General Panda 169 Rims And tyre questions? with dimensions

[atakan123123]

Hello again;
My car currently has a set of 13" steel wheels.
Aesthetically, they look quite beautiful and sturdy.
The previous owner installed a tire that was not the original factory size. (175/80/13)

The tires are 2021 tires. They are in good condition.

I'm very happy with the roadholding now.
The tire he installed added about 1 inch of height to the vehicle.


However, I have a few questions in my mind.

What are the advantages and disadvantages of having a larger tire size than the original size? This question applies to panda.

I think the front set is too heavy due to the Steel Rim.

I'm undecided whether I should use aluminum or steel rims.

I'm thinking of switching to 14" or 15" aluminum rims.

If I come across a second-hand, affordable product, I'll probably replace it.


What are your ideas? I don't want to waste money

 

[koalar]

I would Stick as close as possible to original,

hours of testing under different loads and weather and road conditions came to


Fiat panda 100hp
6.5J x 15 ET30 195/45 R15
5.5J x 14 ET32 185/55 R14
Spare
4.00B x 15 ET 35 125/70 R15

Fiat panda 4x4
5.5J x 14 165/70 R14
Spare
4.00B x 14 135/80 R14

Climbing
5.5J x 14 185/65 R14
5.5J x 14 165/70 R14
Spare
4.00B x 14 135/80 R14

Cross
5.5J x 14 185/65 R14
Spare
4.00B x 14 135/80 R14

6J x 15 175/65 R15
Spare
4.00B x15 125/80 R15

Emotion
5Jx14 165/65 R14
Spare
4.50B x 13 135/80 13

Active. Actual, dynamic
5B x 13 ET41 155/80 R13
5J x 14 ET38 165/60 R14
Spare
4.50B x 13 135/80 13

And the correct offsets are
ET41 155
ET38 165
ET32 185
ET30 195

Here in the UK we are suppose to inform the insurance company, By sticking with original fitment your unlikely to get into any bother


13" higher tyre wall absorb the bumps better

15" lower profile give you a more direct feel

Wider tyres give better grip in the dry

Narrower are less prone to aquaplaning

Wide tyres on narrow rims tip up, Leading to unprodicable handling especially if pushed to the edge

Putting J bead tyres onto a B bead rim is dangerous

If you drive normally on pot holes, snow and ice, rain

Steel 5B x 13 ET41 155/80 R13 toyo nano is hard to better


For a more dry grip

6J x 15 175/65 R15 or 5J x 14 ET38 165/60 R14 would be a reasonable choice and compromise between grip and comfort

6.5J x 15 ET30 195/45 R15 is over kill for day to driving in my opinion, and leads to clearance isssues

5J x 14 ET38 165/60 R14 vs 5B x 13 ET41 155/80 R13 having driven both back to back they each have the plus and minus. For just pottering about the 155 has it. Pushed hard the 165 has it


Track race pandas with twice the horsepower are on 175 tyres

 

[jrkitching]

Good summary by @koalar.

Be aware also that the majority of alloy wheel/tyre combinations are both significantly heavier, and have higher inertia, than the stock steel fitment. Keeping the unsprung mass and rotational inertia down is generally a good thing.

For most folks, most of the time, the standard 155/80 fitment on 13" steel wheels is generally the best combination in all respects save perhaps for appearance. A 60HP car isn't going to be traction limited by standard tyres in most scenarios.

 

[MLW]

Could not agree more. Keep it standard. FIAT have done hundreds of hours testing and I never understand why individuals want to 'go big' on wheels. 155/80/13 will give a bit in potholes as well. Also a cheap tyre size. Toyo tyres are good.

 

[SB1500]

Another drawback of wheels that are larger than the ones fitted from factory can be the speedometer accuracy. Your speed may not be accurate due to the additional or less rolling area of the bigger / smaller modified size tyre.

This sounds really insignificant for sure, but on a recent speed awareness course they actually claimed even the correct size (worn down) can impact this. If they found it worth stating that - it might be applicable to this scenario too.

