Strada cold start system

[golfpin]

Hi all totally new and an idiot on the pc. Could someone help have a 1200 cc strada with magnetti marelli iaw 49f df ecu. Since clutch o/haul excessive richness, blacksmoke from exhaust lumpy and too slow idle [ cold 20 degrees C ambient] choke system seems to ease off as temp rises but vehicle very very heavy on fuel. engine temp sender unit [3 wires] has been replaced but symptoms same. Have been told fuelpressure regulator at fault?? any suggestions please.
With thanks Golfpin.

 

[varesecrazy]

Hi all totally new and an idiot on the pc. Could someone help have a 1200 cc strada with magnetti marelli iaw 49f df ecu. Since clutch o/haul excessive richness, blacksmoke from exhaust lumpy and too slow idle [ cold 20 degrees C ambient] choke system seems to ease off as temp rises but vehicle very very heavy on fuel. engine temp sender unit [3 wires] has been replaced but symptoms same. Have been told fuelpressure regulator at fault?? any suggestions please.
With thanks Golfpin.

Hi, and welcome,
we are a UK based forum,
and don't get SOME FIAT models..,
the last "strada" we saw was the 1984 130 Abarth

I suspect yours may be essentially a "Palio" with a boot / trunk

what engine 1242cc 16 Valve petrol..what year..??

there is PC software available that will tell what the ECU ( cars brain)THINKS is going on here..,

I'd suspect wiring damage.., common after a g-box change..

probably related to the ECU NOT seeing the engine temperature..and assuming it @-30'C outside:bang:

Charlie

 

[golfpin]

CHARLIE THANKS FOR THE PROMPT REPLY STUPID OF ME SHOULD HAVE THOUGHT TO GIVE MORE DETAILS i AM IN SOUTH AFRICA SO MY AMBIENT WHEN ENG IS COLD IS ABOUT 70 F THE ENG IS A 8V. RE THE START PROBLEM ANY CLUES AS TO WERE TO LOOK RE G.BOX OUT AND THEN THE PROBLEM STARTED. ALSO THE PEDAL ASSEMBLY WAS REMOVED TO ATTEND THE CLUTCH M/CYL COULD THIS HAVE A BEARING ON THE ISSUE. i AM NOW 72 AND CANNOT DO THE WORK MYSELF SO HAD TO RESORT TO A LOCAL !!!!!!!!!! I HEARD HIM MUTTERING THAT GETTING AT THE CLUTCH M/CYL WAS A PROBLEM ARE THERE WIRES UP THERE THAT MIGHT RELATE TO THIS ISSUE. I DON,T THINK THIS VEHICLE RUNS ON A POT ON THE ACCL PEDAL WILL GO OUT AND TRY AND SEE.

 

[varesecrazy]

CHARLIE THANKS FOR THE PROMPT REPLY STUPID OF ME SHOULD HAVE THOUGHT TO GIVE MORE DETAILS i AM IN SOUTH AFRICA SO MY AMBIENT WHEN ENG IS COLD IS ABOUT 70 F THE ENG IS A 8V. RE THE START PROBLEM ANY CLUES AS TO WERE TO LOOK RE G.BOX OUT AND THEN THE PROBLEM STARTED. ALSO THE PEDAL ASSEMBLY WAS REMOVED TO ATTEND THE CLUTCH M/CYL COULD THIS HAVE A BEARING ON THE ISSUE. i AM NOW 72 AND CANNOT DO THE WORK MYSELF SO HAD TO RESORT TO A LOCAL !!!!!!!!!! I HEARD HIM MUTTERING THAT GETTING AT THE CLUTCH M/CYL WAS A PROBLEM ARE THERE WIRES UP THERE THAT MIGHT RELATE TO THIS ISSUE. I DON,T THINK THIS VEHICLE RUNS ON A POT ON THE ACCL PEDAL WILL GO OUT AND TRY AND SEE.

no problem.., what year is the car..??

 

[golfpin]

BRAIN FADE AGAIN, IN OUR TERMS IT IS 2006 AND IS FITTED TO A SMALL LDV I HAVEN,T MANAGED ASCERTAIN IF WHEN THE TEMP GUAGE IS UP TO NORMAL IF THE ENGINE IS STILL EXCESSIVELY RICH COULD POSSIBLY ONLY DO THIS WITH A PLUG CUT AND TRY TO READ THE PLUG THIS ESTABLISHING IF THE ECU IS READING "COLD" ALL THE TIME BUT BASED ON THE LACK OF PERFORMANCE AND THE VERY HEAVY FUEL CONSUMPTION I THINK IT IS REASONABLE TO ASSUME THE ECU IS DELIVERING "RICH" ALL THE TIME. hAVEN,T LEARNED HOW TO NAV AROUND THIS SIGHT SO i HOPE THIS GETS BACK TO YOU, YOU MENTIONED THAT AFTER gBOX R/R THAT THIS PROBLEM IS NOT UNUSUAL ARE WE LOOKING FOR A BAD EARTH IF SO ANY IDEA WHERE? THANK YOU AGAIN FOR YOUR HELP AND PATIENCE.REGARDS GOLFPIN

 

[varesecrazy]

