Christopher31
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Hi I'm looking for some advice on what kind of cold air intake system to get for my 2014 fiat panda 1.2
Technical Cold air intake system
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Technical Cold air intake system
The OEM one pretty much all aftermarket systems do little more then make more noise and any even reduce power a little
Christopher31
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I was told a cold air intake filter is better than just the cone filter I have on the car just now.
You were advise correctly but I would qualify this by saying it also depends on where your cone filter is taking air from.
The colder the air the more dense it is and with the corresponding correct fuelling will produce more power. A simple proof / practical explanation of this is to answer the question "why do turbo cars have intercoolers?"
Another factor/feature that you will find on just about all modern cars is the inlet air path is often long and have resonant chambers (those funny looking 'blobs' attached to the inlet tubing that appear to do nothing other than take up engine compartment space). They are there for a reason.
Think of a church organ or any wind instrument. In the case of an engine the air comes in pulses. These pulse for a frequency note that has to travel along the intake and into the manifold. For intake propulsion/transmission/flow there will be out of tune pulse rates of air flow that can be smoothed out and amplified by introducing a resonance, hence those blind chambers.
If you strip everything back to an old style carb with a top bonnet cold air feed (useless in/for winter running) then you loose all that induction piping and resonant chambers, BUT you will also find that those old style F1 carbs poking out the top of the engine housings actually had "trumpets / velocity stacks" to air/smooth/tune for optimum air flow. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Velocity_stack
Bottom line is that manufacturers do not go to the expense of these complex air intake and filter systems for no reason. Of course one can often improve on production systems but these days you are looking at highly complex air flow testing / dynamometer testing for all environments etc. and just plonking a free flow cone air filter on instead is highly unlikely to be overall beneficial.
https://images.holley.com/300-800v2_02.jpg
If you are looking for a simple bolt on power increase for a 1.2, I might be wrong but I dont think its possible
I have never seen, power curve, printouts For a FIRE engine using simple bolt on tuning, with any increase,
I have seen race tuned FIRE engines, running custom cams and ECUs and costing thousands with increases
The fiat office upgrade from 60hp to 69hp isn't really that noticeable as most of the upgrade is higher up the revs. Making in my opinion a worse driving experience
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As above, unfortunately the newer 1.1/1.2 engines can't be improved much at all.
I miss my old 1.1 Cinquecento, that had the old SPi engine fitted.....an engine that you could actually play with.
"Tricker" throttle body, 866 cam, bigger injector, "Mckrich" chip soldered on to the ECU, Magnex stainless exhaust......it went like a rocket!
Unfortunately with the newer multi point injection engines, there's nothing much you can do.
Best thing to do is keep the standard air box, and fit a high flow air filter designed for the original box.
I miss my old 1.1 Cinquecento, that had the old SPi engine fitted.....an engine that you could actually play with.
"Tricker" throttle body, 866 cam, bigger injector, "Mckrich" chip soldered on to the ECU, Magnex stainless exhaust......it went like a rocket!
Unfortunately with the newer multi point injection engines, there's nothing much you can do.
Best thing to do is keep the standard air box, and fit a high flow air filter designed for the original box.
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The OEM air intake has more than enough surface area to do the job. Compare the throttle body diameter to the air intake diameter. Gas flow for a given pressure increases 16 times when the pipe diameter is doubled.
All Pandas have a cold air intake from the front grille adjacent to the headlight.
All Pandas have a cold air intake from the front grille adjacent to the headlight.
Exactly.
And on any car with butterfly valve throttle control, changing the induction will have absolutely no effect on power except when running with the throttle wide open, which in normal driving, is almost never.
The easiest and cheapest way to get a little more performance and flexibility from the 1.2 is to run on super unleaded fuel (preferably one of the ethanol-free blends, if you can still find it). It won't make a huge difference, but on the Euro4 engine at least, the difference is definitely there; it's particularly noticeable when on an uphill gradient at low rpm with a modest throttle opening.
On supermarket E10, the 1.2 Panda is a slug.
Talking of throttle size/are vs intake reminds me of the Strada Abarth.
For those not familiar with the setup is had two twin 40s (4 x 40 mm throttles). Each is fitted with a nice red trumpet (which you never see) and a big all enclosing 3 part air box. The air box has a huge top mounted panel filter.
The picture below shows the general setup BUT note the red surround to that panel filter. This is the remains of the airbox top cover which had an integral steel tube from the LHS (as viewed in pic) extending down to behind the headlights.
Now the really odd thing is that the tube intake aperture was LESS THAN or just about 40mm in diameter. So you have 4 x 40mm being fed by a 1 x 40mm. Now not all 4 cylinders are on simultaneous intakes strokes so in theory you don't need 4 x 40 equivalent inlet aperture but that then begs the question of why have 4 individual throttle intakes
I can vouch that the original airbox did not massively hamper the apparent performance BUT the mod you see did make a small difference on full bore on the track.
