Could hear a grinding noise from the brakes when they were applied. So, took it to a kiwk-fit local to where we happened to be who discovered that the entire brake shoe on both rear wheels, de-laminated so that the shoe material was effectively rattling around in the drum.

Had those replaced. However, when they returned the vehicle, the brake pedal travel was excessive and the brakes weren't fantastic. They said that they reckon the master brake cylinder had gone and needed replacement. I'm still awaiting them finding a replacement master brake cylinder. But am wondering whether that is the problem or could there be something else amiss?

any advice gratefully received.

thanks

Rich

Did they bleed them properly? Check fluid level. Bleed again and see how they are before going for a master cylinder. How were the rear wheel cylinders? They can be dodgy and don't much like being tampered with, they are cheap, http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/PAGID-Rea...404355?hash=item51bd9b05c3:g:paIAAOxyeglTX3Q2

I haven't got access to my eLearn disc atm so this advice is from memory!

I believe there is a mechanical self adjuster for the rear shoes consisting of a threaded rod/sleeve and pawl (works by applying the handbrake)

Inevitably with age these seize and need to be 'manually' adjusted; maybe this wasn't done when the new shoes were fitted, this would account for the extra pedal travel

Kwik Fit eh! I've been on another thread regarding rear brakes. Personally I'd whip off the wheels & see what's what. The adjuster can corrode up & requires freeing up & set properly. There's only a few things that stop things working correctly, as I've said first course of elimination should be what's going on behind the drums.

Thanks everyone for your replies. They're much appreciated. I'll pass the relevant information onto kwik-fit and hopefully, we'll have properly working brakes on Wednesday.

For the want of a better word, to be blunt, ditch Kwik Fit & investigate yourself, not really a difficult job. If you're not confident try somewhere else. A friend, work mate, anyone but not Kwik Fit

cris1117 said:

Hi. Completely agree with the adjusters probably haven’t been freed up and set properly, but also new shoes will take a little while to bed themselves in and the brake pedal may feel spongy until the vehicle has been run for a while.

Click to expand...

New shoes would not make the pedal feel spongy. There is a reason for the spongy feel, whether the master cylinder has gone which I doubt, then again I could be wrong, but without further knowledge & elimination of the obvious factors, I certainly wouldn't be taking Kwik fits explanation.

Hello
I had problems with my rear brakes also on a 2.8jtd maxi motorhome.
Mine has 'tophat' rear brake discs which are probably the same as yours and the brake shoes sit 'inside' the brake disc. The adjustment of the rear brake shoes is critical for correct operation and pedal height. There is a slotted screw visible through a drum aperture to adjust the brake shoe clearance and needs adjusting so that there is just clearance when the brakes (handbrake and footpedal) are off. Too much shoe clearance results in excessive pedal travel.
The brake shoes need adjusting before any adjustment of the handbrake cables is made which must not be used as an alternative to shoe adjustment.
The rear brakes on these models can be quite 'snatchy' on the handbrake if incorrectly adjusted and a good shamfer on the leading edge of the rear brake shoes helps to minimise the problem.
When adjusted properly they work really well and will easily hold our 3.5t motorhome on steep inclines. You need long gorilla arms to operate the handbrake which must come as standard with Italian drivers.

Kwik-Fit sell tyres..........end of.

I think yours is a different setup to the OP, his are not discs with a top hat handbrake system.

When I had drum brakes on the rear, I always drilled a hole in each drum (in th appropriate place) and adjusted the brakes with a terminal screwdriver on the ratchet wheel.

How many clicks when you pull the handbrake and is there still too much travel in the pedal with the handbrake pulled. You can adjust the ratchet wheel through the holes for the studs

corcai said:

How many clicks when you pull the handbrake and is there still too much travel in the pedal with the handbrake pulled. You can adjust the ratchet wheel through the holes for the studs

Click to expand...

Corcai. Advice please. Is the star adjuster moved downwards to tighten/expand shoes , or upwards with the screwdriver blade?

Of course the slack in the shoes adjustment hasn't been taken up, hence the longer brake pedal travel. But it aint going to adjust itself as auto adjuster must be sticking or seized. Ask Kwik Kwak how they intend doing that.
I'm surprised there not wanting you to pay for new tyres, brake calipers, pads, shoes all round. Oh and how about new coolant as it probably looked wet. Wiper blades as they were going swoosh swoosh. And light bulbs cause they were blinding the road...
Master Cylinder NO..FFS..
50 years driving and they don't get any better.

blaven said:

Corcai. Advice please. Is the star adjuster moved downwards to tighten/expand shoes , or upwards with the screwdriver blade?

Click to expand...

Cant remember off the top of my head but you can feel it as when you're expanding you're working against the spring and if you turn it the other way the spring is assisting.

Toyo,,,

The handbrake and hydraulics don't interact.
"Too much shoe clearance results in excessive pedal travel"
==
Not so, as the hydraulics work only on the disc part of the rear brake, handbrake is cable only and not involved with the other part of the system.


"The brake shoes need adjusting before any adjustment of the handbrake cables is made which must not be used as an alternative to shoe adjustment.
When adjusted properly they work really well and will easily hold our 3.5t motorhome on steep inclines."
== Lucky you! My 5.2t is borderline unlessyou are built like the Hulk. (Well, I can manage but my MOT tester moans about it every year as the Kobran extender hurts his wee fingers ; I put it on 4 notches, and he really has probs pulling it up to realease ratchet. Pah! Always passes tho'.

"You need long gorilla arms to operate the handbrake which must come as standard with Italian drivers."=== I totally concur, but usually Italians ain't usually Hulk-like, lol.

I've been working on too many rear brakes which used shoes as the stopping medium. Most use pads on discs now. What's my Panda here got....Emmm Discs..No...Shoes..!!!!
Couldn't believe what I had just written about the parking brake shoes causing excessive brake travel ...But how many of you thought it out...
Sorry Guys....

goggs said:

I've been working on too many rear brakes which used shoes as the stopping medium. Most use pads on discs now. What's my Panda here got....Emmm Discs..No...Shoes..!!!!
Couldn't believe what I had just written about the parking brake shoes causing excessive brake travel ...But how many of you thought it out...
Sorry Guys....

Click to expand...

2002 230 is drums only, 2002 244 is tophats

Yeh I had to go and check mine out as I've yet to work on them. Yes Top Hat type, 2002, 244. I'm used to working on problems with top hat type on my Voyager with the unequal length brake pull wires. Think I'll wait till spring. Yeh prob/hopefully not need a Spring kit.

easy way i have found to set up brakes on top hat or drum type brakes using the star wheel is as follows ...
make sure drum or inner tophat are clean and dust or grease free ,

lightly rough off the glaze from brand new discs or shoes .

replace drum or disc with handbrake off and adjust the star wheel with a flat edged screwdriver via the inspection hole in the back of the backing plate.
adjust up until you just start to feel resistance on the drum or disc when you try turn it by hand .
then turn the star wheel back just a fraction so there is just no resistance .

repeat procedure for other side .
now check the number of clicks on the handbrake . adjust accordingly till you get to around 3 clicks then take for test drive.

remember brakes need to bed in so try avoid high speed hard braking until they feel bedded in and more responsive.

if you are cleaning and greasing parts like adjusters or pivots i strongly advise not to use copper grease as it dries out and gums up parts , i use mobidium high melting point bearing grease and just use copper slip for backs of brake pads etc to reduce squeeling or chattering