Technical 1997 2.5td engine runs after ignition off

[icer]

2.5 td 8140.47 engine, bosch pump
Engine has run on a couple of times yesterday, stopped after a couple of minutes.

I suspect a fuel shut off solenoid which is attached to end of injection pump, probably sticking, this is a single wire solenoid. I have replaced connector, and did not run on today, but I appreciate that if no current then it should not even run.

Does anybody know where I could source this solenoid? have contacted fiat and they could not locate it on parts list.

I have also looked at eper and I could not find it either.

Cheers

 

[ecunotemu]

2.5 td 8140.47 engine, bosch pump
Engine has run on a couple of times yesterday, stopped after a couple of minutes.

I suspect a fuel shut off solenoid which is attached to end of injection pump, probably sticking, this is a single wire solenoid. I have replaced connector, and did not run on today, but I appreciate that if no current then it should not even run.

Does anybody know where I could source this solenoid? have contacted fiat and they could not locate it on parts list.

I have also looked at eper and I could not find it either.

Cheers

They're on eBay standard across tons of vehicles get the Bosch number from the solenoid itself.

 

[CDK]

First check the solenoid by touching the contact with a 12V wire. If it is healthy you'll hear a clicking sound every time you touch it.
Defective solenoids on Bosch pumps are very rare, the needle valve under it can also cause your problem.

 

[ecunotemu]

First check the solenoid by touching the contact with a 12V wire. If it is healthy you'll hear a clicking sound every time you touch it.
Defective solenoids on Bosch pumps are very rare, the needle valve under it can also cause your problem.

Not that rare when you get to 200k+ miles but its usually a no start, cutting out or low power due to partial opening fault. What can happen is the o ring slips down the plunger jamming it. Get a genuine viton o ring as normal rubber ones don't last. Check for voltage on the solenoid when its running on, could be ignition switch or short in the loom. Are you sures its a bare solenoid I would have thought the 97 one would have at least have a plastic covered immobiliser or armoured one.

 

[icer]

Hi

No on solenoid is 119 01

Put a positive on tab but did not hear anything

Looked at eper and says its a bosch 0460414128/ iveco 99463927 replaced by 99483928

It has an immobiliser inbuilt

It is on a Hymer build date 10/1997 but I believe base vehicle is probably 05/1996
A picture is worth a thousand words hope this helps, nope it failed. will try tomorrow with less pixals

Ian

 

[CDK]

Only a bare solenoid can be checked with a wire. Yours has a plastic hood over it that contains a small circuit board, connected to a command circuit hidden somewhere in the cabin. The solenoid is activated only by a pulse train with the proper timing.
In the past I dissected two such units when converting car engines to marine ones; a difficult job because the whole interior is potted with very tough resin.

 

[icer]

Have managed to take a couple of pictures lower quality but should be ok

writing on the black surface is Bosch 0 281 005 013 04.03.96

Ian

 

[ecunotemu]

Have managed to take a couple of pictures lower quality but should be ok

writing on the black surface is Bosch 0 281 005 013 04.03.96

Ian

THink you've been putting the 12v on the cold start

You're lucky yours isn't armoured you have to remove the black immobiliser module by jamming a torx head into the tamper screws or if your solenoids ok, cut the top off with a dremel/chisel and solder switched 12v to the circuit inside. May have implications for your insurance so you may need to install a thatcham immobiliser.

 

[icer]

ecunotemu

So the thing with the grey wire going to it is the cold start?

I thought that Flame glow plug mounted on inlet manifold and an electro-valve adjacent connected by small pipe was the cold start.

So the black thing with the numbers on it is the immobiliser

Where is the fuel stop solenoid then?

Ian

 

[CDK]

"Where is the fuel stop solenoid then?"

See post #6 .

 

[icer]

CDK if it helps at all, please assume you are talking to an idiot.

All i want is to try and get the vehicle working properly.

If the problem that I have outlined is likely to be the fuel stop solenoid I just want to get it repaired.

I obviously have no idea where the part is, how accessible, or what is involved.

If you have some inclination please try and be a bit forthcoming

If it is not a simple job then I will get someone else to do it but as the vehicle is getting on a bit parts can be difficult to source and I will obtain them if I can.

Thanks in anticipation

Ian

 

[ecunotemu]

ecunotemu So the thing with the grey wire going to it is the cold start?

It advanced the ignition timing up to 5 degrees to help burn the diesel in cold weather.

The stop solenoid is under the black unit. The immobiliser circuit inside the black unit is most lightly the problem but first I would try unplugging the ignition wiring plug when its running on to rule out a simple ignition switch fault.

Removing the immobiliser unit on the pump is ok on the bench but pretty awkward in situ. I know an iveco mechanic that does these in 5 minutes with a wood chisel and a lump hammer but its all about knowing where to hit it.

Pictorials here you can ignore the armour bit, last picture shows solenoid under the unit.

http://www.eastment.net/Boschpump2.htm

 

[icer]

ecunotemu

Wow, thats a different ball game completely.

There was me thinking, replace the bit on the end job done.

It only occured the other day after I started and stopped the engine 8 or 9 times in sucession. 10th time reluctant to start then it did. tried to start and stop another couple of times and it occurred again.
Following day was ok. tried to replicate problem started and stopped about 7 times without a problem.

Not quite a simple repair then?

Problem is I am off on a trip within the next month, somewhere between 5~8K over a 6 week period and do not want any issues.

Ian

 

[ecunotemu]

ecunotemu

Wow, thats a different ball game completely.

There was me thinking, replace the bit on the end job done.

It only occured the other day after I started and stopped the engine 8 or 9 times in sucession. 10th time reluctant to start then it did. tried to start and stop another couple of times and it occurred again.
Following day was ok. tried to replicate problem started and stopped about 7 times without a problem.

Not quite a simple repair then?

Problem is I am off on a trip within the next month, somewhere between 5~8K over a 6 week period and do not want any issues.

Ian

Relative to a modern hp diesel with all the euro emissions gubbins its dead simple. As I said it could still be as simple as ignition switch.

It was a common enough failure, ambulances and emergency vehicles has it disabled from new and you'll find almost every iveco daily of that era is the same. You can get a toad or cobra immobiliser for under 50 quid but insurance may want it installed by and approved installer too.