However the mod was done for a completely different reason as we expensively found out and other 130TC owners have found out. The top of the airbox top cover extended above the top of the front cross member and into the bonnet recess. When the engine rocked/twisted (despite the two stabiliser bars one of which you can see running at 45 degrees from the end of the block to the inner front wing) the airbox top lid would hit (just) the underside of the bonnet. End result after time is the thick cold pressed back plate, with a lower support arm back to the block, would fracture and not the whole of the heavy airbox and carbs would hang, vibrate and bounce of the steel-rubber-steel heat insulating adapter plates resulting in the splitting of the rubber.
Back in the 80s each of the of these plates were £80+VAT each. Worse still to replace them was a right royal pain and long job. Also the carbs would need setting up again.
You could improve the top clearance by removing some of the under bonnet sound insulation and by raising the bonnet line but the raised height/line just did not look and sit well with the wings and front grille.
I still have the original full airbox top cover safely stored away so nothing has been lost.
For those not familiar with the setup is had two twin 40s (4 x 40 mm throttles). Each is fitted with a nice red trumpet (which you never see) and a big all enclosing 3 part air box. The air box has a huge top mounted panel filter.
The picture below shows the general setup BUT note the red surround to that panel filter. This is the remains of the airbox top cover which had an integral steel tube from the LHS (as viewed in pic) extending down to behind the headlights.
Now the really odd thing is that the tube intake aperture was LESS THAN or just about 40mm in diameter. So you have 4 x 40mm being fed by a 1 x 40mm. Now not all 4 cylinders are on simultaneous intakes strokes so in theory you don't need 4 x 40 equivalent inlet aperture but that then begs the question of why have 4 individual throttle intakes
I can vouch that the original airbox did not massively hamper the apparent performance BUT the mod you see did make a small difference on full bore on the track.
However the mod was done for a completely different reason as we expensively found out and other 130TC owners have found out. The top of the airbox top cover extended above the top of the front cross member and into the bonnet recess. When the engine rocked/twisted (despite the two stabiliser bars one of which you can see running at 45 degrees from the end of the block to the inner front wing) the airbox top lid would hit (just) the underside of the bonnet. End result after time is the thick cold pressed back plate, with a lower support arm back to the block, would fracture and not the whole of the heavy airbox and carbs would hang, vibrate and bounce of the steel-rubber-steel heat insulating adapter plates resulting in the splitting of the rubber.
Back in the 80s each of the of these plates were £80+VAT each. Worse still to replace them was a right royal pain and long job. Also the carbs would need setting up again.
You could improve the top clearance by removing some of the under bonnet sound insulation and by raising the bonnet line but the raised height/line just did not look and sit well with the wings and front grille.
I still have the original full airbox top cover safely stored away so nothing has been lost.
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Myusername
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I would definitely just replace it with the standard trunking.
As has been said manufacturers don't fit components for nothing, and the idea that the man on the street can do a better job than the manufacturer usually exists only in the mind of the owner.
I had a car a couple of years back where the intake trunking has been thrown away. This meant the remaining fixing was sucking air in from near the exhaust manifold, and in warmer weather the engine stumbled and coughed especially in traffic. It was surprisingly difficult to find replacement parts because "everyone chucks them mate, just a nuisance."
But it made a significant difference when they were replaced - a smoother happier engine!
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The original airbox is the best solution I've seen for the Panda since it draws cold air from the gap in the bonnet as DaveMcT said above. A better filter should help marginally, and you can remove the baffles/strakes if present in the intake housing - these muffle noise (especially noticeable when on a motorway) but restrict airflow. Some grills also have strakes heavily obstructing the cold air piping - these can be removed to help the engine breathe easier.
as a general rule
If the original manufacture could gain a few BHP by enlarging the filter adding a few pence of paper and plastic they would
there are a few exceptions such as some Vauxhalls detuned by Lotus. But it normally doesn't take long for people to realise it can be derestricted and post before and after power curves
Occasionally a manufacturer will sell the same car but at two different power outputs. Again it doesn't take long for people to realise. Take the same minis with two different maps. Within weeks people were offering a remap service
since 2003 I haven't seen such a service for the Panda. I wouldn't go as far as it couldn't be done, but I haven't seen anything I would consider ..........................................yet
If the original manufacture could gain a few BHP by enlarging the filter adding a few pence of paper and plastic they would
there are a few exceptions such as some Vauxhalls detuned by Lotus. But it normally doesn't take long for people to realise it can be derestricted and post before and after power curves
Occasionally a manufacturer will sell the same car but at two different power outputs. Again it doesn't take long for people to realise. Take the same minis with two different maps. Within weeks people were offering a remap service
since 2003 I haven't seen such a service for the Panda. I wouldn't go as far as it couldn't be done, but I haven't seen anything I would consider ..........................................yet
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VW were notorious for this with their TDI engines. The 110 was fitted to higher spec cars for considerably more money. But the 90 would chip to 110 and the 110 would go to 140. The 140 could go to 175, but frankly 140 bhp was all the front wheel drive could handle.
I had a Sharan 90 (Ford Galaxy with different front grille plastic). It was slooow, but it's a vans so whatever. But I eventually got fed up and had it chipped. Power went up and fuel consumption went down. The car averaged 32/33mpg before and 37/38 after AND I was using that new mid-range grunt.
