Technical Headlight Cluster Upgrades

[FIAT-Faster than u think]

Hi All
I have a 2017 500x Cross and looking to improve the light visual and wonder if the 2019 headlight module will fit as well as produce no errors.

And also looking to do the same for the Daytime Running Light modules?

Thanks in advance

 

[s130]

I'm assuming your 500X Cross has normal halogen bulbs and not Bi-Xenon or LED units? Same for DRLs.

If you replace the whole cluster you will be road legal in the UK. Same goes for the DRLs although you will probably get away with just replacing the DRL bulbs with LEDs. I say get away with as a decent MOT tester will test/pick up on how much the DRLs dim when the headlamps are on. Depending on LED fitted the LED might barely dim, flicker or not illuminated. Not dimming is what most do.

I have Bi-Xenon and my concern after some road debris was kicked up by a truck breaking the headlamp and denting the bonnet was the shocking price of the units forcing me to put and insurance claim in. Also availability of the part caused repair delays.

Using Autodoc who supply alternative cheaper OEM units compared to Fiat's own:

Normal Headlamp : £125 / £230
Bi-Xenon (no bulb) : £720 - D5S xenon bulbs extra £60 each
Bi-Xenon (with bulb) : £880 - OEM/Fiat Magneti Marelli
LED Headlamp (complete) : £770
LED Headlamp (complete) : £910 - OEM/Fiat Magneti Marelli

Once you have got over the cost then you will almost certainly need to get the units programmed correctly into the cars body computer.

Also to change/replace the headlamps the front bumper has to be removed.

All doable but not a straight forward remove & replace job.

 

[FIAT-Faster than u think]

I'm assuming your 500X Cross has normal halogen bulbs and not Bi-Xenon or LED units? Same for DRLs.

If you replace the whole cluster you will be road legal in the UK. Same goes for the DRLs although you will probably get away with just replacing the DRL bulbs with LEDs. I say get away with as a decent MOT tester will test/pick up on how much the DRLs dim when the headlamps are on. Depending on LED fitted the LED might barely dim, flicker or not illuminated. Not dimming is what most do.

I have Bi-Xenon and my concern after some road debris was kicked up by a truck breaking the headlamp and denting the bonnet was the shocking price of the units forcing me to put and insurance claim in. Also availability of the part caused repair delays.

Using Autodoc who supply alternative cheaper OEM units compared to Fiat's own:

Normal Headlamp : £125 / £230
Bi-Xenon (no bulb) : £720 - D5S xenon bulbs extra £60 each
Bi-Xenon (with bulb) : £880 - OEM/Fiat Magneti Marelli
LED Headlamp (complete) : £770
LED Headlamp (complete) : £910 - OEM/Fiat Magneti Marelli

Once you have got over the cost then you will almost certainly need to get the units programmed correctly into the cars body computer.

Also to change/replace the headlamps the front bumper has to be removed.

All doable but not a straight forward remove & replace job.

Wow, thanks for this, very useful.
So have you done this on your 2017 or pre facelift model?, and did you use the OEM part?
I’m assuming if using the OEM parts there will be less of a chance of errors showing on the dash or menu?

 

[s130]

Wow, thanks for this, very useful.
So have you done this on your 2017 or pre facelift model?, and did you use the OEM part?
I’m assuming if using the OEM parts there will be less of a chance of errors showing on the dash or menu?

No nothing done as my 500X 2015 came with Xenon headlamps as standard.

The DRLs are 22W standard bulbs. I tied an LED replacement (as the 22W bulbs melt the holders!) but was concerned about a) the legality / insurance issues and b) they didn't dim as per legal/homologation requirements.

For my/our days in motorsport in road going cars (long ago) I thoroughly researched all the insurance issues and technically (then) even the required Ignition Off labels on the steering column and other required safety stuff could/would invalidate our insurance. For example these visible items, go faster stripes, etc. from an underwriter's point of view make a vehicle more desirable to steal, joy ride, etc. and thus a risk that they have not catered for in their premium. Same goes for alloy wheels and *anything* that was not an original manufacturers item.

Today only one car still has these declared mods (brake lines, safety labelling, strut braces, air intake mods, .... no changes in the engine spec, suspension etc.). My 500X has it's Tow Bar declared as required and also I replaced the reversing light bulb to LED (no current legal/MOT issues in doing this) and declared this as well.

