Technical Tweeters

[spannerdude]

I've just recommissioned my 96 Barchetta after 8 years! off the road. After welding and brakes and the various mechanical bits that needed overhaul I've started to tackle the dreaded trim parts.

One of the tweeters had a broken mount, so I ordered a salvaged pair off the bay of E. Of course the seller neglected to mention that one of those was broken too! So in order to return my now two broken tweeters to the ever diminishing pool of parts in the world, I made some new mountings.

20220516_200524_crop.jpg

• spannerdude
• May 22, 2022
• tweeter mount

20220516_200546_crop.jpg

• spannerdude
• May 22, 2022
• tweeter mount

20220516_200605_crop.jpg

• spannerdude
• May 22, 2022

20220522_121205_copy.jpg

• spannerdude
• May 22, 2022
• tweeter mount

20220522_121305_copy.jpg

• spannerdude
• May 22, 2022
• tweeter mount

I'm happy with that.

 

[Wiltshire Chris]

Excellent work, have you uploaded the CAD files anywhere? I don't recognize the design package you've used so I'm interested in that too as I try to improve my 3D design skills

 

[tjr]

Very impressed!

I've been standing on the sideline, with itchy fingers, concerning 3D-printing. Love the small scale aspect. Took some early CAD/CAM classes last millennia, and a couple of years back built a cabin using Sketchup with the massivholzmauer.de concept (CAM-manufactured massive wood walls based on layers of alu-nailed grooved boards). Made a peristaltic pump w Arduino-boards some years back, thanks to the Arduino Community uploaded program snippets.

Do you @spannerdude and @Wiltshire Chris have any recommendations concerning software, affordable(?) robust 3D-printers and what materials to use?

Panagiotis Boudaniotis‎ and Jonathan Lo Re have made b businesses out of it (I recently bought some soft top silicone gaskets from PG, that so far is keeping the water out). JLR is on the road to making spoilers for the b.

The 3D printing marketplaces sound excellent in theory, I wonder how they work in real life. It would be cool to be able to upload, download, and have printed different parts for the b with some suitable trade/exchange/gift system...!

 

[Wiltshire Chris]

Do you @spannerdude and @Wiltshire Chris have any recommendations concerning software, affordable(?) robust 3D-printers and what materials to use?

The 3D printing marketplaces sound excellent in theory, I wonder how they work in real life. It would be cool to be able to upload, download, and have printed different parts for the b with some suitable trade/exchange/gift system...!

I bought the Ender 3 Pro two years ago and have upgraded it with a silent mainboard (the stock one is very noisy), BLTouch for bed levelling and a better bed. I've enjoyed using it to to print off a few fun things and also to make odd parts for projects I'm working on. I've been happy with the Ender 3 but I've heard it said that while it starts off inexpensive, by the time you've added all the upgrades you could have bought a Prusa. I mostly print in PLA which is good enough for trim pieces or pieces that you can't see but, due to the nature of home printing, there may be some finishing required to get a presentable item.

I don't have a lot of experience in 3D design. I started out using TinkerCad because it was easy to use and reminded me of SketchUp. I've lately switched to OpenSCAD as the programmatic way of designing things works with my programmer's brain and also works well with using GIT for version control so I can wind back changes. It also makes it easy to share the design. I suspect it might be harder to handle complex designs which is why I'm intersted in what @spannerdude used.

As regards marketplaces I'm quite happy to upload any of my designs to github or thingiverse for people to use as they wish but I can see that if you had put a lot of work into a design you might want to get some money back on that time. In an ideal world we would build up a library of 3D designs for parts that the manufacturer no longer makes but I can see legal and financial difficulties with that dream.

 

[tjr]

Thanks for the feedback @Wiltshire Chris! Thank you kindly also for sharing your b-design
Looking forward to what @spannerdude might share on (I believe) onshape.

 

[spannerdude]

Hi Guys,
I use Fusion 360. I'm on page 4 of "teach Yourself Fusion 360" having graduated through Tinkercad.
The most salient advice I can give about 3D printing is this: 3D printing is a great way of making physical objects that look like something useful.
The fundamental problem with 3D printing is that the properties of the material, be it any of the plastic filaments or resins are not the same as even those same materials used in other manufacturing processes.
For example, an object made using ABS through FDM process will not be as strong as the same object injection molded in ABS. That comment will have 3D printing fanboys crying into their Marvel Action figures but facts don't care about your feelings.
To go even a small way to negating this problem you have to: a) Change your design philosophy b) Cough up for exotic materials c) Prototype, test, repeat d) All of the above.

I have both an FDM printer and a resin printer. This item was printed in resin. Resins are very brittle, even if you stump up for what they laughably describe as "ABS-Like" resin. So I pay £65+ a kilo for an exotic product which is particularly tough.

