My Stilo has done 135KM and is smoking on startup , just on startup it seems and sometimes worse than others. Its not been driven very hard and always services on time in 18 or so years , Smoking is a recent occurrence around 6 months or so and it uses about 1L of oil every 1000 miles perhaps less . Any ideas anybody is it likely to be drastic given its not very hard past or could it be something simple ? Doesn't smoke once its running and and warmed up

Top suspect is typically turbo for smoke. If the bearings are worn they will leak out into the cold side of the turbo and you're picking that up on engine start.


It could be leaky injectors and you're burning off fuel on start too, that wouldn't be unheard of.


Have a listen and see if your turbo is singing out when you're driving (under acceleration). A turbo that is well on it's way will usually give quite a good howl, as opposed to the subtle whistle that it should make. Not all failing turbos will make a noise or tell you about it though.

Hi Thanks for responding good guides Ill take a listen but cant say Ive heard any irregular noises from the engine or turbo. I have also got the dreaded preheat fault would that contribute , looks like ive got to test and change the glow plugs if faulty. I think Im also due a CAM timing belt is there a service schedule on the forum somewhere as I cant seem to find ! Last question , If i have to change the belt should i also change the injectors and or Turbo (latter sounds drastic) give me a clue and much appreciated again

Hi again no noise from the Turbo as far as i can tell. Definite billow of grey blue smoke if stopped for about 1 hour or overnight. It woulc smell like underburnt diesel as I have a similar cloud and smell coming from my 40 year old crank handle dump truck when i start it ! Once warm no smoke and no smell. Do you think injectors ? how do i tell if/which is leaky ?

I don't know why the injectors would be causing smoke on start-up.

If they leak, then the beast will have a dribble of diesel inside the chamber which would produce a *bit* of exhaust smoke.. but you state that the beast uses 1ltr of oil in less than 1000 miles.. which is abnormally high and suggests that the smoke is burnt engine oil, not diesel. Forget the injectors for now.

If it's not the turbo being strange, then it can only be coming from inside the combustion chamber... so that means you have a dead oil ring, or leaking valve guides. Seeing as you have looked after the engine AND the beast only does the impression of a Kuwaiti oil field on startup it's more likely to be a valve stem seal rather than a ring.

You'll need an endoscope to poke into the combustion chambers and look at the valves. The affected chamber will have more oily soot on the piston crown and the valve stem(s) affected will be oily. If you have the rocker cover off, you may see that one of the valve stem seals will be poorly seated or damaged.. but this is a camshaft off job.

If the stem seal(s) are knackered, you'll need to take the cylinder head off to fit new ones.. so then change the cam-belt/tensioner/water pump etc. and ALL the seals at the same time.

Otherwise if the car is old/knackered and you're going to change it next year anyway, you could still continue to run it, using slightly heavier (e.g. 15W40) oil... though longer term this will probably damage your catalyst, pollute the planet and you may get a bigger failure (smoking like an Kuwaiti oil field/cops will notice) at any time.

Ralf S.

leaky injectors wouldn't be unheard of. If they've started to deteriorate then they could well weep a bit of fuel into the cylinders when left idle.






Under normal running you'd not notice as the fuel will be atomised and burned with the rest of the fuel delivered and of course the ECU will be doing some correction to the mix ratio.


When left stationary this of course pools in the cylinders and doesn't burn off properly as it's not atomised fuel air mix so it burns up and gives the smoke.


There are plenty of places about that test fuel injectors but the only way to do this properly is remove and bench test.


I know my local fiat alfa indie is able to test injectors, more places do it than you think they just don't tend to advertise so much. Speak to your mechanic, if they don't have the rig to do it themselves, they'll have somewhere they send away to.

Hi Ralph

OK Update things have got worse. Im gutted becaus ethe cars in good shape my mother had it for 15 yrs soi no idea why its failing. The smoke is worse and now its just started to billow blacker smoke at high revs (anything over 2-3000 when accelerating or revving at idle) Suffice to say ive not revved it much ! SO Does that rule out the valve guides and an oil seal ? Is it therefore the Turbo about to give up. My father has just admitted that they had the turbo "cleaned" at about 60K miles garage said too much town driving. Oil consumption is through the roof 1 L less than 1000KM - literally worse in the last 2 weeks and no hard driving at all. Im happy to strip it down as it needs a timing belt anyway but how do i know if its valve or turbo - ps turbo sounds expensive but if Lewis can get a new one fitted in 30 mins I can have a go ! !

guys I should add that the engine sounds fine has the normal power no obvious external signs or noise or low power - YET

Could it be the EGR? mine smoked like the flying scotsman, I blanked it and happy days ever since.

