Technical 1.2 Fiat 500 oil pump noise?

[Dobbslc]

Hi I've just bought a 2012 1.2 500 for my boy, I've been doing some servicing and have just replaced the timing belt, tensioner and pump as it has no history but it's now making a fairly loud whirring noise. I've disconnected the aux belt so it's not the A/C pump, alternator etc and when I put a long screwdriver to my ear the sound seems to be coming from the oil pump not the water pump or timing belt or covers . It's been up on axle stands for over a week so would the oil pump have draind down? Any suggestions?
Thanks.

 

[varesecrazy]

Hi I've just bought a 2012 1.2 500 for my boy, I've been doing some servicing and have just replaced the timing belt, tensioner and pump as it has no history but it's now making a fairly loud whirring noise. I've disconnected the aux belt so it's not the A/C pump, alternator etc and when I put a long screwdriver to my ear the sound seems to be coming from the oil pump not the water pump or timing belt or covers . It's been up on axle stands for over a week so would the oil pump have draind down? Any suggestions?
Thanks.

If it wasn't there before the belt change..

I would be checking the belt tension..
Both of the belt.. And the tensioning kit

 

[Dobbslc]

I'm going to check that but if it's ok I'll refit the old pump and tensioner.

 

[vexorg]

I'd run it with the covers off to be absolutely sure, could be costly otherwise.
You don't want it to be something trivial like crank pulley not seated right

 

[John202020]

You did get the right pump, online suggests two sizes? Don't know if they're physically the same size

 

[Dobbslc]

Yes it's the right pump. The noise is definitely coming from the oil pump not the water pump. I checked the oil pressure just now and I'm getting 1.6 bar at idle and 4 bar with more rpm so I think the pressure is good but the pump is worn. Is this a common thing on these engines?
1.2 petrol 8 valve 2012.

 

[varesecrazy]

Yes it's the right pump. The noise is definitely coming from the oil pump not the water pump. I checked the oil pressure just now and I'm getting 1.6 bar at idle and 4 bar with more rpm so I think the pressure is good but the pump is worn. Is this a common thing on these engines?
1.2 petrol 8 valve 2012.

Far from a common failure..

What's the cars history?

Well serviced for years with you..
or a 2022 purchase with black oil..?

Has this filter been OK for the last 4,000 miles?

 

[John202020]

Yes it's the right pump.

So you'll know if its 59mm or 63mm?
If it wasn't there before you did the work then its got to be either something fitted or how its fitted, honestly I'd never try replacing the cam belt even experts get it wrong.
60PSI is fine in all these years never heard of oil pump issues on a petrol

 

[jrkitching]

If it wasn't there before you did the work then its got to be either something fitted or how its fitted

I'd agree; it is almost certainly something which happened as a result of something you did when changing the belt.

even experts get it wrong.

There are countless threads on this forum reporting cars which were running fine until the belt was changed, and now have a problem.

Changing a cambelt on these engines really does seem to offer limitless ways to go wrong and get into difficulties.

Interestingly I've never seen a post in the 500 section reporting an actual belt failure in service.

honestly I'd never try replacing the cam belt

You might do better than you think. The good thing is that you'd be aware before starting of the potential to get this wrong; you'd mark everything before dismantling anything, and carefully check that every component you were planning to replace was identical with what was already there.

It's those folks who think 'this is just a cambelt change, I've done that procedure loads of times on other cars' that often end up in the biggest mess. Mechanics working for independent garages, rushing to get the job done as quickly as possible, are some of the biggest culprits.

Right now, I'm wondering how the OP supported the engine when removing the upper left engine mount?

 

[vexorg]

even experts get it wrong

And some amateurs get it right

I'm wondering how the OP supported the engine when removing the upper left engine mount?

I'm struggling to see how you'd damage the oil pump no matter how it's supported. The pump should hold the weight of the engine even on an axle stand.

 

[jrkitching]

I'm struggling to see how you'd damage the oil pump no matter how it's supported.

We don't yet know for sure that it's the oil pump that's causing the noise.

Given that most folks doing this job outwith the franchised dealer network won't have access to the OEM tools, I'm wondering what could be damaged, moved, or put out of alignment by whatever improvised method was used to support the engine. The sump in particular is known to be fragile even when new, and was never designed to support the weight of the engine.

 

[Dobbslc]

What's the cars history?

No idea, that's why I'm going through things to sort it out.

 

[Dobbslc]

We don't yet know for sure that it's the oil pump that's causing the noise.

Given that most folks doing this job outwith the franchised dealer network won't have access to the OEM tools, I'm wondering what could be damaged, moved, or put out of alignment by whatever improvised method was used to support the engine. The sump in particular is known to be fragile even when new, and was never designed to support the weight of the engine.

The engine was supported on a Jack with a lump of wood and hasn't been damaged, it's not bent or leaking etc.
I bought a locking tool kit off Amazon that has the little two pegged tensioner adjuster and lined the two cut outs up as per the manual, I'm going to check this over the weekend and if that doesn't help I might swap the new parts with the old ones but as I say the noise it very noticeably the oil pump and nowhere else. Seeing as the timing belt water pump etc has to all come off to reach the oil pump it's no real extra work but bloody annoying!
I didn't notice this noise before I did the belt but then again I wasnt listening for noises so it may have already been doing it.

So you'll know if its 59mm or 63mm?
If it wasn't there before you did the work then its got to be either something fitted or how its fitted, honestly I'd never try replacing the cam belt even experts get it wrong.
60PSI is fine in all these years never heard of oil pump issues on a petrol

I've been changing cam belts for years on all sorts of cars and this one is pretty simple being a single cam engine.
I was asking on here to see if anyone had heard of this before.
59 or 63mm? Is that the pully or impeller diameter or something else?
They looked exactly the same and fitted straight on.

 

[Dobbslc]

Right now, I'm wondering how the OP supported the engine when removing the upper left engine mount?
On a lack with a lump of wood li,e everyone else

 

[vexorg]

Swapping the waterpump to the old one would be a pain, with sealant and coolant, then needing to change it to a new one again.

 

[John202020]

59 or 63mm? Is that the pully or impeller diameter or something else?
They looked exactly the same and fitted straight on.

Honestly I don't know( just that supplier's say check size/fitment) if it's pulley or impeller however if it's the impeller you'd not notice 4mm(smaller) and it may cavite in use? Though whether you'd be able to hear it?

 

[YeYe]

Can you post a clip of the noise it's making?

 

[Dobbslc]

PXL_20230922_154109065.TS.mp4
Not sure if this will work.

 

[Dobbslc]

No

 

[vexorg]

Need to upload to something like imgbb.com