For what it is worth I also go overly upset in the past by an insurance assessor after a builder's van ran out of control cross the neighbours front garden, side swiped the rear on my Uno and continued over to the next front garden. The appointed assessor measured tyre tread depths, check brake pedal and handbrake and other stuff looking for anything that was not road legal (get out clause for insurance company). I had to point out to this guy my vehicle was parked on my drive at the time of the incident and therefor not required to be road legal etc. Really got me angry!

 

[FIAT-Faster than u think]

Some interesting points there, something I hadn’t considered.

But would this include if using the OEM parts from a newer 500x onto an old 500x cause that much of an issue? I would understand if it was aftermarket modifications

 

[s130]

Some interesting points there, something I hadn’t considered.

But would this include if using the OEM parts from a newer 500x onto an old 500x cause that much of an issue? I would understand if it was aftermarket modifications

Pass. (as my formal comment/reply)

Speculating.

If the replacement parts (OEM or aftermarket) meet all current legal/homologation requirements and are so marked then there should not be any road/UK/EU statutory violations (to my knowledge and would not concern me)

Regarding insurance then you will I believe have to declare these. Technically the vehicle will be different/modified from how it left the factory and all insurance companies require modifications to be declared. That said it is probably unlikely they would refuse to accept or increase your premium for legal light changes. You should speak to you insurer and ask them. If my experience is anything to go by the insurer will speak to the underwriter for confirmation etc. Underwriters don't like to lose money so if a small change that does not significantly potentially affect what they may have to pay out then they will be hopefully reluctant to a) refuse or b) increase the premium because you may seek business elsewhere.

 

[IaD]

Wow, thanks for this, very useful.
So have you done this on your 2017 or pre facelift model?, and did you use the OEM part?
I’m assuming if using the OEM parts there will be less of a chance of errors showing on the dash or menu?

Hi there
Registered on this forum just to reply)
I have fiat 500x 2107 cross and changed headlights to OEM Full LED last week.

Lights will work
no errors on dashboard
Fits well
Light is way better than before

But. issues you will face
- front bumper has to be removed - it's not hard, but to disassemble you'll need to disassemble plastic parts above tires. They are mounted on plastic clips which brakes very easy (on photo)
- driver side headlamp - wires are shorter. You'll need to tight them
- and basically how i get to this forum) Headlight level adjustments is not working (near headlight switch). I suppose this is related to connector pins and looking for diagrams - can't find anything.

hope this helps

PS sorry for mistakes, English is not my native

 

[IaD]

Oh, completely forget UK has driver on the right... in this case shorter wire is on passenger side)

 

[JStrongy]

Thank you for the detailed response @IaD... I literally signed up so I could reply to this thread!

My 2016 500X Cross Plus came with factory Bi-Xenon's, so don't really need to swap out the headlights but the OEM pre-facelift side lights look terrible!

Did you also replace the side lights / DLR's with the facelift LED clusters?

If so, did they work fine? Did you run into any problems?

 

[AndyRKett]

- and basically how i get to this forum) Headlight level adjustments is not working (near headlight switch). I suppose this is related to connector pins and looking for diagrams - can't find anything.

That is because EU legislation states that cars with xenon and LED headlights should have automatic headlight leveling.
There is usually a sensor attached to the suspension of the car that measures the deflection in the suspension and adjusts the headlights automatically and constantly to prevent the headlights from blinding oncoming cars.

Now I know that you're in Ukraine and therefore this is unlikely to be a problem for you as you may have different lighting laws and regulations, I'm sure that's not really a top priority for you guys at the moment. But your car may not have the required electronics to run the automatic adjustment.

Here in the UK other people would soon get very angry with you for driving around blinding everyone and the local police might want to stop you and find out why.

Thanks for posting about this though, its interesting they plug right in with no errors at all.

 

[s130]

That is because EU legislation states that cars with xenon and LED headlights should have automatic headlight leveling.
There is usually a sensor attached to the suspension of the car that measures the deflection in the suspension and adjusts the headlights automatically and constantly to prevent the headlights from blinding oncoming cars.

Not actually completely true when refering to Zenons. The 2015 500X with the lower powered Zenons and have no automatic levelling or washers. There is a lumens limit below which no levelling or washers, etc, are required.

As for the later LED lights then I have not researched but I would possibly suspect the follow the illumination levels that dictate the Zenons.