Ok im going to strip it down this week enough is enough. Would the egr valve cause the oil burn because it's significant . Ice got to change timing belt so think I'll go bit by bit down to the egr and turbo. I notice an oily residue on the hose from the turbo to the air filter is that normal ? How do you blank the EGR if there a thread on that ? Thanks all will report as things progress

Hi all and many thanks to all who responded. I replaced the Turbo, EGR and timing belt all has been good for 4 weeks started first time not a drop of oil , passed MOT so no emissions issues and ran really well, found and repaired a cut in the big black pipe that comes from the right hand side of the turbo looking down from the top and attaching to the rocker cover. I would say definitely the turbo for the oil and black smoke could have been the pipe or EGR. . However today broke down - boohoo - and ive found the thermostat housing on the top right of the engine rocker cover to have cracked . no idea how this has happened so I am about to strip it out and check, not sure if coincidence or something Ive done but will let you know and start another thread, any pointers as to which component it is very welcome pics attached thanks again all

The part in your picture is the vacuum pump. The engine thermostat is directly below it.

Is the pump cracked, or just the gasket gone?
.

Hi Davren worse I'm afraid. Pump has a slight chunk out of it, but the mounting which also is the last cam shaft bearing/top bracket is also broken. Worse than that the end of the Camshaft with the key that turns the vacuum pump is broken off !! so its a new pump, new mountain piece and either weld the camshaft (guees its not poss ! ) or replace the camshaft (very painful! ) But what can cause this to happen any ideas , on inspection the vacuum pump fracture looks old and it could have been leaking a little oil for some time as I did notice this on the turbo fitting. I know I've replaced the timing belt so I have tried to work out if any issue with this I have removed the cover timing cover and the accessory flywheel and both the CAM and Crank timing marks are in the exact same places i.e. on the marks (TDC I guess phew !). Pics attached any advice welcome ! :bang: Gutted as was all going so well

You may have to find and fit a second hand cylinder head .

hi thanks but any ideas on whats caused this ? Is it easier to fit a new camshaft as the head looks in very good order from the top that is ! and as its only done 140kkm I'm a bit gutted its given up, looks like fatigue on the pump housing/cam bracket but any ideas on what wort of issue caused it to give up

It's difficult to tell what caused that damage. It's not under much load at all, ordinarily.

That vacuum doodah / cam cap is a candidate for being removed whenever someone is replacing the thermostat or doing something with the EGR valve.. or it may have been left in place (still tight) whilst someone was fiddling at the other end of the camshaft (e.g. oil seal or perhaps TDC sensor).. but anyway, it looks to have been "levered" against its will.

That piece should be simple to find second hand... as would the cam-shaft and any other pieces up there.

The cam-shaft is not that complicated to replace, if you have already changed the cam-belt. Make sure you put some instant gasket under the cap since I recall it lives partially inside the rocker cover and partially outside it... so oil can seep between it and the head, bypassing the rocker gasket.


Ralf S.

There could be problem s in just changing the camshaft bearing/holder. The camshaft caps are bored at same time as head so are matched to the head they are on. You can't even mix them up on the same head.
A replacement head is required to together with a vacuum pump in case it seized causing head damage.

Hi Ralph , how do you mean "or it may have been left in place (still tight) whilst someone was fiddling at the other end of the camshaft (e.g. oil seal or perhaps TDC sensor). I haven't changed anything on the camshaft except timing belt replacement. The vacuum pump spins freely my guess is the housing has given up a pieces of it goes into the drive area where cam end meets pump and caused some friction and snap goes the lot. Im really surprised the end of the camshaft is damaged as it looks as good as new all the way along! thanks for the tips ill start the parts research

thanks Jackwhoo ill try and source both I'm a little confused as to why a camshaft can't be replaced on its own when you can replace a camshaft with a tuned version. Id prefer to not take the head off of course as that looks a lot more work cost and trouble ! Do you mean the vacuums pump seized ? Or the Cam shaft seized , no evidence of the latter as I said in my note to Ralph apart from the broken end piece it looks immaculate !

Ive moved my Camshaft and vacuum pump issue to a new thread

https://www.fiatforum.com/stilo/454001-1-9-jtd-still-vacuum-pump-casing-end-camshaft-broken.html

Oil burning has stopped so turbo replacement 98% certain was the fix thanks all