I don't generally share my designs for a number of reasons. I'm self employed and thanks to the U.N.'s recent attempt at global domination I'm now broke. Open Source is just a way of giving away anything useful to the CCP. And having shared work in the past only to find shonkilly made versions damaging my reputation on fleabay etc. I am very much of the opinion that the way forward is to produce quality items that are fit for sale and sell them myself for a reasonable profit but fair price.

As I said, I am a novice at Fusion 360 so I probably made a meal of it but I have got about 8 hours in this design. Even at minimum wage it's never going to pay for itself. But if I can recoup some of my time I have 6 hungry FIAT's and their cousins to feed!

 

[tjr]

Hi Guys,
I use Fusion 360. I'm on page 4 of "teach Yourself Fusion 360" having graduated through Tinkercad.

Cool, thanks.

The most salient advice I can give about 3D printing is this: 3D printing is a great way of making physical objects that look like something useful.
The fundamental problem with 3D printing is that the properties of the material, be it any of the plastic filaments or resins are not the same as even those same materials used in other manufacturing processes.
For example, an object made using ABS through FDM process will not be as strong as the same object injection molded in ABS. That comment will have 3D printing fanboys crying into their Marvel Action figures but facts don't care about your feelings.
To go even a small way to negating this problem you have to: a) Change your design philosophy b) Cough up for exotic materials c) Prototype, test, repeat d) All of the above.

I have both an FDM printer and a resin printer. This item was printed in resin. Resins are very brittle, even if you stump up for what they laughably describe as "ABS-Like" resin. So I pay £65+ a kilo for an exotic product which is particularly tough.

Sounds like further product development is needed!
Perhaps a CNC router might assist where 3D printing falls short...?

I don't generally share my designs for a number of reasons. I'm self employed and thanks to the U.N.'s recent attempt at global domination I'm now broke. Open Source is just a way of giving away anything useful to the CCP. And having shared work in the past only to find shonkilly made versions damaging my reputation on fleabay etc. I am very much of the opinion that the way forward is to produce quality items that are fit for sale and sell them myself for a reasonable profit but fair price.

I won't pretend to understand it all (U.N. attempt at global domination, CCP (Chinese Communist Party?), shonkilly), but it seems you've had your share of hard knocks! Sorry to hear about them.
I agree, when needed, charging a price for an item or drawing is perfectly respectable (that's how I got my silicone soft top kit).

As I said, I am a novice at Fusion 360 so I probably made a meal of it but I have got about 8 hours in this design. Even at minimum wage it's never going to pay for itself. But if I can recoup some of my time I have 6 hungry FIAT's and their cousins to feed!

That would indeed become a rather expensive part, but perhaps the cost of R&D can divided up over a number of sold items/drawings, and with time drawing speed will improve. I believe this is ONE way forward for our old timers full of ageing plastic parts (I don't know if you have experienced it, but the -95 b that I'm trying to tend to is having the rubber protectors, around the sensors in the engine bay, are falling apart. It would be nice to find replacements for those!).

 

[Wiltshire Chris]

I use Fusion 360. I'm on page 4 of "teach Yourself Fusion 360" having graduated through Tinkercad.

Thank you - I'll take a look. What you came up with looks excellent for something you've just started with

I don't generally share my designs for a number of reasons. I'm self employed and thanks to the U.N.'s recent attempt at global domination I'm now broke. Open Source is just a way of giving away anything useful to the CCP. And having shared work in the past only to find shonkilly made versions damaging my reputation on fleabay etc. I am very much of the opinion that the way forward is to produce quality items that are fit for sale and sell them myself for a reasonable profit but fair price.

As @tjr says, sorry to hear of your problems. I'm no huge open source zealot and spent my entire working career programming closed source software. As a point of interest the design for the trim piece I uploaded to Thingiverse has been downloaded about 90 times. I don't for one minute believe that 90 Barchetta owners have decided to print off that bit of trim. Rather someone is just blanket downloading anything new. Maybe that's so they can show it on their site, maybe someone is scanning all new designs so they can see if they can make money out of them, I don't know.
I completely understand you wanting to keep control of the process, if you've a reutation to defend that's just sensible. I'm in the fortunate position that fiddling with these things is just a hobby for me and so sharing them, so far, has not been an issue.

 

[tjr]

I'm no huge open source zealot and spent my entire working career programming closed source software. As a point of interest the design for the trim piece I uploaded to Thingiverse has been downloaded about 90 times. I don't for one minute believe that 90 Barchetta owners have decided to print off that bit of trim. Rather someone is just blanket downloading anything new. Maybe that's so they can show it on their site, maybe someone is scanning all new designs so they can see if they can make money out of them, I don't know.
I completely understand you wanting to keep control of the process, if you've a reutation to defend that's just sensible. I'm in the fortunate position that fiddling with these things is just a hobby for me and so sharing them, so far, has not been an issue.

Thank you both for the reality check (being naive at my age is no longer very attractive..). Same here, my profession is far from this field, so it's easy being an idealist in search of utopia.

