General Dented sills - incompetent garage

[Ruckers]

Good evening, I had the misfortune of taking my car to get some new tyres today, the garage (a national chain) have managed to dent the drivers side sill at both the front and back, quite an achievement I thought, still the silver lining I suppose is that that the passenger side seems to have escaped any damage. Needless to say they are denying it was caused by them, but it’s the first time it has been jacked up in my ownership and after examining the photos of when I bought it the sill is quite clearly damage free in these.

I will have to get something done because the paint has been damaged and I don’t want to leave bare metal exposed. Just wondered if anyone knew:
a) is a damaged sill an MOT failure?
b) can a sill dent be pulled out or would it need a new sill?

I’ve attached some photos, the bigger dent is the one at the front.

 

[RalphM]

If it's not rusted through and no sharp edges just dented then it should pass.

 

[murphyv310]

Take it further write to the companies Head office and get the letter signed for. Give them 14 days to reply, make sure that if its not rectified that you'll be talking to Trading Standards.
Include a picture of the damage.

Just as an aside the paint where it's removed doesn't look that fresh, could it have been hit with a brick or something off a passing lorry?

 

[Ruckers]

Take it further write to the companies Head office and get the letter signed for. Give them 14 days to reply, make sure that if its not rectified that you'll be talking to Trading Standards.
Include a picture of the damage.

Just as an aside the paint where it's removed doesn't look that fresh, could it have been hit with a brick or something off a passing lorry?

I don’t recall anything anything hitting it at any point but I suppose it’s possible, I’ve never noticed it before if so, just happened to see it when walking back to the car at the supermarket this afternoon and thought it too much of a coincidence given that it was at the garage this morning, it’s been wet here today and I’ve been down some mucky country lanes so could be why it looks dirty. I did see at the garage they used a thing with four arms to lift the car off the ground completely, presumably so they could do all tyres at once.

The sill was definitely not damaged when I bought the car in June as I still have the photos.

 

[gar074]

Wouldn't surprise me in the least, but you may well have difficulty establishing that they caused the damage.

But if you make a lot of noise they may compensate you just so you go away, so it's probably worth complaining.

 

[lunchbeers]

I've seen this sort of thing happen a bit, normally it's a well-known national with the initials KF....

They seem to employ apes who either don't know or don't care what they're doing and have the nerve to call them professionals.

I would only let them do the Aircon on my cars until one time they didn't put the valve covers back on and they were lost - pretty elementary job.

You won't have much luck claiming I don't think, another one stripped one of the wheel hub threads on my last car and damaged 3 of the 4 recently refurbished wheels.

They paid for a new hub but I had to swallow the damage to the wheels.

 

[jimboy]

If indeed it was KWIKFIT, it’s well known to most, to stay well clear. The horror stories I’ve read and heard are just appalling. In any tyre chain you should write to head office and lay it on thick, you will never use again and tell all my family and friends to stay away if this is the shoddy way they treat customers.

Anyone forced to use somewhere like this, it’s an opportunity to point out undamaged body work before work commences. I’m a cynical old git and think of the worst, I always wait and watch, but the garage I use know me, and of course there’s no hiding place up here.

 

[RalphM]

If it had happened wile driving you would have definitely heard and
felt anything that did that much damage.

 

[KPat]

If indeed it was KWIKFIT, it’s well known to most, to stay well clear. The horror stories I’ve read and heard are just appalling. In any tyre chain you should write to head office and lay it on thick, you will never use again and tell all my family and friends to stay away if this is the shoddy way they treat customers.

Anyone forced to use somewhere like this, it’s an opportunity to point out undamaged body work before work commences. I’m a cynical old git and think of the worst, I always wait and watch, but the garage I use know me, and of course there’s no hiding place up here.

At my local KF they accidentaly drove a disabled adapted car off a raised ramp.

 

[lunchbeers]

I know an ex-kwikfit fitter jack a transit up on its floor pan, and he also fitted a brake pad the wrong way around too.

I got into a barney with one when I accompanied my dad when he thought about taking up their "brake pads for life" offer, despite my objections.

Flat out argued with me about the car in question not having an electronic handbrake, when I know for a fact it does, I've driven it and subsequently changed the brakes myself since.

 

[Herts Hillhopper]

Looking at those photos again, it looks like they used a four wheel lift (the 'scissor type' that rise out of the floor), and didn't check that the rubber lifting blocks were correctly positioned on the far side of the car when they pressed the 'up' buttons... so the blocks have slipped out and run up the side of the sills. That is actually quite frightening, and the fitter would certainly have been very aware of what happened.