 

[SB1500]

FIAT have done hundreds of hours testing

There’s people out there who believe that their local ‘remap garage’ can retune an engine to get more power, better miles per gallon, MORE reliability and lower emissions - and will pay hundreds to have their car changed to chase that dream. As if Fiat’s engineers and millions of Euros of R&D couldn’t figure it out if it were possible

 

[koalar]

My car currently has a set of 13" steel wheels.
Aesthetically, they look quite beautiful and sturdy.
The previous owner installed a tire that was not the original factory size. (175/80/13)

You really need to pull a wheel off and see what's wheels are fitted

175/80R13 aren't a normal fitment for the pandas 5B x 13 ET41 rims I had on my pandas

It's possible fiat fitted different wheels for different markets or the wheels are punto or 500

 

[atakan123123]

You really need to pull a wheel off and see what's wheels are fitted

Are these values written on the rim?

Or do I need to take it to the tire shop and have it completely removed from the tire?

I will check this as soon as possible.

14" Factory Steel rim and
5J x 14 ET38 165/60 R14

The tire combination seems to be the most suitable for me.

 

[koalar]

Usally it has the ET stamped in

Some have the part number, it usally pretty easy to workout what you have

You can always use a tape measure

 

[atakan123123]

Funny story
I bought a set of affordable second-hand Fiat wheels.

3 of them are "et37"
1 of them is "et32"

I didn't realize this.

The seller promised to replace it. We are waiting for the material to arrive. (1-2 weeks)

Or I will sell it as second hand. No seller or customer pays attention to "et" codes. He doesn't care.

 

[Yolanda]

There’s people out there who believe that their local ‘remap garage’ can retune an engine to get more power, better miles per gallon, MORE reliability and lower emissions - and will pay hundreds to have their car changed to chase that dream. As if Fiat’s engineers and millions of Euros of R&D couldn’t figure it out if it were possible

Re Maps do work, although it could depend on engine size. I had a Jaguar S Type 2.7V6 turbo diesel which I had re mapped giving 40 more BHP and another 100 ft lbs of torque. I had the car for 11 years with no engine problems whatsoever.
However with smaller petrol engines like our Panda's there probably wouldn't be any significant gain.

 

[jrkitching]

There’s people out there who believe that their local ‘remap garage’ can retune an engine to get more power, better miles per gallon, MORE reliability and lower emissions

The factory map is a compromise of all those factors.

A remap can quite likely get you an improvement in any one; but anyone claiming it'll get you all four at the same time is selling snake oil.

And as far as power is concerned, how that power is delivered through the rev range is way more important than the headline peak number.

 

[GettinBetter]

The factory map is a compromise of all those factors.

Absolutely, spot on.
A remap can be honed to specifically cater for any one (maybe even two) of those assets, at the expense of the others. The manufactureere needs all to look attractive to the widest potential market.
The question is, who is saying a remap does ALL simultaneously?

 

[koalar]

I have posted previously some engine dyno graphs for the 1.1,1.2.1.3 and 1.4 which are more accurate than a estimated rolling road

I have also posted some indpendent rolling road with a decat, sports exhaust and air filter on a 1.2 60hp, there is nothing noteworthy to be gained

I have"t ever post a before and after independent rolling road of a remap on the same day because I can't find one, the 1.2 has been modded for 30 yearsl

There isn't anything to be gained that noticable, in fact some were a decrease but most are within the accuracy of the rolling road

Fiat aren't idiots the mixture, timing, will be close to ideal, the power is already dropping off at higher revs

To get a 9hp increase fiat changed the head, cam, compression ratio, pullies timing, map and much more and even then it's only at the top end

160HP is doable out of the 1.2 8v but not without some serious modifications and probably not that nice to drive

Turbos are completly different kettle of fish,

Take the Grande Punto 1.4 T-Jet
Starts. 120 bhp
Remap. 159bhp nothing else changed
Turbo. 210bhp bolt on parts not cheap
Up to. 330bhp on forged internals ect,

 

[The Panda Nut]

Another drawback of wheels that are larger than the ones fitted from factory can be the speedometer accuracy. Your speed may not be accurate due to the additional or less rolling area of the bigger / smaller modified size tyre.

This sounds really insignificant for sure, but on a recent speed awareness course they actually claimed even the correct size (worn down) can impact this. If they found it worth stating that - it might be applicable to this scenario too.

Noop speedo not exactly accurate from new... Indicated 80 is a real 72! MAybe I should change the wheels. The other two Pandas are a little better but not much.