General temperature guage on mpi sei. quries and opinions?

[randomizered]

I really fancy fitting a temp guage after my "oh crap" light came on and the coolant was boiling in the expansion tank after a journey a few months ago.

I have an MPI Sei and from my extensive reading on the forum, most of it dealing with SPI, I think I have sussed out some stuff but want to check first.

Firstly, I'm looking at THIS unit as the price is good, and comes complete with wiring/sender etc. i just need to add a pod, total comes in at about £24 compared to demon tweaks where all the stuff comes to over £60. Worth the risk I think, but would like an opinion on the guage if at all possible.



Now to the technical stuff lol

I belive there is the fan switch in the radiator (on/off) and another switch around the oil filler on the engine (not that i can find it) that is another on/off switch that sends a signal to the ecu.

I'd have to keep those i pressume (and its that via the ecu that triggers the led??) as I would like the led dash to work still.

That means the only way i can fit it is to get a t section to fit into the cooling system?? Or get a modified sump plug to measure the oil temp.

On a cinq, is the temp guage measuring block temperature, water temp , or oil temp?? Which would be be best.

I also read that near the ecu sender (which i can't find), that there is the moulding where another sender used to be fitted.....would it be possible to drill it, tap it, and fit a sender? I guess that would need engine dis-assembly to prevent swarf in the whatever the sender measures, cooling/oil.


Any ideas or pointers to the above would be most appreciated

Kristian

 

[fingers99]

I've no idea how good that guage is or how reliable the suppliers are.

Usually the primary temperature guage on a water cooled engine measures the water temperature. Measuring the oil temperature is a good idea, but comes later.

Keep the original senders and their wiring intact. Run the wiring for your new guage independently. IIRC most water temperature senders are mounted in a housing in what is effectively the top radiator hose. Your local friendly engineer (given an old top hose cut off a scrapper and the sender which comes with the new unit) should be able to knock a suitable fitting up. You'll just have to chop the (good, existing) top hose and insert it.

 

[randomizered]

the guage looks exactly the same as one by a uk seller, but with a diferent make, for £15 more, its worth a bash I'm not fussed about the reliability of the seller, but as long as the part itself isn't total* tosh, I'll give it a go.

Water temperature then eh? I was sure the Cinq measured from a mounting in the engine block...but i guess i can follow your advice and get section modified, or buy an add in adapter.

You are right, i didn't want to mess with the original sensors, in case what i do is wrong lol.

would you typically find a difference in oil temp and water temp? Is there an advantage of monitoring oil temp in a road car? 'casue if i get a pod now, i depends wether i get a one or two dial.

Cheers for your help

Kristian


/edit tosh lol, not sure where that word came from lol

 

[AppleSei]

I have an MPI Sei and from my extensive reading on the forum, most of it dealing with SPI, I think I have sussed out some stuff but want to check first.

A search of the forum threads would have brought up information regarding fitting of a temp guage to an MPI sei, which was done by mintysport

https://www.fiatforum.com/cinq-sei-styling/28760-temp-guage.html?highlight=temp+gauge+sei

https://www.fiatforum.com/cinq-sei-...seicento-2.html?highlight=seicento+temp+guage

The second one brings up links of previous posts relating to MPI seis

 

[randomizered]

I read a load of threads on here, those you linked to and the links from those...Mintysport seemed to end with problems ready their temperature, using and additional section in the cooling line, and no one else seems to have done it.

fingers99 answered the one I think. The cinq guage measures the coolant temperature, so that is what i will measure, rather than oil temperature, but don't want to have an overly high reading like Mintysport had.

I know i can get the t-section and fit it in line with the system. But I was wondering if there is anywhere else in the engine i can fit the guuage. I can't find the warning light sensor at all on my engine, so can't tell if there is a blanked out hole, i could drill and tap, to fit one in the block. The sensor in the block readds the coolant temperature in the block??

Cheers for your help,

Kristian

 

[randomizered]

Well, after hunting, I found the Temperature sender for the warning light I think, see the attatched picture

I couldn't find the other sensor, which i heard may be behing the oil filler, I took a pic looking from the rear of the engine? See anything that may be it??


Think the ECU or car will comlain if i remove the old sender?? and fit in a new one thats only connected to temp gauge?? I shouldn't imagine it would give problems, just get no warning light??

That sensor is only to do with the light I think?! lamda etc, are the ones that affect combustion etc?

Just want to check becuase i don't want to trigger another fault on my ECU lol


Cheers for any tips

Kristian

//EDIT
If i have to link up into the cooling system, would it be best to use the large coolant outlet from the engine, seen just below the right coil pack??

 

[mandrbarrett]

Check this out

http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/Raid-Hp-52mm-...4QQihZ012QQcategoryZ72215QQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem

You will need to confirm the radiator hose size, but the company that sells it makes many sizes so one should fit. I think other companies sell the same thing too so check prices first.