 

[ernibv]

I've just recommissioned my 96 Barchetta after 8 years! off the road. After welding and brakes and the various mechanical bits that needed overhaul I've started to tackle the dreaded trim parts.

One of the tweeters had a broken mount, so I ordered a salvaged pair off the bay of E. Of course the seller neglected to mention that one of those was broken too! So in order to return my now two broken tweeters to the ever diminishing pool of parts in the world, I made some new mountings.

20220516_200524_crop.jpg

• spannerdude
• May 22, 2022
• tweeter mount

20220516_200546_crop.jpg

• spannerdude
• May 22, 2022
• tweeter mount

20220516_200605_crop.jpg

• spannerdude
• May 22, 2022

20220522_121205_copy.jpg

• spannerdude
• May 22, 2022
• tweeter mount

20220522_121305_copy.jpg

• spannerdude
• May 22, 2022
• tweeter mount

I'm happy with that.

I think this is a very interesting topic !
A few years ago I bought and built a Velleman 3D printer. What a great device! Since the design was open source, I could print my own modification parts. Very sci-fi. Beautiful finished products.
The problem was my patience and design abilities. So I sold it
I'm thinking that for our application and information exchange a 3D scanner might be a good idea.
I just downloaded Polyscan for my iPhone. I don't have the newest model with Lidar.
A good scan of a part makes explanation easier, and an export to .obj or .stl leaves the rest up to anyone who wants to experiment with their printer. I am running a test now using my pocket-knife. I will post progress and results.
grtz
Eric

 

[ernibv]

I've just recommissioned my 96 Barchetta after 8 years! off the road. After welding and brakes and the various mechanical bits that needed overhaul I've started to tackle the dreaded trim parts.

One of the tweeters had a broken mount, so I ordered a salvaged pair off the bay of E. Of course the seller neglected to mention that one of those was broken too! So in order to return my now two broken tweeters to the ever diminishing pool of parts in the world, I made some new mountings.

20220516_200524_crop.jpg

• spannerdude
• May 22, 2022
• tweeter mount

20220516_200546_crop.jpg

• spannerdude
• May 22, 2022
• tweeter mount

20220516_200605_crop.jpg

• spannerdude
• May 22, 2022

20220522_121205_copy.jpg

• spannerdude
• May 22, 2022
• tweeter mount

20220522_121305_copy.jpg

• spannerdude
• May 22, 2022
• tweeter mount

I'm happy with that.

Very nicely done! A comment and a question: A friend tried this sort of repair with a 3D Printer Pen. Built up some material and then cut it back to size. His repair was successful. Do you think this is a viable solution to broken clips, etc ?
grtz
ER

 

[tjr]

I think this is a very interesting topic !
A few years ago I bought and built a Velleman 3D printer. What a great device! Since the design was open source, I could print my own modification parts. Very sci-fi. Beautiful finished products.
The problem was my patience and design abilities. So I sold it
I'm thinking that for our application and information exchange a 3D scanner might be a good idea.
I just downloaded Polyscan for my iPhone. I don't have the newest model with Lidar.
A good scan of a part makes explanation easier, and an export to .obj or .stl leaves the rest up to anyone who wants to experiment with their printer. I am running a test now using my pocket-knife. I will post progress and results.
grtz
Eric

Cool, excellent idea! I couldn’t find Polyscan in the Swedish version of AppStore, but I found Polycam. If available for you, are they similar? Supposedly the latter is also able so save in the two formats you mentioned. I just downloaded it to check it out. Without knowing it I do have LiDAR on my phone. I wonder how clean the scans come out. Maybe jumping to far ahead, but if functional perhaps, we could have a scan section on the forum…?!

 

[ernibv]

Cool, excellent idea! I couldn’t find Polyscan in the Swedish version of AppStore, but I found Polycam. If available for you, are they similar? Supposedly the latter is also able so save in the two formats you mentioned. I just downloaded it to check it out. Without knowing it I do have LiDAR on my phone. I wonder how clean the scans come out. Maybe jumping to far ahead, but if functional perhaps, we could have a scan section on the forum…?!

My Fault: Polycam is correct. Also looking at Photogrammerty. For serious conversion to .slt this looks like the best choice.
LiDAR on your iPhone is the clue to the best scan.
As far as I am: scan with Polycam and upload. Then login to the Polycam site to find you scan. This offers the possibility to edit and download in 12 different formats.
Photogrammerty is a whole different quality. It also requires downloading 4 different (free) programs. The clue seems to be that you measure first as accurately as possible; then scan. Accurate to 0.5 % ?
Maybe a place to park scans on the site? I'd make a contribution to expand disk space. There would have to be some rules and limits. These are big files.
.Let's try to get members scanning parts? I have a thermostat and sensor I can try tomorrow. Add a part number and this could be very interesting.