 

[AndyRKett]

Not actually completely true when refering to Zenons. The 2015 500X with the lower powered Zenons and have no automatic levelling or washers. There is a lumens limit below which no levelling or washers, etc, are required.

As for the later LED lights then I have not researched but I would possibly suspect the follow the illumination levels that dictate the Zenons.

I Know most newer cars with LEDs and lower Powered HID lights do not need to have headlight washer and most now don't however I am pretty sure they all have automatic leveling.

I think the rules changed again with the introduction of LED and laser Headlights as with LED there are many multiple light sources. It all gets a bit complicated, but basically LED and laser lights way exceed 2000Ln combined but individually each individual LED does not. They still have the potential to dazzle being much brighter than the 2000ln rules but as they are a diffused light source a bit of dirt on the lens will only get the light from a couple of the lower powered individual LEDs and not refract to the same degree as is the light was coming from one source.
I have also read something that at low beam they do not exceed the 2000Ln rule and only at high beam they do exceed it so in that situation main beam would dazzle anyway headlight washers or not. but low beam will still dazzle if the boot was say filled with bags of cement and the nose was pointed in the air

Anyway literally every car I have owned and driven with LED headlights still had automatic leveling but not washers.

HID cars did used to have washers but there was a lot of problems with that rule as many older cars fitted with HID lights before the rules were introduced in the early 2000s, had headlight leveling but didn't have washers. I am not sure if they have rescinded the laws on headlight washers or if it doesn't apply to headlights with multiple light sources within one unit.

I presume the newer 500X cars have LEDs now, maybe the earlier ones had HIDs? The problem is an HID and an LED headlight look pretty much the same externally.

I am not sure to be honest what the current laws are but I know there have been changes and I'd be interested to know.

 

[s130]

I am not sure to be honest what the current laws are but I know there have been changes and I'd be interested to know.

Not many are, including me. Homologation is a complex and often moving target especially as new technology is introduced. This is why it is a complex and tricky (possible legal implications) in changing anything on a modern car away from factory spec. One of the few options for pimping up one's car these days are still the rims and tyres and under bonnet stuff. The old deep tinted windows (used to be a common one) are now banned.

I've just had a read of the current MOT rules for lighting and they are interesting to say the least. e.g. It used to be the DRLs must dim when the headlamps dipped beam come on. Not true any more, if I'm reading correctly.

Daytime running lamps​

"You only need to inspect daytime running lamps (DRLs) if they’re fitted as original equipment to vehicles first used on or after 1 March 2018". I read this as DRLs fitted to a Fiat registered in 2015 then they do not need to be tested unless they also act as position lamps.

"Daytime running lamps (DRLs) or headlamps may function as front position lamps. If the DRLs function as front position lamps, they may or may not dim when rear position lamps are switched on and may dim or turn off when headlamps are switched on."

On my 500X 2015 previous MOTs prior to 2018 that I recall the tester did check that the wimpy incandescant bulbs dimmed. Don't recall this being done on the last MOT.

Headlamps, HID and LEDs also make interesting reading.

"Existing halogen headlamp units on vehicles first used on or after 1 April 1986 must not be converted to be used with high intensity discharge (HID) or light emitting diode (LED) bulbs. If such a conversion has been done, you must fail the headlamp for light source and lamp not compatible." I think we all knew this.

Levelling devices​

"Make sure any manual headlamp levelling devices (driver controls) work by:

• switching on the dipped beam headlamps
• operating the manual levelling device
• checking that the headlamp beams move up and down
• returning the levelling device control to its original position

Vehicles with high intensity discharge (HID) or LED dipped beam headlamps may be fitted with a suspension or headlamp self-levelling system. If these systems have been fitted, they must work.

Sometimes it is not easy to determine if the self-levelling systems work. In such cases you should give the benefit of the doubt."

So levelling is an interesting area. This has changed in that I guess testing stations have no equipment to measue light intensity so the earlier lumen limit for HIDs / LEDs not having to have levelling seems to have been sort of written out of the testing but a now "may be fitted"

I don't have the time but it would certainly be interesting to comapre all the various versions of MOT regs over the year to see how some items have changed.

e.g. now one can have up to 50% of the lamps (LEDs) in a light unit function (e.g multi side, indicator, brake, etc) not functioning whereas years ago a single bulb out in a high level brake light I'm pretty sure was a failure.