The only thing you need to check is that the size of your sender unit matches the tapping in the adapter block. I suggest buying the gauge first and then when you know the tapping size of the sender make sure that you buy the appropriate adapter block.

I would not bother with oil temp gauge unless your engine is heavily modded. It will be very different to water temp, and that is fine, normal water temp 90 +-5 deg, normal oil temp 100 +-30 deg.

It is much more difficult to fit an oil temperature sensor, purely for reasons of practicality, whereas the water hoses are very visible and it only takes ten minutes to cut and fit the above adaptor.

Mark.

 

[randomizered]

Cheers mark

I have seen those on eBay, and also demon tweeks sell some. It is the route i willl take, but i am hoping i can remove the warning light sender, and just fit it in its place, will save time, money and hassle

If i do go the coolant route, then I will get one of those in the correct size. You think the main coolant outlet from the engine is the best place if I fit it?


I will ahve the gauge and sender in a few days (from hong kong), and I am sure it fits that adapter. It looks exactly the same as the raid hp gauge (the brand of that adapter you linked to) but it has a different brand name (auto guarage). I guess they are the same unit though.

I think I will gove the oil a miss. I can get a sump adapter, but i don't think its really worth it.

Cheers for your help


Kristian

 

[mandrbarrett]

water output of the engine is ideal.

Remember that if the sensor is after the thermostat you aren't reading engine temperature until the thermostat is open.


Mark.

 

[randomizered]

haha, yeah, i hadn't considered that at all. May make for an interesting jump in reported temperature

Kristian

 

[arc]

slightly concerned here.. that sensor you've highlighted isnt the overheat sensor i don't think. il confess to not knowing the MPI engines anywhere near as well as the SPI, but over that end of the engine i'd expect that to be the ECU's coolant temperature sensor. Don't mess with it. Leave it exactly as it is!

The Oh **** light should be triggered from a sensor on the head. Cam belt end, on the back of the engine. This is the case with the SPI engines, and also the MPI Mk1 Punto - i don't see why it would've been moved.

 

[randomizered]

LOL, I heard where the senser should be, near the cam cover, the other end of the engine, I've looked but couldn't see it! So i had a hunt about the engine and stumbled across that one, so pressumed that was it. I pressume your right though, and it's not the right one......I'll have another look this morning, hopefully i was being blind the last time

Kristian

 

[bassy-alex]

Have you done this yet?

Im really wanting to get some type of temp gauge in my mpi sei, but dont really know howto!

Cheers...

Alex.

 

[randomizered]

Yep, I'll do a quick howto tonight, been meaning to for ages but never got round to it. Prob be ready by tommorrow

Kristian

 

[bassy-alex]

If you read this beofre you do the howto, could you just outline a quick shopping list? I get ordering some bits :yum: !

CHeers!!!

Alex.

 

[col7104]

Funny you should ask about this lol, I've been out in the garage doing mine after taking delivery of my gauges today lol. Here's pics so far, not finished yet.

Where the holes come so close to the sides, it's weakened, so I think I need to remake the panel, then again it's supported from behind via some ridges that were already in the moulding (very conveniently). Some fibreglass/glue to hold it in from behind and to strenghten. I will then maybe smooth the MDF into the plastic moulding with filler then go over with matt black paint.

 

[bassy-alex]

Nice - i cant wait to do mine now!

 

[randomizered]

52mm Temperature gauage
Guage POD/Housing
Temperature sender (often included with the gauge)
Cable
Jubbile clips (~32mm diameter) x 3
Engine coolant
Distilled water
PTFE/Teflon tape
30mm coolant hose adapter

And while your at it and fancy doing a FULL flush, you'll also need:

Paper Gasket
Gasket Sealant


Thats the list of all the bits you'll need i think

 

[randomizered]

My guide is up!

HERE

Hope its usefull

Kristian

 

[col7104]

Well I remade that board. The reason why it was bending and weakening at the thin points was because the vents are rounded. So I sawed a slot in the middle of the board going from top to bottom, about halfway through the material. Put it over a boiling kettle and bent the board on the cut. Then when I offered it up to the vents it looked like it was made to measure! Well actually, it was

For the temp sender, I'm using the sender that came with the gauge, and putting it where the standard sender is (with a thread adaptor as this sender unit is smaller). I won't need a red light as I'll have the gauge. I took this advice from Peter (GSR) who said that taking the reading from somewhere like the coolant pipe will not give a real indication of the temp in the head.

Just finished fibreglassing it in (jeeeeez, I never knew fibreglass was quite that strong, or set quite so fast, or got quite so hot!). Tomorrow I'll have a look at what to do for the next step. For now, here's some pics.