BRAIN FADE AGAIN, IN OUR TERMS IT IS 2006 AND IS FITTED TO A SMALL LDV I HAVEN,T MANAGED ASCERTAIN IF WHEN THE TEMP GUAGE IS UP TO NORMAL IF THE ENGINE IS STILL EXCESSIVELY RICH COULD POSSIBLY ONLY DO THIS WITH A PLUG CUT AND TRY TO READ THE PLUG THIS ESTABLISHING IF THE ECU IS READING "COLD" ALL THE TIME BUT BASED ON THE LACK OF PERFORMANCE AND THE VERY HEAVY FUEL CONSUMPTION I THINK IT IS REASONABLE TO ASSUME THE ECU IS DELIVERING "RICH" ALL THE TIME. hAVEN,T LEARNED HOW TO NAV AROUND THIS SIGHT SO i HOPE THIS GETS BACK TO YOU, YOU MENTIONED THAT AFTER gBOX R/R THAT THIS PROBLEM IS NOT UNUSUAL ARE WE LOOKING FOR A BAD EARTH IF SO ANY IDEA WHERE? THANK YOU AGAIN FOR YOUR HELP AND PATIENCE.REGARDS GOLFPIN

Hi,
ok - BASICS;

your car's 8 Valve engine is nice and simple..has been around since panda / uno @1984

it is of an age where On Board Diagnostics are good = OBD2 is the industry standard.
plugging into the diagnostic port SHOULD save a lot of time / hassle,
however that's reliant on info actually RECEIVED by the ECU. if you've compromised wiring this will be tricky.

simple 1st - it's electrics..

spend some time seeing where all the electrics are that MAY have been disturbed when the g-box ( and clutch) were worked on

:idea: the battery tray is often removed for better access - double check all the earth cables are bolted in tightly..AND look clean and bright.
You could even just try running a "jump-lead" as a 2nd earth straight from battery NEG - BLACK terminal to the engines metal work..see if the issue is improved.


My in-laws had a VERY similar issue on a KIA 4 x 4 after a "professional " clutch change.., the basic test was this=
remove battery power to clear "adaptive element" - then the ECU runs from it's own "factory settings"

reconnect power - start car = car ran perfectly for @ 10 seconds . then bogged ..as the engine was over fuelled..

critically, you could repeat this cycle for hours.., ran perfectly for a few seconds AFTER "clearing" the COLD -outside input.

ECU was actually tested , and replaced TWICE - no change.

didn't have any local expertise, car got scrapped within the next 200 miles:bang:


using a software program similar to "MultiECUScan" will help discover what the ECU is actually seeing.. in terms of air temp / coolant temp, etc

HUGELY beneficial in terms of diagnosis.., however you'd need cables / delivery time..,

do the basics 1st,
Charlie

 

[golfpin]

Charlie thks a mill will try my best but we are in a very small village 150 k from dubious agents, as an aside cannot get the quick reply to work ?? Thks again golfpin

 

[varesecrazy]

no problem,
in your situation I would;

1, remove negative battery lead for a couple of hours,
then reconnect and run engine - see if it's running cleaner

2, place a secondary earth cable straight from battery negative clamp - to a bolt on the engine metalwork.

see if that improves the running.

do let me know..
If you put @ then the FF members name they will be notified of the post =
golfpin

Charlie

 

[golfpin]

MORNING cHARLIE, HAVE SUCCEEDED IN LOSING MY LAST QUERY TO YOU SO WILL TRY AGAIN. WHEN VEHICLE WENT IN FOR THE CLUTCH THE BATT WOULD HAVE BEEN DISCONNECTED FOR ABOUT 2WEEKS [NO SPARES] IN THAT TIME THE KEY LOST ITS MEMORY AM CONCERNED THAT IF I DISCONNECT BATT AS SUGGESTED WILL THE KEY FAIL AGAIN IT IS PART OF THE IMMOBLISER. NOT SURE IF I ASKED THIS BUT WHEN THE G.BOX WAS REMOVED IT WAS FOUND THAT THE CLUTCH MASTER CYL WAS LEAKING AND WAS REMOVED FOR REPAIR. THIS I WAS TOLD BY THE REPAIRER WAS A VERY AWKWARD JOB AND THAT THE ENTIRE PEDAL ASSEMBLY HAD TO BE DROPPED COULD WIRING HAVE BEEN DAMAGED WHILE DOING THIS THKS AGAIN GOLFPIN

 

[varesecrazy]

as I said before, the g-box and clutch jobs require the removal of a LOT of things.

try using a jumplead from battery negative terminal to engine metal work now,
If it improves things you've just got an earth issue..,

TBH - I'm not sure losing the key recognition is "normal".

but we will work on 1 thing at a time.

 

[golfpin]

Thank you again will try as u suggest all the best golfpin and will keep u apprised

 

[golfpin]

morning charlie, update, no diff in symptoms did as suggested exactly same black smoke lumpy idle all he time even when engine temp was at normal. repairer has suggested fuel press/regultr is faulty i cannot even find the fuel p/reg I used to recogonise them a silver spinning top type cannister with an adj nut at the end of fuel rail but the fiat does not have this does a faulty press /reg sound a reasonable diagnosis given the symptoms? my main co.ncern is all this has after the gbx r/r. Any suggestions including "heri-keri" appreciated

 

[golfpin]

Anyone else able to add info re the problem with the cold start Charlie is perhaps away for the easter week end . The next question is could the fuel pressure regulator have any bearing on this issue unfortunately time is against me any thoughts would be greatly appreciated. thnks again Golfpin

 

[varesecrazy]

Post your current findings in the Palio section. Look for a similar problem to yours.

Several ZA based members on that side. May just have access to the kit for interrogating ECU.

AS A 1ST step unplug and Reconnect the ECU