As to repair: it shouldn't rust as the whole body shell is fully galvanised. And I can't see that being an MoT failure (although sills are an area of extra rules as a key structural part).

 

[Ruckers]

Well I’ve got quotes from a three reputable body repair shops locally, all pretty similar prices (£240 - £300), the one I’ve gone for has good reviews and they’ll pull out the damage and do the paint local to the damage so not as bad as I thought. I won’t bother trying to complain, as others have said it’ll just be a load of hassle and no guarantee you’d get anywhere with it.

 

[JaffaOrange]

I am booked in at K-F next week. I will warn them before I let them loose on the car. And I will take photos beforehand (on their forecourt).

 

[The Panda Nut]

I have to say the small mark does not look like jacking damage, but the big one does. I would ask a mobile dent specialist as the most economic solution. These guys can work wonders on minor dents.

All 3 of mine have been damaged by bad jacking. The newest at its PDI!!!! I am so sick of the morons who are too lazy to jack the cars correctly. The metal is so thin I straightened the worst affected one with pliers, and wire brushed the worst debris away. A shot of rust proofer with a brush and then stone chip, primer and a rattle can have this one back better than new for £35. I now have a jack pad from ebay. These pads need a 3cm deep slot for Pandas. I now ALWAYS show them the condition of the car before work starts, and let it be known that consequences will be dire should damage be inflicted. As most modern cars are similar you wonder where the muppets got their qualifications from. I have somewhere dry so did a DIY job to fix this. I masked the sprayed edge along a body crease line on the sill and its an invisible repair, except its clearly better than new. Make sure the sill drains are suitably protected from blocking as they are quite slim line.

 

[KPat]

I use a small trolley jack but I never use it under the sills. They are not strong enough. Better to place it under the thick metal of the chassis.

 

[jrkitching]

I use a small trolley jack but I never use it under the sills. They are not strong enough. Better to place it under the thick metal of the chassis.

Absolutely. Jacking it anywhere on the sills, even at the jacking points, risks exactly this kind of damage.

This tells you pretty much all you need to know. It's for the 500, but the 169 Panda is identical and I doubt the new shape one is much different.

I once went into a main dealer showroom specifically to look at the underneath of the sills on brand new cars. All had some minor seam damage caused by lifting during the PDI.

Most 500's/Pandas on the road today will show some minor damage. The OP's case is a particularly bad example, and I'd be seething if that had happened to me.

Some of us here, myself included, would never take the car into a tyre fitting bay; we remove the wheels at home and take them in another vehicle at tyre change time.

 

[jimboy]

Some of us here, myself included, would never take the car into a tyre fitting bay; we remove the wheels at home and take them in another vehicle at tyre change time.

Yes, where ever possible this is what I do especially with my beloved Coupe. I have a preferred garage that I take my daily to but they use trolly jacks in the right places.

 

[FiatMatt94]

This is exactly the reason my Panda doesn't go into any garages apart from going for the MOT which is a Fiat & Alfa specialist run by a very trusted friend of my dads. Servicing & repairs are done on the drive as is regular cleaning & polishing/waxing, Even tyres are done at home with a manual tyre changer as when my dads 131 Mirafiori Sport was on the road he told me about when a tyre fitter was about to jack it up on the floor & had to be told by dad where to jack it up. There are only 3 people I let near the Panda other than myself, My dad who is a mechanic, his Fiat & Alfa specialist mate & a local bodyshop who we also know who knows how fussy I am over my car. The family & mates think I'm a bit obsessive with it as it is always kept clean, very well maintained, has most of the genuine accessories & also quite fussy about where I park it. I don't think they seem to understand that it is the most expensive & only new car I've ever brought & I intend to try & keep it that way

 

[Herts Hillhopper]

Absolutely. Jacking it anywhere on the sills, even at the jacking points, risks exactly this kind of damage.

This tells you pretty much all you need to know. It's for the 500, but the 169 Panda is identical and I doubt the new shape one is much different....

Yup - and that link exactly tallies with the way I jack my Panda -- mine's a 4x4 so plenty of room for the block and the jack I believe these are the places that the dealer are supposed to put the arms of the two post lift into as well.

 

[murphyv310]

I would never jack any car up on sills. I prefer to jack on the front subframe on a substantial place and again the same at the rear. I only use a trolley jack. There is sufficient room under the false floor on the Picasso for trolley jack toolkit, torque wrench and footpump, so very handy indeed.