General tyre blew because inner side was rubbing against inside of arch: need spacers?

[lukish]

Hello,

So two weeks ago I went to the car mechanic to replace my old Sonar tyre in the back, which had been badly punctured, with a Yokohama 185/50/14 (can't remember the exact model though).

The last night the Yokohama tyre blew up while on the highway. There was a terrible smell of burnt rubber. I examined what happened today, and I've seen that the reason the tyre blew up is that the inside of the tyre was rubbing against the inside of the wheel arch! Little by little this thinned the side of the tyre, till it completely cut it open. The tyre has a huge gash on the side now, and is even partially melted. A little bit of the red paint on the inner part of the wheel arch has even been scraped away by the constant friction, so that you can see the clean metal.

My question is: I'm driving a Seicento Sporting with standard 14" alloys, and the tyre fitted was a 185/50/14 which was just fine. I have two Conti sport in the front, same size, and they've been doing just fine. I assumed that that size of tyre could easily go in the back as well, but apparently not. What do I need to do to avoid that in the future? Add some spacers? If so, I've been reading about spacers, offset, ET, but am still not sure how big a spacer I need. Can anybody enlighten me please?

 

[varesecrazy]

if you've done thousands of miles with the previous tyre.. look elsewhere for the issue - play in bearings / etc letting parts rub,

photo's of damage will help here..!!

Charlie

 

[johnatan]

Just put 5mm spacers on backs and problem solved.
anddd, 185/50 is the coolest choice

 

[Duncan]

I'd check the rear trailing arm bushes or the trailing arm itself just in case something is wonky or worn out.

 

[David C]

Different makes and versions of tyres have different exact sizes for the same tyre size.
So it could be that your old tyre was slightly narrower than the Yokohama and had clearance, but the Yoko didn't.

But do check for bush wear etc too.

 

[alanjwormwell]

Thought standard tyre for Abarth alloys was 175 50 14?

 

[lukish]

Thank you all for the replies!

The Yoko only went in two weeks ago, and it may have done about 300 miles. I don't have photos, but the massive wear (and partial melting) on the side of the tyre and on the side of the wheel arch make attrition/lack of clearance the only explanation.

About spacers: I've read on another thread that when you use them wheel bearings are loaded and so they wear out much faster, but I don't think that would be too much of a problem in my case. And I still don't understand how to calculate the right offset/ET: but would the suggested 5mm spacers get me close to the optimal offset when paired with standard 14" alloys? If so, I'm thinking of buying these two http://www.rtecshop.com/shop/wheel-...-5mm-spacers-for-seicento-187-year-01.98.html they're the cheapest hubcentric ones I could find, although they're still much more expensive than the universal ones :-(

 

[Ouby]

....I still don't understand how to calculate the right offset/ET

If you Googled it you would-
http://www.1010tires.com/Tools/Wheel-Offset-Calculator
You're obviously looking for a quick fix & ignoring the fact that there is something wrong.
The correct size tyres for Abarth/Schumacher 14" alloys is 175/50/14 & they don't rub (10mm Abarth spacer fitted to the front only).
A Yoko 185/50/14 A539 tyre will have a squarer profile than the Sonar -but Sonar don't list this size as being available (discontinued size?).

 

[varesecrazy]

Thank you all for the replies!

The Yoko only went in two weeks ago, and it may have done about 300 miles.

About spacers: I've read on another thread that when you use them wheel bearings are loaded and so they wear out much faster, :-(

How much use did you get from the OLD tyre..??

did it wear strangely - THAT will point to worn mounts/bearings

Charlie

 

[lukish]

Fact is when I wrote yesterday I didn't realise that the tyre I replaced two weeks ago was a 175/50/14 (I thought I was simply replacing a 185/50/14 with a tyre with the same measurements!).

The other tyre in the rear is still an old Sonar S505, which measures 175/50/14: I've just checked the clearance between the inner side of that tyre and the inner side of the wheel-arch, and sure enough it is relatively small, about 1cm.

Somebody on this thread https://www.fiatforum.com/cinquecento-seicento/221240-tyres-seicento-sporting.html says that you need spacers in the back when using 185/55 tyres. Given what happened to me, I'm assuming you probably need spacers too with 185/50 (somebody suggested 5mm on this thread too https://www.fiatforum.com/cinquecento-seicento/419389-20mm-wheel-spacers-seiceto.html). So the Yoko replacement, at 185/50/14, and with no spacers whatsoever, must have started rubbing from day one. I'll post some photos of the damaged tyre and the marks on the inner wheel-arch later.

In any case I will also check the rear wheel mounts and bearings, just to rule out the possibility of the problem being due to them. if they need changing I'm going to order them through that Polish website people on this forum suggest. It will take some time but it's much cheaper than buying them here, as it's the ABS version that I need.

But now my dilemma is: should I buy two 175/50/14, or should I stick to 185/50/14 but buy 2x 5mm spacers for the rear? Since last September I've had two brand new Conti Sport 185/5014 in the front, and have been very happy with them! My idea was to have 185/50/14 everywhere, possibly Conti Sport, but now I might have to consider going with 175 instead.

How much use did you get from the OLD tyre..??

did it wear strangely - THAT will point to worn mounts/bearings

When I bought the car almost 3 years ago, the rear tyres were two different brands: one was Pirelli (probably still the original one from 2002), the other was Sonar S505 (175/50/14) (the front two tyres, incidentally, were both Sonar S505). Neither of them was worn unevenly, or too much (the car had done only 28k miles). If anything, I was surprised at how good and even the tread on both rear tyres still was, despite their looking pretty old as the rubber had started to crack.

Also, please note that yesterday I made a mistake in what I wrote: the tyre which got punctured and which I replaced two weeks ago was the old Pirelli P600, not the old Sonar S505, which is still there. So for the past two weeks the tyres I had in the rear were a 175/50/14 Sonar and a 185/50/14 Yoko. As I said, I checked this morning and the 175 Sonar has little clearance, so I'm pretty sure that a fatter tyre like the 185 Yoko would rub in its place.

Many thanks to all those who have answered, as always, for the help!

 

[varesecrazy]

so you'd fitted a 185 width - where a 175 had been before..?

was that the tyre fitters mistake..??,

Charlie

 

[lukish]

so you'd fitted a 185 width - where a 175 had been before..?

was that the tyre fitters mistake..??,

Charlie

Yes I had a 185 fitted where a 175 had been, and it was my mistake - the tyre fitters simply fitted the Yoko I provided them with Back in Sept I put in two 185 in the front, and two weeks ago when I got that puncture I didn't even think of checking before doing the same on the rear... The tyre fitters must not have noticed the rubbing when they fitted it, so I only found out when it blew.