitely did not hit him.I don't know if I hit him... but there is a chance it could have been me and I am trusting this guy isn't having me on.
Change your mind and do so quickly. Perhaps tell him you spoke to your car insurance legal team and they said that there was no reason for you to pay him anything and to not speak with him any more, if he wants to take it up he can do so though his insurance company. But state very clearly that you did not hit his car and there is no damage on your car to suggest you did.That said - I haven't given him any cash yet and could easily change my mind.
@AndyK
No it doesn't. I can't say it more simply than that.
Goodwill offers and payments are made every day of the week without admission of liability. The OP has made an offer after discussing it with the other party.
The OP has explained his motivation very clearly here and to colleagues.
if now the other party is not accepting of that, then they will have to take it forward by other means, but they will need to provide evidence, which they cannot.