Technical ELD, HillHold, ESC are all unavailable

[WitleyPanda]

That’s a stop-start battery — see the ‘Attention’ note on it. Mine, 4 years old and 42,000 miles is tending to not stop, or restarts nearly immediately, showing it’s on its way out. If that’s the original 2012 battery, that’s done very well! S/S batteries are quite short lived - rarely performing well after 5 years and lasting much less long if not regularly used for long trips.

That Mopar original in my car is made by Exide. For the diesel MultiJet, this is the replacement- with a 3 year warranty https://www.tayna.co.uk/car-batteries/exide/ek600/

Yes i know it a start stop battery, but not sure what technology. The link you attached is for a AGM technology, which prefer a higher charging voltage ( 14.4 - 14.8v) and tend to be fitted to premium vehicles. But as far as I know the panda alternator only a 14.4V output, so will never totally charge an AGM. ( had this issue with caravan liesure battery.) Hence me looking at the EFB which I know less about the technology and charging cycle, but will fully charge on standard alternator, as i understand it) and had a 4 year warrantry, also from Tayna.

 

[Herts Hillhopper]

Yes i know it a start stop battery, but not sure what technology. The link you attached is for a AGM technology, which prefer a higher charging voltage ( 14.4 - 14.8v) and tend to be fitted to premium vehicles. But as far as I know the panda alternator only a 14.4V output, so will never totally charge an AGM. ( had this issue with caravan liesure battery.) Hence me looking at the EFB which I know less about the technology and charging cycle, but will fully charge on standard alternator, as i understand it) and had a 4 year warrantry, also from Tayna.

According to Exide's own website , the battery should be an EFB version.. (in which case, here's a new link to Tayna - https://www.tayna.co.uk/car-batteries/exide/el600/ )

The Panda alternator has a variable output, depending on other demands from the engine. It delivers a higher current (and voltage?) on the over-run than it does when the car is accelerating, which is why the heater blower appears to blow harder when you're going downhill. I guess this is one reason why the battery is less happy if the car only makes short trips around town. There are known issues with these 'smart' alternators if an additional battery is connected to them...

Screenshot from https://www.exidegroup.com/eu/en/battery-finder/technical-specifications

 

[WitleyPanda]

I understand what you're saying, but also suggest Fiat wouldn't factory-fit a battery that wouldn't work? I assume all the electronics related to charging (including the voltage sensor connected to the battery that is part of the stop/start system) is all designed to work with the alternator battery and computer in the car.

The Panda alternator has a variable output, depending on other demands from the engine. It delivers a higher current (and voltage?) on the over-run than it does when the car is accelerating, which is why the heater blower appears to blow harder when you're going downhill. I guess this is one reason why the battery is less happy if the car only makes short trips around town. There are known issues with these 'smart' alternators if an additional battery is connected to them...

According to Exide, the battery I provided a link to is an EFB version... https://www.exidegroup.com/eu/en/battery-finder/technical-specifications
View attachment 415187

Thanks, that is why I was trying to find out what the factory fiited? will stick with the EFB. ( Even Tanya failed to realise that the charge voltage was the key characteristic, rather that physically trying to match the physical size.) Thanks again.

 

[Herts Hillhopper]

Thanks, that is why I was trying to find out what the factory fiited? will stick with the EFB. ( Even Tanya failed to realise that the charge voltage was the key characteristic, rather that physically trying to match the physical size.) Thanks again.

(You'll spot I edited /corrected my post above - but after you'd already replied

 

[Herts Hillhopper]

We are not alone... https://www.fiatforum.com/threads/agm-or-efb-battery.483112/

 

[WitleyPanda]

New battery from battery group, arrived next day. Fitted this morning, stop start now functional and touch wood no errors............. interesting the old battery at 12.62volts, ( and ceased to give faults the last few days) new at 12.51volts, so it is depth/capacity rather than voltage than critical, or the fact that whilst changing battery used a AGM ( with higher nominal voltage) to save the radio codes etc. See how it goes with another week of commuting

 

[Herts Hillhopper]

Fingers crossed
Hopefully this adds to the growing list of folks whose ‘problems’ with warning lights and codes turned out to just be the battery being to blame.

As an aside, the standard-fit radio has no code - it’s linked to the body computer’s security system and so no radio code needed (however, if new body computer fitted, keys and radio need reprogramming to work again)

 

[WitleyPanda]

Fingers crossed
Hopefully this adds to the growing list of folks whose ‘problems’ with warning lights and codes turned out to just be the battery being to blame.

As an aside, the standard-fit radio has no code - it’s linked to the body computer’s security system and so no radio code needed (however, if new body computer fitted, keys and radio need reprogramming to work again)

Since my paperwork has a radio code and I had several batteries, clip and wire, together with not necessarily wanting to re calibrate , living on a hill etc, I played safe. I have a troublesome Discovery 2 and learned the hard way the issues of power loss and various computers not communicating or mis-communicating. ( sunroof opens on ignition, no interior lights etc, not even talking to JLR diagnostic system.) Wish that was as easy to fix with just a new battery.

 

[A3jeroen]

It's not the static Voltage. It's the Voltage drop when starting that causes problems.

gr J

 

[WitleyPanda]

It's not the static Voltage. It's the Voltage drop when starting that causes problems.

gr J

I come from a power supply background, to devices such as PCs and cell base stations, and prior to that aero/defence where some consideration is given to brownout situations, where there is some local decoupling to enable system to survive and function, even partially with power line disturbance. I assume that as electric vehicles become more advanced then the technology to deal with PLD will be rolled out, as to some extent it must be already. Obviously this not fitted to IC engined platforms of 10-15 ago. It would in hindsight, since the voltage monitored and used to decide if the start/stop system can be deployed, been useful to code it as a flag-able error code in it's own right rather than infer from other systems. However hindsight is wonderful? and at least there is a growing knowledge base on here.

 

[A3jeroen]

Even EV's have seperate 12V batteries that can make the system throw tantrums. That is why VW is putting batteries with larger capacity in the ID 3's and 4's when they update the software at the dealers.

gr J

 

[WitleyPanda]

So All issues now appear to have cleared ! I bet this new battery does not last 10 years? [ Sat nav given up but that another issue: Suspect the thermal cycling, age of it and it's battery, buy a new one for Xmas.]

 

[Herts Hillhopper]

This thread should act as a 'helpful outcome' for anyone experiencing odd warning lights or random fault codes - before you go anywhere near trying to replace sensors or switches, try the battery first. So often, the codes and lights are simply wrong because the battery isn't at its best.